The latest Investing Matters Podcast with Jean Roche, Co-Manager of Schroder UK Mid Cap Investment Trust has just been released. Listen here.
London South East prides itself on its community spirit, and in order to keep the chat section problem free, we ask all members to follow these simple rules. In these rules, we refer to ourselves as "we", "us", "our". The user of the website is referred to as "you" and "your".
By posting on our share chat boards you are agreeing to the following:
The IP address of all posts is recorded to aid in enforcing these conditions. As a user you agree to any information you have entered being stored in a database. You agree that we have the right to remove, edit, move or close any topic or board at any time should we see fit. You agree that we have the right to remove any post without notice. You agree that we have the right to suspend your account without notice.
Please note some users may not behave properly and may post content that is misleading, untrue or offensive.
It is not possible for us to fully monitor all content all of the time but where we have actually received notice of any content that is potentially misleading, untrue, offensive, unlawful, infringes third party rights or is potentially in breach of these terms and conditions, then we will review such content, decide whether to remove it from this website and act accordingly.
Premium Members are members that have a premium subscription with London South East. You can subscribe here.
London South East does not endorse such members, and posts should not be construed as advice and represent the opinions of the authors, not those of London South East Ltd, or its affiliates.
Well said wiz, eu...the ones who said they didn't ban dredging....they just wouldn't give a "lysonce" (thank you clousoe) to do it).......let's get on with everything now...p.s.......I think Surrey c.c. may still be "European 's".....next on the list boys.....'ave it!
If the company would give more information as to what these various new ventures involve in terms of the current sites, new sites, costs and expertise, rather than just mentioning these were things they were evaluating. Anyone can look at a lot of things they can't afford or aren't able to do.
But if all it is is:- 'we are actively evaluating the addition of 250 kW of photovoltaic solar power and 100 kW of battery storage to reduce site energy consumption, CO2 emissions and operating costs, further underpinning long term site economic value and reducing greenhouse gas emissions. Alongside this we have also invested in a scoping study aimed at cogeneration and standalone geothermal energy at Horse Hill.' then although a worthy objective it isn't exactly likely to be transformational unless they're planning a couple of 5km wells (£?mm).
Then it would be possible to understand how realistic (or even what) these objectives are.
Not that long ago HH was going to be producing power for the grid from gas to wire, now are they generating enough to partially power the site if they are considering some solar?
Looking at the July 2021 Corporate Presentation (presumably touted round for the placing) no mention of these fantastic future opportunities. Could it be the sort of scattergun approach to projects that looks like (and quite possibly is) desperation, or they aren't worth mentioning?
Just another name for keeping the lights on and the gravy flowing with this lifestyle company. Imo.
", the batteries will store overproduced power and release into the grid"
Bill Gates in his book doesn't think batteries will make much difference - too expensive, too many strange minerals from stranger places required and it's old technology
UKOG are looking at "the addition of 250 kW of photovoltaic solar power and 100kW of battery storage" to the HH site.
So just for giggles, I looked up how much area the solar panels would take and according to the website below, it would be 2,500 sqm - or about 10% of the current wellsite.
http://www.suncyclopedia.com/en/area-required-for-solar-pv-power-plants/
According to this lot;
https://www.expertsure.com/uk/home/commercial-solar-panels/
a 250 kW photovoltaic system ( I scaled up the 50kW price) would cost over £300k and take 20 years to pay back.
According to this lot;
https://www.greenmatch.co.uk/blog/2018/07/solar-battery-storage-system-cost#cost
it looks like 100kW of battery storage would cost around £50k and have to be replaced at least once during the 25 year lifetime of the solar cells.
So is a system that takes up 10% of the available land and (excluding the battery pack) won't pay itself back for 20 years really right for HH?
I doubt it.
They could consider a 250kW wind turbine, but somehow I think the neighbours will object to a structure with a central tower that is 30m high and has a rotor radius of 15m that will be there all the time.
After all, SCC objected to a 45m tall drilling rig that was only going to be in place for a maximum of 3 months at Loxley....
"They could consider a 250kW wind turbine, but somehow I think the neighbours will object to a structure with a central tower that is 30m high and has a rotor radius of 15m that will be there all the time."
especially immediately north of Gatwick airport and it's radar systems............
£100m divided by 12 projects = £8.3m for each project.
The report estimates that, should the Government establish a Geothermal Development Incentive, 12 deep geothermal projects could be operational by 2025, creating 1,300 jobs and generating more than GBP100 million (approx. USD 140 million) of investment.
...............................
Dr Nina Skorupska CBE, Chief Executive of the Association for Renewable Energy and Clean Technology (REA), said: “As this report demonstrates, deep geothermal must be central to the Government’s energy policy for the next 30 years, but with real and tangible benefits in the immediate future.
“Deep geothermal has the potential to become a world leading industry here in the UK, provide a stable transition away from oil and gas, and help meet the Government’s net zero ambitions by decarbonising heat on a mass scale. It would also create 1,000s of new jobs and generate tens of millions of pounds in new investment.
“The REA believes that urgent work is required to aid the roll out of all heat technologies, however, with the right support from the Government, deep geothermal will play a major role in Britain’s heat generation for decades to come.”
There is a significant opportunity to create a world leading geothermal industry in the UK which could export internationally in terms of expertise, as with the North Sea. As the Government looks to deliver a ‘green recovery’ and meet their net zero ambitions, deep geothermal would act as a catalyst for new green jobs and investment, particularly in towns and cities in the North of England, Midlands and South-West.
This week in Parliament, Dr Kieran Mullan, Member of Parliament for Crewe and Nantwich, urged the Prime Minister to get behind the report and its proposals. He said: “As we recover from the huge economic challenges of the lock down we need to grab every opportunity available. We have the chance here to turbo charge investment, often in places in the North like Crewe which are at the heart of the levelling up agenda. We can create new skilled jobs and importantly, sustainable green jobs which are so important now.”
“We have lagged too far behind for too long in this area and now as the whole economy pivots, we can’t afford to fall further behind.”
Professor Iain Stewart, UNESCO Chair in Geoscience and Society; Professor of Geoscience Communication at the University of Plymouth, also added his support: “Exploiting the natural heat from deep beneath our feet seems to me to be a no-brainer. Its clean, green and renewable and can really support the push to reach the UK’s net-zero climate targets. What’s more, there’s a window of opportunity for the UK to be a technical leader in this emerging energy field, which has got so much potential globally.”
Doug Parr, Policy Director at Greenpeace, commented:
“Aside from providing clean, reliable, renewable electricity, geothermal has its own distinct advantages – advantages that neatly fill some of the gaps in current policy. It is a source of renewable heat, lower carbon than trying to integrate hydrogen into our gas supply, and it can provide good quality employment in its local area, helping to distribute the economic benefits of decarbonisation. And that economic opportunity could be built on – geothermal power is an increasingly attractive option in many parts of the world, the potential market is huge and the UK has plenty of geologists and engineers with drilling expertise and limited prospects in their current industry. This is a technology perfectly tailored to meet the challenge of decarbonising without leaving oil and gas workers behind.”
Germany’s use of deep geothermal energy reduced the country’s emissions by more than 1.7 Mt CO2 equivalent in 2017. In addition, there is the creation of skilled jobs, the industry is estimated to have created more than 22,000 jobs and added €13.3 billion to the German economy since 2000.
The success of geothermal developments in countries such as Germany, France and the Netherlands is closely linked to their governments’ commitment to supporting this technology through policies, regulations, incentives and initiatives. This success is specifically linked to the availability of a long-term, stable regulatory framework and the willingness of the state to share economic risks during the early stages of development.
Michael Chendorain, Associate Director at ARUP, said that UK can match or even surpass this success should the Government provide the right support package: “The UK’s deep geothermal resources are proven and can play a key role in decarbonising heat which makes up around 40% of the UK’s energy consumption and nearly a third of UK greenhouse gas emissions. Homes, universities, hospitals, and a broad range of industries can all benefit from a deep geothermal revolution but this will require Government support.”
https://www.thinkgeoenergy.com/geothermal-for-economic-decarbonisation-opportunities-uk/
Hot topic: UK’s first deep geothermal project gathers steam
The United Downs project in Cornwall is poised to go live next year – and it could be a gamechanger in the race to net zero
The United Downs project, near Redruth, Cornwall, is now undergoing final testing and, if all goes as planned, should be exporting electricity to the grid by 2022. It will produce 3MWe of electricity on a constant basis, enough to power about 7,000 homes, and approximately 12MW of heat.
The initial costs of scoping, drilling and testing are significant, but once up and running, the clean energy that can be produced is limitless. It also doesn’t ebb and flow, like wind or solar. “Geothermal, potentially, has a really important role to play in providing ‘baseload’ electricity to complement other forms of renewable generation,” says Clayton. “It doesn’t matter if it’s sunny, it doesn’t matter if it’s windy. It’s just there.”
There are potential knock-on effects for the surrounding region too. “These plants are not just about electricity,” says Law. “There’s a whole industry that develops around them. [For example], the sale of heat for industrial processes or agriculture, or mineral extraction from geothermal fluids.”
While we’ve made so much progress in the last 20 years in reducing the carbon content of electricity … there’s been so little progress with heat. If you look at a domestic setup, 80 per cent of the energy used is heat, not electricity. So actually, the ability to generate clean heat is really important.”
Law says the site will be up and running “in the second half of 2022”. A power purchase agreement to buy the electricity once it is online was agreed with the green energy company Ecotricity in 2020.
But when the energy from those hot rocks begins to be harvested, there likely won’t be anything much to see. Just the neat slotting in of another cog in the wheel towards a green energy future.
https://www.positive.news/environment/energy/uks-first-deep-geothermal-energy-project-gathers-steam/
"£100m divided by 12 projects = £8.3m for each project"
thelatest Cornish wells cost £ 15 mm each
Tell me Munch - who has ever made any money from Geothermal in W Europe?
its ALL dependent on vast subsidies.................
£8.3mm would barely cover the cost an essential piece of infrastructure at United Downs and final testing.
'In February 2020, Thrive Renewables announced its intention to invest up to GBP 6.5m to complete the final rounds of testing and to build the geothermal power plant at United Downs.'
But the scheme mentioned by UKOG does not seem to be a deep geothermal project 'we have also invested in a scoping study aimed at cogeneration and standalone geothermal energy at Horse Hill'
warm water might work - greenhouses or heating up Gatwick Terminals - it works in parts of NW Europe.
But have you noticed EVERY small oiler is now peddling geothermal? They'can't compete with the likes of Equinor or BP in wind generation and they're desperate to have something else , other than their failed oil and gas projects, to peddle to the credulous.
I'm surprised they aren't into micro-nuclear TBH :))))))
ps much more ludicrous to disount future potential and prospects on Ukog's Geothermal initiative. Gla Holders....Fingers crossed for a positive UPdate from Basur-3 this coming week. ;-)
Penguins
Probably because they will have previous data from down to about 8000 feet at HH-1 and have already done the sums to see if anything was cost effective.
Lol Mirasol....the Germans, the French and the Dutch by the looks of it are making plenty of Money!!! gl ;-)
Germany’s use of deep geothermal energy reduced the country’s emissions by more than 1.7 Mt CO2 equivalent in 2017. In addition, there is the creation of skilled jobs, the industry is estimated to have created more than 22,000 jobs and added €13.3 billion to the German economy since 2000.
The success of geothermal developments in countries such as Germany, France and the Netherlands is closely linked to their governments’ commitment to supporting this technology through policies, regulations, incentives and initiatives. This success is specifically linked to the availability of a long-term, stable regulatory framework and the willingness of the state to share economic risks during the early stages of development.
Michael Chendorain, Associate Director at ARUP, said that UK can match or even surpass this success should the Government provide the right support package: “The UK’s deep geothermal resources are proven and can play a key role in decarbonising heat which makes up around 40% of the UK’s energy consumption and nearly a third of UK greenhouse gas emissions. Homes, universities, hospitals, and a broad range of industries can all benefit from a deep geothermal revolution but this will require Government support.”
https://www.thinkgeoenergy.com/geothermal-for-economic-decarbonisation-opportunities-uk/
Geothermal heating for greenhouses - why not carbon capture for co2 enrichment in those greenhouses as well?
The greenwashing gets even better then, maybe UKOG could then apply for the Green Economy Mark from the London Stock Exchange?
https://www.thinkgeoenergy.com/thinkgeoenergys-top-10-geothermal-countries-2020-installed-power-generation-capacity-mwe/
And no change in output from 7 of the top 10. Turkey however is loading up in it.
Munch - doesn't say anyone is making money
Don't forget that induced seismicity can be a problem with Geothermal.
https://www.cornwalllive.com/news/cornwall-news/cornwall-43-earthquakes-recorded-past-4838568
https://www.itv.com/news/westcountry/2020-12-30/dozens-of-earthquakes-recorded-in-cornwall-in-just-50-days
Just as well it doesn't come under OGA regs, as they require the O&G industry to shut down at anything over 0.5 on the Richter scale.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/05/04/government-has-double-standards-allowing-drilling-devon/
In the past, geothermal induced seismicity has caused at least one project to be scrapped.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Induced_seismicity_in_Basel
The Geothermal revolution is starting now, and no doubt the UK Government will give its full backing in due course with financial incentives and regulatory initiatives, and so a big positive for Ukog's early move into what could become a highly significant industry in providing clean, green and renewable energy for the UK for may years to come....obviously very early stage for Ukog, but a totally ridiculous display of negativity from the derampers of Ukog, given the huge potential and prospects of what could become a multi-billion dollar industry in the coming years...good to get in early on whatever direction Ukog take, and no bad thing that Ukog have. Gla holders ;-)
Some ramping posts are getting desperate - trying to promote / profit from an unfunded and unannounced geothermal plant reeks of an expectation of bad results from Turkey.
Or, are some people expecting poor demand for the Open Offer to be announced tomorrow and the news to damage the share price even further?
I have something to say!
Greed is the root of all evil and there are plenty on here who will do anything to try and get their money back due to previous poor investment. You will also get the short term traders trying to drag new investors in before they make their exit. If you are stuck on over 1.5p after the last influx of shares you will still be here moaning next year imo. It is not exactly difficult to spot those in each camp.
And what camp do you belong to Ibug
MRPlumper
I take it you can read? What do you think?