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Bells started to ring for me, the Rolex problem.
I then looked at store costs and cost of living problems and I concluded this was now trading in a bumble.
404x - ‘I'm not going to argue with two of you at once, I'm in this dog too right now so there is that.’
In this dog? Sounds like you’re emotionally involved in this for sure?
I’ve just given you the fundamental facts around the argument you were making? The ‘market perception’ is irrelevant because it isn’t the facts of the matter. Lol. Unless you invest based on fallacy? I invest on numbers and facts.
‘Tms as judging by some of your posts on this board you've been a bit triggered by all this so I'm going easy here.’
Feel free to go hard? I’m still waiting for a respons on the facts I’ve just told you about Rolex? But you seem to have just deflected?
I'm not going to argue with two of you at once, I'm in this dog too right now so there is that. As for the long term decline, we'll have to see how that plays out.
We've all been on the wrong side of trades so I'm not rubbing salt in the wounds by saying the company is f*cked. There is just a market perception that one day it might be, as much as you wish there wasn't. tms as judging by some of your posts on this board you've been a bit triggered by all this so I'm going easy here.
The Rolex ‘myth’ still won’t go away. Lol.
You’ve only got to be able to do the maths to realise is absolute nonsense.
And if you can’t do the maths the bit where Rolex said very clearly ‘we’re not going in to retail’ might suffice? Lol.
404x
Rolex haven't gone it alone they bought Bucherer for a reported chf5bn!!! That's over £4bn for around 100 stores. By that reckoning that gives WOSG a value of around £8bn if they wanted to buy them!
404x - You’re a million miles off.
Rolex via Bucherer? There are 100 Bucherer stores worldwide and over 1600 stores currently selling Rolex and an authorised dealer. So Rolex are cutting off 1500 of their global stores to go it alone are they?
I don’t think so.
As I’ve already mentioned Rolex have already invested over a billion on their production capabilities in the last 12 months…..and now they’re going to invest how much on going full retail? Even though they’ve already stated they have no intention of doing so?
@tms see any of the Swatch Group brands, Rolex via Bucherer etc, if anything WOSG are the odd one out because most luxury companies sell direct.
Still it's an unfortunate situation for WOSG to be in because even Rolex made every promise to carry on supply and do so for many years, all that really matters is the market perception of that risk existing of Rolex fully going it alone. So there will always be a Rolex shaped sword of damocles hanging over the stock.
Don't get me wrong I'm not saying this is going back to £14 but £3.85 is way oversold.
IMHO
No stainless steel ones Fordy, but some gold ones available I believe.
If you can get me an entry level stainless steel Daytona at Michael Spiers for RRP then I'll happily give you a £5k finders fee. I love my watches so I have some knowledge on the subject. Wouldn't profess to be an expert but I know enough to say there's still a huge demand for Rolex. As long as WOSG have a distribution agreement in place with Rolex this is massively oversold. At this SP WOSG is a takeover target.
You asked and that's my opinion.
404x
Rolex, Omega and the like don't have a direct consumer sales channel they use retailers. In the UK WOSG front both Omega and Rolex stores. We've recently had a massive Omega store open here in Liverpool One shopping centre. It's owned and run by WOSG
404x - ‘To be honest it's already happening, most have a direct to consumer offering because why wouldn't they, by cutting out the middle man they can control supply, set prices and maintain their brand strength by not being sold in a mixmatch of brands type shop.’
Be specific.
Which brands are selling straight to the consumer and are no longer using third party retailers. And what percentage of the market is this exactly?
WOSG have plenty of mono brand boutiques with more opening this year. They’re not all ‘mixmatch’ stores as you put it. These mono boutiques will be contractual with the brands they’re selling.
Yes, that’s my point. They are completely and utterly dependent upon third parties and, like you say, their model seems old hat (mix of brands) and arguably weakens the exclusivity of the big brands. Good luck with your trade.
I'm in for a quick trade today anticipating rebound but may have jumped in too early judging by Wace and Qube increasing shorts after drop.
Longer term I believe the company will steadily decline but not because of demand for watches/jewellery softening - luxury market is and will remain robust despite what naysayers say. Just look at steady revenues of LVMH/Richemont/Hermes etc over last year despite global turbulence.
The WOSG problem imo is 1) over exposure to weak UK market 2) more importantly their dependence on the brands particularly Rolex for supply. Leaves WOSG very vulnerable when the companies they rely on can pull the plug at any moment. To be honest it's already happening, most have a direct to consumer offering because why wouldn't they, by cutting out the middle man they can control supply, set prices and maintain their brand strength by not being sold in a mixmatch of brands type shop.
If you want a Daytona, try Michael Spiers in the South West.
My issue with WOSG is it’s just a retailer of third party products. How long are its contracts with the suppliers, and what’s to stop them jumping in bed with someone else?
Fordy88 - I’d be careful talking sense and facts amongst this bunch of idiots. Lol.
Follow the facts, not the losers on this board.
Waiting lists for lots of Rolex models (Daytonas, GMt's Subs etc) are still huge and there's people on the waiting lists been there for years. As soon as a watch comes into the store it's sold the same day after a few phone calls. Im on the list at 3 different stores for models and I haven't had a call in over 12 months. Rolex have recently ramped up production and they still can't satisfy demand. Dont believe me? Have a look on Chrono24 or other used watch websites to see how much the above second hand models sell for ABOVE the rrp. People pay thousands over RRP just to get their hands on one.
December was a washout across the UK for retail not just WOSG the data this morning confirmed it. Yesterday's sell off was a massive over reaction.
IMHO
No response. Which usually means you’ve got f *ck all to say because you’ve been beaten around the head with the facts.
I won’t bother putting humpty together again.
Tard.
Any thoughts from anyone other than the ‘tard?
HumpyDumpy - I’d stick to what you’re good at pal. Fall off a wall and shatter into a thousand eggy pieces. Lol.
You’re evidently clueless. About the watch market or business in general. Rolex have invested over a billion into their watch manufacturing capabilities and theres still a huge gap in the supply and demand of high end luxury watches.
One bad quarter out of the last god knows how many when GDP and retail unexpectedly fell across the board in December means very little in the grand scheme of things.
It was still double digit growth in the US which is the biggest market by far. It’s the diseased UK market which was lagging which may not be as much of an issue in the coming years as their market share over in the US increases further.
LWHL - ‘For a quick turn, HD. Obviously some strong inside buying early next week might help the likes of JISA-boy, but IMO I agree with the other poster who sees a 360-400p range until next news. Give or take here or there, naturally.’
The likes of JISA boy who schooled you over at BARC whilst you were pathetically predicting a banking crisis? That JISA boy? Lol.
I’d stick to flapping over at BARC if I was you. At least that’s amusing.,
But why? Other than just thinking the drop is overdone (which I don’t think it is; I think it’s just overdue) and you may make a quick turn? Is it just day traders here now; and those who are in too deep and are clinging on in hope? That came out a bit harsh; but my point is, with the watch bubble popping, can anyone point me in the direction of anything that would actually support an improvement in the fundamentals of this company from here and a corresponding increase in the share price. No matter what way I look at it, I can’t see it at these prices or anything close to it.
Worth buying in here at 3.50p, if it gets there.
For a quick turn, HD. Obviously some strong inside buying early next week might help the likes of JISA-boy, but IMO I agree with the other poster who sees a 360-400p range until next news. Give or take here or there, naturally.
Money, I can tell you’re gutted, so I’m going to stop winding you up.
Genuinely interested in why people are buying this? The watch market is obviously having a major correction after a massive bubble, and no one in their right mind is buying new at retail prices (at least not for investment purposes in any thing like the same numbers they were). So far as I can see this is just a boggo retailer who rode a wave but is completely dependent upon the whims of the manufacturers, with no long term security and no real advantage over competitors. For those that have just gone in, how do you think this is going to turn around? Genuine question.