Member Info for grouchomarx

So in fact with paying 5 million to creditors we're freed of 21 million in debt. Sounds good to me. And we'll get the 15 million pound that NAV invested in the Abu Dhabi subsidiary and give them 3.75 million Assetco shares in return (current value 75,000 GBP. Seems like a good deal. I think the creditors will go for it. Remains the question: how many shares are the investors group going to get for investing 12.5 million? Exciting times.

Dare to tell the lady? lol I've added too today. Will add more if I'm convinced AVI (dedicated seller) is no longer putting pressure on sp.

THAT was NOT an option! lol

No problem. I think you're right about people on this BB not being in this for the long haul. Frankly, I think I'm not, because I can see a take over short term. Guess I'll have to settle for a 400% profit short term then. lol

1.000 pounds. The guy's got no money. 3 options: He can commit suicide leaving you with nothing. He loans an another 100 pound from you, promising not to commit suicide (still leaving you with nothing). He can get his legacy uncle to give him some money, paying you 250 pounds promising to leave you alone for the rest of your live. I think I would go for the first option. NOT. Maybe the second then.... lol

First we have to make sure there is a future. :) I do not really think about that. But I take it it won't be a problem once asto is financially sound. Don't think they have to knock on the current bankers door, but they'll find it. I do sincerely believe though that asto will be taken over once the financial reorganization is behind us and it will not be our problem anymore.

It's all about sharing the pain. Without an agreement (equity injection) the creditors will be left with nothing. It's 25 million or nothing. In theory creditors can solve the problem themselves. But: it would ask for more money to put at risk and they have to get organized and involved in asto. I can see some pretty barriers here. It's not that equity investors get a big profit out of this. In the end they've lost also. They do not get back what they have invested initially. Everybody is a loser here. Question is will they (shareholders, creditorss) will lose everything that's left or can they get to an arrangement that will still give some return?

selling pressure from AVI. I can't be bothered. In hindsight they were wrong buying asto at 60p,100p (?) thinking they were right. They can be wrong now selling at 2p+ (thinking that they're right "again"). It's not their money, it's others people money and it's easy writing off others people money. Too often this kind of selling is irrational, emotionally biased (don't want to be confronted with bad decisions, get it out of the books [system]. I've seen it happen a lot of times.... (Could be a last tree shake as well, who knows)

humble opinions. lol They rarely are....

That would make sense was referring to the 10p t/o. (I do agree on the calculations being hypothetical [some refuse to see that and read otherwise..limited.....).

That would make sense (and as we both know very well we've based our calculations on the liability part only).

I do not have any idea. All I've done now is trying to make up if it's worth the 'risk' to buy at 2p. I think that under the circumstances 2p is too low a price. Not many will buy now but will be lining up to buy at 4p+ later in the game.

Exactly (5 million current marketcap makes 1p + 18.4 improvement= 19.4p). Okay by me. :) Now let's talk about the plus that will bring us the take over offer lol!

7 million improvement from benefit of preference swap + 10 million from new issue + 75 million benefit from creditors agreement =>92 million improvement. 92 million/500 million => +18.4p each share.

Almost. :) The 17 million improvement would then be divided by 500 million (250 million 'old' + 250 million 'new' shares) imo.

A very valid observation. But to be frank the liabilities will not be reduced by 15 million as the preference shares were recognized for 7 million as liabilities and for 8 million as equity. But not really important.... What's important is that the preference shareholders wouldn't except a higher placing price for them then the ordinary shareholders. Very good point.

are of a negative or sceptic nature. In the past I have often experienced that the best time to pick shares up (but DYOR).

In march 2011 the investors group committed themselves to take up newly issued shares at 10p for a period of twelve months. A lot has happened since then. Very true. One of them being that the creditors will -as far as we know now- get paid 25 million for the 100 million debt. Sharesholders will benefit from that as equity improves with 75 million. Currently there are 250 million issued shares issued. If the placing price is 10p then the investors group will get 100 million newly issued shares in return for the 10 million equity injection. The investors group will benefit (via the newly issue shares) from the raise in equity of 75 million (due to the creditors agreement) for 100/350 part, being -roughly- 21 million (=75 x 100/350). So for providing 10 million new equity at a 10p price (which they committed themselves to only a couple of months ago) they'll get rewarded with a raise in equity of 21 million. Instantly turning 10 million into 21 million does look like a rather good deal. Mind you, the investors group will only take up the newly issued shares if (when?) an agreement with the creditors has been reached. Besides that as the investor group currently allready hold at least 160 million shares out of the 250 million (didn't bother to look that up), there's very little need to dillute the hell out of it all as there's not that much to gain for them. (That would be very different if they were currently holding 10 million share or so). Is a 10p placing possible? I think so.

The same as everywhere where fanatic extremists show up!

and doesn't even realize it......