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And adjusted EPS is calculated in the same way as basic EPS except that non recurring items are removed from the earnings figure. Things like the sale of an asset etc...
Suark - basic EPS is calculated by taking the earnings figure and dividing it by the number of shares in issue. Fully diluted EPS also takes the earnings figure and divides it by the number of shares in issue but all outstanding share options and warrants added to the shares in issue. So fully diluted EPS effectively assumes all warrants and options are exercised. Hope that makes sense!
I would be mega grateful if someone could explain the difference between adjusted diluted and basic eps. It has caught me out a few times especially with this share. Thought I had a bargain at £20 but it was on a multiple of 14 ish not 10 which was reported in the financial press.
Good one John. Always worth keeping an eye on these unexciting shares. After all. a profit is a profit, irrespective as to whether it's from IMB or ODX!
Got in at 1335 this morning on an order , trying to average down from 1580 so getting there , missed the exdiv date but sp would have cost me more so still happy with that. Gla
Well I mentioned 1350 as a good time to get back in. Now being quoted 13.38, so why not? After all, this is a tad less volatile than crypto and Covid stock! (In at 1342...GLA)
Hi Toff,
Very nicely put thank you. It seems you are a rare breed as a successful trader, which I trust you are.
Having tried CFDs and Spread-betting in the past, I was clearly not cut out for trading.
As for now, I have a small SIPP, and love doing my own investments. If it all goes pear shaped it is not the end of the world.
I have spent many years following Stephen Bland and his idea of investing for income. Originally I followed the Midas Dogs of the FTSE scheme from 2002 watching it perform brilliantly until 2007, when they restarted the scheme. I had some funds from a previous pension and put 50% of the funds into the Dogs Scheme in May 2007, which had 5 or 6 banks in its 10 share p/f. Needless to say what followed was the 2008 crash and bank shares such as RBS and LLOY got destroyed. I bought RBS at over £6 (was£18 before a 3 for 1 consol), and LLOY at £5.60 odd. Not to mention B&B which went bust altogether. As time went on I learnt to diversify and not put all funds in market at same time. That SIPP account was closed when I got to 55 a couple of years ago, and I was amazed to have recovered almost all of my early losses. At one stage (end of Feb 2009), my loss was 63%. I never panicked but with hindsight wished I had waited 2 years to start investing !
So now I am investing another pension which started in Jan 2018. With typical CSDI luck, it took 2 years this time before a new market disaster arrived in the form of CV19. I am currently down approx 8% since I started, compared to a FTSE drop of approx 19% over the same time.
I try to keep about 5% of my fund for fun/trading, and originally kept any share to a max of 5% of my fund. I think this creates more work so have decided to cut down to between 8-12 holdings, so that I can "go large" on one or two. I now have a pretty concentrated p/f, still focused on income.
As you say many UK shares seem to trade at low valuations currently. This year I have sold out of telcoms and bank sectors. I have gone overweight IMB and GSK for now and time will tell if this proves to wise or not.
Good luck with your trading and I will stick to my effort of "Value/Income-investing" which is clearly not popular at the moment. Of course it may just be that I am useless at picking shares, but at least I enjoy the ride.
PS. Almost time to buy some more IMB after this swift fall.
CSD
I should add that I’m a short term trader rather than a long term investor. I know there’re always exceptions but selling before dividends and buying after is generally better. The stamp duty is negligible when compared to the drop. Also my comment is specific to ftse100 shares which are particularly susceptible to market manipulation. Small caps aren’t put under the same downward pressure when going ex dividend.
Dividends are a mugs game when buying ftse100 companies- especially the big payouts. The real winners are the murky hedge funds who target ex-dividend shares with wash trades - brokerages do it as well - that excerpts downward pressure.
The losers are the shareholders- they get the booby prize , which is the dividend. Imperial looks cheap by any metric but many of the dividends have been deducted permanently from the shareprice- hence the falls from above £30. If you consider all the fundamentals - if the shareprice was £25 it wouldn’t looked overpriced. Wherever you get unfashionable stocks you get manipulation - punishing tobacco stocks is in vogue.
And then you’ve got the UK drawback factor. Although most ftse100 make most of their money outside the UK they trade at extremely low valuations due to being listed in the UK. Most ftse100 companies would rise 30-50 percent if they were to list in markets outside the uk.
BATS & Imperial have underperformed other multinational tobacco stocks by a hefty margin.
As have BP & Shell in the oil sector.
As have pharmaceuticals
As have most other sectors.
It’s a huge handicap being listed in the uk. I only hope many of Britain’s biggest companies will relist in the EU or US post Brexit. That would give shareholders a huge boost.
Toff
Ive been following this share for a little while, my interest solely driven by the dividends but not yet bought in. Its interesting what Chumba points out about BME. I bought into that during xdd week for 4.94, held for the dividend that is 4p +25p special, and sold on the friday for 4.94. It was partly luck as I expected a bigger drop, but there had been a rally upto 5.10 also during the week so the dividend was possibly factored in at the higher price.
I'm aiming to get IMB between the £13-£3.50 range and while I do not wish a loss for current holders I hope it gets there pre the next xdd.
Thanks for getting back Toff. BMEs sp rose on the day before the XDD, to then fall from that height by roughly the dividend amount, as you have suggested. It ws interesting to see the sp behaviour prior to that as it was alles uber dem platz, but literally rose in the afternoon of the day before XD.
But it is most interesting to read what you say and I'll add that to my knowledge base. Thanks again.
Ok Toff - as previously noted you are spot on this occasion, but there is a mixed picture here believe it or not.
I have looked at the last 8 ex dates for IMB.
On day before ex div, there have been 5 rises and 3 falls - so your statement for this day not conclusive
On ex div - all 8 have fallen as expected. 2 of these falls have been slight less than the divi and 4 have been more than 50% more than the divi
Looking at prices 28 days after ex div shows 4 times got back above the ex div date. 3 times not and the current one won't know until 24/12.
The point being made is - I am not sure you can recover the costs of selling and buying back without being worse off. It is a mixed bag of some wins and some losses.
Bare in mind the Feb 20 divi was the beginning of the Covid drama and still no where near back to that price.
Just thought I would throw up an alternative view, but cannot dispute you are correct on this occasion.
Having been a keen investor of HY shares for approx 13 yrs, my experience says the direction of the general market is just as important. Generally speaking, in a bull market the divi will be profitable, in a bear market very negative. The state of the business and the market sentiment towards the share is also crucial. Buy any unlvoed share and you can be in trouble as I know to my cost. Hence the C S D I
Chumba
"The day before ex dividend the shareprice invariably falls"
I assume you mean rises? “
No I mean Falls. Imperial fell on the day before ex-dividend - as did Glaxo - as do almost all UK shares. Check the historical prices out and see for yourself.
This is because market makers collude to drive the SP down on the day before. Reason - traders are less likely to sell when the SP falls especially the day before ex-dividend. And it doesn’t stop there - the MMs collude to set the price post dividend. My 1350 prediction is looking good - the SP has now gone ex-dividend for 3 days not 1. And I expect this trend to continue for at least another 3 days.
Rule 1) Always sell 3/4 days before ex-dividend
Rule 2) buying a few days after ex-dividend is the best time to buy - SP fall is usually 3/4 times dividend.
Rule 3) Never hold a UK share for the dividend- the bigger the dividend the more the MMs will shaft you.
Toff
"The day before ex dividend the shareprice invariably falls"
I assume you mean rises? Looks like a reasonable time to get back in soon...I'll wait till it gets to 1350.
In uk markets it’s always best to sell 2/3 days before ex-dividend date and buy back a few days after
I’ve been around market makers long enough to know how they work. They collude to fix shareprices in advance. The pattern is this..
The day before ex dividend the shareprice invariably falls - this is the MMs lining the stock up for a fall.
On the day of the dividend they mark it down way more than the dividend. But it’s not only for a day, it’s marked down for several days. You end up with 3/4 times the dividend off the shareprice.
If you ran a casino like that you’d be shut down. Only in the unregulated UK. Other markets don’t permit these practices.
Best time to sell is 3/4 days before the dividend- imperial rise to 1555 about 3 days before it went ex-dividend. Since then it has plunged by 168p.
Buying UK shares for their dividend is like getting in a boxing ring and taking 25 blows to the head just so you can hit them Once.
Glaxo also got hammered by the market makers. They fell from 1468 to 1368 after issuing a 19p dividend
The rule with UK shares is ALWAYS sell before ex dividend and buy back afterwards when they’ve been hammered into the ground. Until réfutions exists to curb the excesses of market makers this method will reduce your losses dramatically. After all would you prefer 48p dividend or a 168p discount on every share.
Toff