London South East prides itself on its community spirit, and in order to keep the chat section problem free, we ask all members to follow these simple rules. In these rules, we refer to ourselves as "we", "us", "our". The user of the website is referred to as "you" and "your".
By posting on our share chat boards you are agreeing to the following:
The IP address of all posts is recorded to aid in enforcing these conditions. As a user you agree to any information you have entered being stored in a database. You agree that we have the right to remove, edit, move or close any topic or board at any time should we see fit. You agree that we have the right to remove any post without notice. You agree that we have the right to suspend your account without notice.
Please note some users may not behave properly and may post content that is misleading, untrue or offensive.
It is not possible for us to fully monitor all content all of the time but where we have actually received notice of any content that is potentially misleading, untrue, offensive, unlawful, infringes third party rights or is potentially in breach of these terms and conditions, then we will review such content, decide whether to remove it from this website and act accordingly.
Premium Members are members that have a premium subscription with London South East. You can subscribe here.
London South East does not endorse such members, and posts should not be construed as advice and represent the opinions of the authors, not those of London South East Ltd, or its affiliates.
Just to add I’ve added plenty of shares over the last week as even a crash test dummy couldn’t fail to make money by buying at 10p. 😀👍
Hello Mathsprof but RF have to come back to Sareum and say we have sold that lot of shares you gave us at 10p. However we sold them at 13p so the 800k owed is actually less by 87k. So sareum may well say here's another lot at 10p but if things are going well RF will sell at the higher price and that will be shown to be reducing the balance by more than 10p a share.
I don't believe that there is no check on the sell price RF get.
Looking at it from RF's perspective I think they have two options now :
1 - Hold onto the 2.9M shares + whatever remains + all of their warrants till a SP of £1 (say) ; Then sell and they get 2.9M+ Warrants value .. but not the £800K as this will be satisfied by the share sale at £1 ... so approx £4M on a £2.3M outlay
2 - Option 2 would be to keep selling to recoup their original stake ... BUT herein lies their dilemma ... If they sell the 2.9M at 10p (say) = 290K, SAR then owe them 800-290 = approx £1/2 Million ... so lets say SAR then use the extra money from the shareholder placing (800K) pay off RF ..... RF then have really only made probably 100K in admin charges etc
So do they take 100K or hope for 2M ?
If they keep selling then my mindset switches to the darker side and other ulterior reasons behind their actions !!! and unfortunately I do not feel confident about the BOD at the moment because their comms channels still appear closed
Hopefully we will find out tomorrow but its time for the BOD to show some support for the shareholders now who have helped them out of a dark place which they put us all into due to incompetent management of the situation
Balance owed to RF is reduced by the price they get the shares at (10p for this lot), it is irrelevant what they sell them for.
If they sell them all and then the price drops to 7p, however many share they take at 7p will be how much what SAR owe them is reduced by.
It is irrelevant as to whether they sell then at 7p or 70p. It is only the monetary value equivalent for the no. of share issued to them at whatever price they are issued.
We need to pay them off asap in my opinion.
I think we would be beter off paying them in full in cash and having another WRAP.
Elcap
Aber if they waited till £1 they could only sell £800k worth as that is all Sareum owe them. Any shares they have over that, they have to sell with Sareum guidance, and Sareum would receive 95% of the sale value of the extra shares.
This is the problem with loan shark.
They just keep coming back for more.
RF is not going anywhere just yet.
If they have been gifted/ given 2,900,000 shares doesn't this take them above the 3% disclosure level (or is it 5% for aim).
A TR1 would have to be issued confirming total shares held with further disclosures for every 1% change until such point they go under 3%.
I couldn't verify disclosure levels for aim.
Any confirmation from anyone regarding AIM disclosure levels would be appreciated.
KR
ZA
RF don't care about upcoming news they will dump as fast as the volume traded allows, anyone else notice the MMs switched places before the close.
Elcap if that were the case, then from the initial 2 million deposit we received off them, we would have only owed them 90 odd thousand. They were given 1.9 million shares at a price of £1.02 for the first deposit, roughly £1930000 value at issue price. The selling price is being recorded and I believe its the selling price that reduces the debt, otherwise we would not have to keep issuing new shares.
In my humble opinion of course.
Why is there so much whining we now know RF have 2.9m of shares every one just needs to sit tight and wait for news I hold 410k shares and an average of 56p so yes im down like a lot of us. why don't you all put your efforts in to the positives as if you can't just sell up and move on. RF will do wot ever they want let them stop working about them
Hi DrZ - section 5.1.2 of https://www.handbook.fca.org.uk/handbook/DTR/5/1.html says
"A person must notify the issuer of the percentage of its voting rights he holds as shareholder or holds or is deemed to hold through his direct or indirect holding of financial instruments falling within DTR 5.3.1R (1) (or a combination of such holdings) if the percentage of those voting rights:
(1)
reaches, exceeds or falls below 3%, 4%, 5%, 6%, 7%, 8%, 9%, 10% and each 1% threshold thereafter up to 100% (or in the case of a non-UK issuer on the basis of thresholds at 5%, 10%, 15%, 20%, 25%, 30%, 50% and 75%) as a result of an acquisition or disposal of shares or financial instruments falling within DTR 5.3.1 R; or
(2)
reaches, exceeds or falls below an applicable threshold in (1) as a result of events changing the breakdown of voting rights and on the basis of information disclosed by the issuer in accordance with DTR 5.6.1 Rand DTR 5.6.1A R;
and in the case of an issuer which is not incorporated in the United Kingdom a notification under (2) must be made on the basis of equivalent events and disclosed information."
If they don't issue a TR1 then at least we'll know they've got less than 3%.
I am no expert at all but can one say that RF was dumping approx 2,9 Mil shares over time and now delivers the lot and shall not being burnt? (No squeeze out)
What sort of clowns are advising the BoD, and I thought we had a very experienced set of suits. Everyone knows that RF are a massive threat to the SP, why the the hell didn’t they just extend the WRAP, which was over subscribed, by another 8 million shares and get rid of these shysters (We have just given RF nearly 3 million anyway!) We have all seen what RF has done to the SP over last 6 months, and IMHO the same threat is still there. Do another WRAP at 10p and let genuine holders get involved. If the recent SP attack continues, the BoD’s judgement must be questioned.
By the removal of paying RF in "cash" from the RNS and now stating "the Company expects to settle all balances by the issuance of Subscription Shares prior to the Maturity Date" That feels like a kick in the nuts after the extra WRAP raised and to do what crack on with 1802 when they never should of stopped working on it... frustrating as f**k this share.
Let's hope we get a positive RNS soon....GLA
In fact why are they even talking about spending the extra money on preclinical hasn't every RNS stated that all funds are being directed at 1801, it's like they don't even know what to do with it, how about pay off RF you Muppets or keep it towards P2a or for extended working capital..
Answers?
The only possible way that this makes any sense at all, is that positive news is very very close, why else would they do it. Let’s wait and see.
I see that was the tactic. Tim and Co to blame. PH worth the money.
Damion, they've got used to feeding off investors with raise after raise. I don't think over the past 20 years we've seen much business acumen here otherwise we would be much further forward than we are today....
Good luck, as we are clearly going to need it, Brighty
Re-reading the terms of the Equity, RF can at any time request the next tranche of issues once they have exhausted the previous set. I think this is just the next 50% to 65% range of the funds owed to RF. 2.9m taken, remaining 800k owed (after this issue), and this set equates to 300k approx. we're just over halfway through the RF saga.
The question is could the BOD have raised more to pay off RF. If the answer is yes, then why did they not. A possible next question is is there anything we the shareholders, can do to change course. The next question would calling an EGM be helpful in getting a change of direction.
Agree, I am trying to get a call with Tim, but no one in the office answers.
Current buy price is 13.65, showing up as a sell
Ofcourse the BOD might not want PIs to hold the upperhand again, as we have in the past. i.e. we know that the wrap was not open to all shareholders. Why not is the question? No doubt we'll get a lot of waffle at some stage about there was not enough time to involve all shareholders etc but the reality is that if this had been offered to as many PI's as possible they could have raised infinitely more funds.
The WRAP offer was open to all shareholders with decent brokers, if you want to know why your broker didn't participate ask them.
Thing is, regardless of how we got here, RF has had all these shares for next to nothing & they're selling them for next to nothing, mostly to PI's who still see the value here. If they held on to them, they might make serious money. Does anybody here want that to happen? I know I don't.
Basil, my understanding was that timescales were so short, only brokers on WRAP's client list were approached. It was also quite a modest placing originally. The fact that some brokers were not approached doesn't reflect on the quality of the offer and I don't think any conspiracy should be built around it.