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Thanks for the Cineplex / Cineworld comparison and that is why small trader they should crack on with a US listing. No if's, ands or buts about it. The UK is simply not recognising the underlying value of the Regal cinemas (bought for £2.8 Billion) and all the other group assets in the UK, Ireland and Rest of the World, and the derisory market cap of circa £857Mill tells you that. They are also sat with about half of that Market Cap as cash on the balance sheet.

Incidentally I don't think its shorts that are to blame and a lot more to do with market makers and all those low volume uneconomic trades. On low volume days they have simply lowered the price to try and stimulate volume, same the next day and the next, and not given it back.

Plenty in the Cine H2 results to cheer about including vastly reduced cash burn and cost savings ($60M to $45M to somewhere like $25M per month in June. July) Much better than expected. Great film slate to come, Anticipated Q4 return to profitability, US listing mentioned also, cash on the balance sheet etc, and we are back where we were prior to H2 results. Again no reflection in the share price for doing all the right things.

Given that they turn their profits off the spread and off volume generation, let them work it out for themselves. Today a prime example, with a further lowering but not many if any selling.

It is getting to an interesting share price again and the prices at the pumps or for heating oil atc are not moving the same way.

It does make you laugh that oil company share prices are so sensitive to daily changes in the oil price when actually it is the average over 365 days of the year that matter for Profit and Loss accounts.

It would be interesting to know who all the placees were.
Almost instant 50% to near 100% profits.

Mountainous I have just been having a catch up on all the bulletin boards after an enjoyable weekend. Something I shall continue to do while bulletin boards imho lack integrity.

It is an interesting point that you raise on force majeure for that would in essence negate the contract in it's own right irrespective of the debt covenant breaches that Cineworld highlighted and which Cineplex didn't remedy.

Having been through the Arrangement Agreement in full there is a force majeure clause covered within but there are listed exceptions for Company Material Adverse Effect and one of those is (e) "any earthquake, flood or other natural disaster or outbreaks of illness or
other acts of God;"

That said there is someone on the Reddit forum, possibly Canadian, that seems to be citing the ability to make use of a common law defence called "Frustration". Rather than me trying to explain it I'll simply copy and paste from the link. To me the Covid19 pandemic would fit the bill and be applicable here as neither party in truth is to blame.

"Frustration
Without a contractual force majeure clause, a party may consider relying on the common law doctrine of frustration (or “force majeure” under the civilian legal tradition) to excuse its non-performance. Pursuant to this doctrine, a court may fully excuse both parties from their obligations where performance of a contract becomes legally or physically impossible or the contract is “frustrated” without fault of either party.
The Supreme Court of Canada has described frustration as occurring “when a situation has arisen for which the parties made no provision in the contract and performance of the contract becomes ‘a thing radically different from that which was undertaken by the contract’.”1 This is a high threshold to meet."

Just a couple of points to add.
*The Cineplex claim and Cineworld counterclaim are governed by the Laws of the Province of
Ontario and the Federal Laws of Canada. (Not Quebec which maybe where Crumpets was getting a little sidetracked, as I don't think Quebec recognises force majeure)
* Also CINE seem to have highlighted debt covenant breaches and Cineplex not having remedied this. CINE terminated the agreement on the 12th June. A quick look at Cineplex's 2020 Q2 Report then shows them embarking on a short term public offering to raise $275M by way of debentures (which is Debt) on the 7th July, and with the underwriters purchasing an additional $41.25M on an overallotment option. This was pursuant to a Credit Agreement Amendment that Cineplex entered into with its lenders on June 29, 2020 to raise $250.0 million of new financing by August 31, 2020, and of which $100.0 million would be used to permanently repay credit facilities.

Personally I'd be drilling right down into exactly what was behind this as the timing seems strangely consecutive after we terminated the agreement.

All data is publicly available.

Missed the link off at the end

https://dailyresearchplot.com/2021/08/14/marvels-shang-chi-confirmed-to-release-only-in-theaters-by-disney/

Embrace those with releases "only in theatres" if you can.

Incidentally I watched Match of the Day 1 and Match of the Day 2 at the weekend. Absolutely no shortage of fans in any of those stadiums, some up to capacity of 80K and all paying for season tickets and many between £40 and £85 a whup for their match day tickets and to sit absolute shoulder to shoulder with probable unknowns. All undeterred. If you are an away fan add another £25 to £100 quid for travel and food and beer, dependant on your mode of transport.

Cost of cinema - between £10 and £20 including popcorn, hotdogs, a drink. Maybe a little more in London. Less if it's spread across a family ticket.
Doesn't matter if you get beat.
Doesn't matter if it rains or is freezing cold weather
Nice comfy seating and a safe distance between your party and the next.
Fewer potential pinch pinch points as well when you compare entry and exit from a cinema compared to at the turnstyles, queuing for refreshments and for the loos.

Given the way fans have returned to football I don't see a problem with us getting back there.

Just need the studios to have the confidence in further releasing good content and to keep the momentum to keep building.

Free Guys impressive opening numbers and confirmation that the next marvel film Shang Chi and the Legend of the 10 rings is releasing in cinemas on 3rd Sept are steps in the right direction.

I went to see Free Guy yesterday with family.

Nearly put a blue shirt on to go and see the movie as well!!

Now first up, that is a quality film. Funny, current, colourful, action aplenty, soundtrack good and it takes you through a full range of emotions. Ryan Reynolds is a top actor as was his female co-star in the film. Well done House of Mouse and you should continue to make very decent money out of this film over the next few weeks and as word of mouth gets around.

Had a last minute addition to our cinema party in the form of an early 20's, and a lover of all things Marvel fan, who intially wasn't going to come and changed his mind at the very last minute. End of the movie even he was highly complimentary of the film. Not surprised at all that it has comfortably surprassed Dwayne Johnson and Emily Blunt's opening weekend in Jungle Cruise, and the sequel they are talking about would be a really good thing.

The cinema also for those interested was busier than expected and again I think it is again down to walk in custom (where you avoid the online booking fee) and most I could see had concession items and the hot food options seemed popular.

Free Guy is well worth seeing imho and one to tell a friend and encourage more to go imho.
They will enjoy it.

Certainly not tempted to buy in to allow TB or others to instantly bank a profit on their 18p shares.

Its an example forfaiter. Diferent businesses and different marketsThere are many others out there.

There are two points that you miss in what you say.

Firstly that it has created a completely new company that released funds to pay down debt and there is a further 81% of the company to do the same and which has gone up 20% since IPO. It isa seperate entity and can expand further, takeover or do as any business does best. Voda did it this way and all shareholders have their part in an 81% stake in VT. Others give you shares or part shares in the new company or preferential terms.

There is an asset out there, and recovering business that Cineworld paid £2.8 billion for. Its not reflected in the present market cap.

Its about realising the value of the assets and funds can be used to pay down debt.

Easy to criticise. Why don't you go away yourself and come back later with some others.

Realising the full value of existing assets and paying down debts for CINE would be a very good idea and imho would resonate on the share price and market cap, as it presently is.

Its down to the business and advisors to advise what is the best structured way to move forward. Cineworld are investigating not only partial listing but other structures also.

As it happens with Vantage Towers Vodafone partially listed and retained 81% of the company and realised something like $2.3B instantly to pay down debt by IPO'ing only 19% of VT. It created a £12.3 Billion new listed company. IPO'd at 24 Euros. Now 29.47 Euros

Its down to the business and advisors to advise what is the best structured way to move forward. Cineworld are investigating not only partial listing but other structures also.

As it happens with Vantage Towers Vodafone partially listed and retained 81% of the company and realised something like $2.3B instantly to pay down debt by IPO'ing only 19% of VT. It created a £12.3 Billion new listed company for the. IPO'd at 24 Euros. Now 29.47 Euros

Vodafone from memory recently IPO's Vantage Towers out of its existing businessand there are many others out there. The aim is to realise the value of the assets and thats why imho it is a good thing.

https://www.cityindex.co.uk/market-analysis/vantage-towers-ipo-background/

LHall, if they "do the splits" and partially list then existing shareholders will get shares in both companies as they already own their respective part of it and new shares will be created - but it is all about realising the full or fuller value of the assets. There are not many companies that have done the splits and don't go on to far higher combined values of both companies. That for me is the preferred route. The value of Regal cinemas doesn't even figure in todays market capitalisation.

All to come and an American listing (in whatever form) will put us into more liquid markets and where P/E's and the like are more relevant.

It'll probably drop upon us in Q4 with the recovery Mooky anticipates.

Meantimes its Free Guy and several other choices this weekend that looked good in the trailers and what is a Disney film without Day date release.

I actually nearly bought this at 35p and the day before the bad news but actually found a better alternative.

Let me just get this straight. TB has been selling out of BRH all the way down from when it was in the 120's and now picks up 8 million at 18p. Lucky guy that he has had such foresight.

So 8 more million to sell. Looks like 18p it will be then or maybe less if some quit the stock for good and probably until end September anticipated update.

Given share price movements (7 to 10% consecutive drops) in recent days some with knowledge knew this was happening. That's what makes it even more unpalatable.

Genuine sympathies but hopefully Prof Carl Smythe and get hings back on course.

mountainous, just to add to FI's response and I'll paraphrase what I wrote down during the conference call. I think they were talking about only 1%.

Mookys words, not mines

Closed for 6 to 7 months, competitors opened earlier - some moved, it was a cash burn decision to close - the right decision - customers are coming back, - gradual reopening also so it impacted, - also closed about 12 cinemas so therefore you lose market share - lastly recovery in NYC slower - but will come back. Not worried - will gain back.

lsesb probably covered it also earlier in his commentary.

Thanks for highlighting and yes I see several including the Times have picked up on this.

Mooky was imho very candid on this today in the conference call when he was questioned on it and not giving much away other than saying it was advisors who had suggested it and that it was not days or weeks away but something they were looking at.

I personally think firstly that you will hear very little on it and it will just drop and probably when least expected. i also think they will wait for a partial or near full recovery in Q4 before seeking a valuation.

Absolutely no idea how they will work it but in general if they do it along the lines "doing the splits" then people like the naked Trader always expound "doing the splits" as good for shareholders and the aim is to add value for all involved. If a partial listing then you might find existing shareholders get X amount of the shares and institutions and the public get to apply for the other in the partial listing part.

Is this a comedy night in tonight?

Two people in particular (and there are more) over the last week have done their level best to try and shoot down any positivity in the Cinemark update, Vue Chiefs interview, the AMC conference call with 45 day theatre window and spamming the bulletin board with BoXOfficeMojo weekend numbers (when Concession sales and other constituents are and have proven as important) and with dropping subtle concerns. People do read and remember. Not levelled at anyone in particular but they will know who they are.

FI, one for you. I'm still waiting for your evidence on the aspertions that you levelled at made last night. Show us that integrity and pop up the postings or do the decent thing and acknowledge you were wrong?

As it happened I called (and invested) into todays results just about spot on.
*Lower cash burn - Tick
*Other ingredients of profit equally as important that add to Box office ticket sales - Tick
* Let the CEO deal with the financial numbers - too many variable unknown. Tick.
* Good cost management and reduction and those staged reopening adding to that - Tick
* Good forward looking statemnt into Q4 and the film slate - Tick
* And that the theatrical window would not have been surrendered with any disadvantage to cinemas. Tick

Great update and we are doing all the right things.

*USA Listing has massive potential to add and realise the true value of the estate. £2.7 Billion ($3.6 Billion) was what Cineworld paid for Regal and the US side of operations only.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-42234673
Our market cap tonight?
* One of the worst pandemics in living memory, cinemas shut for the best part of 4.5 months of a 6 month reporting period and the Total period cash burn of only $66.6m. (Highly creditable if compared with any other business negotiating the pandemic).
*Scope to increase prices evident, another constituent part of revenue and profits (Keeping prices as they are will bring back custom and market share in its own right)

Have a good evening.

Always good to see it rising again. Yes its a unique company and has a CEO with smart vision.

Lsesb, thanks for the commentary. Great shorthand. It was an open an honest presentation and the Q' and A' session brought up some good points.

Three bits that stood out for me were.

In response to the JPM question, even although they have reduced the monthly cash burn from $60M to $45M. This reduced by almost half in June and July.

The second standout point was Mooky's answer to the HSBC question on Royalty rates in consequence of day and date release and re-negotiated contracts whereupon he answered that all aspects of the contracts were on the table for discussion including royalties and marketing spends, and him stating his thought sthat CINE would be in a similar situation as prior to the pandemic.

Food and beverage spend being so high also simply confirms my observations that more were buying things to take masks off. Blatantly obvious in any cinema you go to.

Good summary and happy that they have been doing all the right things and with very good film slate coming up in Q4 if we continue in the same vein then I think all can see where we are heading in Q4.

Broke my embargo but relevant.

They paid £2.7 Billion for Regal cinemas.

Current market cap for the full of the Cineworld group is only $841 Million

That's why America imho.

Done till market close.