Member Info for Terraplane

I agree that competition in the telecoms market has been a good thing for driving innovation and better services for customers, nobody can disagree that without that competition we would not have the services now available. But yes, too many hopeful chancers, encouraged by OFCOM, have left a mass of unwanted build and a lot of very predictable debt. Telegraph poles in my district of London are festooned with unconnected fibres, the remains of an altnet that ran out of money. Good job they didn't have to provide their own poles.

Indeed true snoopz. However, this is nothing new in the world of telecommunications and the idea of small "altnets" being given preferential treatment over the bigger incumbents goes right back to the 19th century; 1898 in fact, when the National Telephone Company held a near monopoly. New companies were given licences by the goverment in an attempt to open the market to competition. This resulted in almost all of the new companies failing and being swallowed up by the GPO. End of competition for the next 70 years until Mercury Communications were allowed into the UK telecoms market in about 1984, I seem to remember. They installed distinctive payphones and had a lot of business clients in the City of London but their service and maintenance was decidedly inferior to BT and businesses grew tired of waiting two weeks for a Mercury engineer to come and fix a fault. So that attempt at opening the market for competition didn't work either and Mercury eventually disappeared into Cable and Wireless. Now we have OFCOM doing everything in its power to prevent BT from becoming a monopoly again and all that seems to be happening is altnets going bust. Yes, there is a much more competitive market and punters have a very wide choice of suppliers but none of them can exist without BT, its engineers and its massive investment in infrastructure.

Roll on the dividend reinvestment.

Fleccy, no point in trying to explain backhaul to the spacemonkeys, they don't understand what backhaul is, what it does or how it works. I'm not reading any of the filtered gibberish but I can guess what's being said.

Of course BT Wholesale's backhaul capability and distribution far exceeds anything that the other providers have got, or are willing to pay to provide. Perhaps this might be a good juncture at which we point out to the less able that the backhaul is a BT Wholesale product, nothing to do with Openreach. That should cause a few frowns.

Snoopz, don't waste your time trying to engage with candied fruit and arsewipe. They are to be pitied and filtered. I see a sea of green over the last few days which indicates that this pair of space monkeys are probably still spewing forth their imbecilic ravings about bids and the greed of the BT engineers. I urge you to switch them off before you get sucked into a vortex of ignorance and a black hole of stupidity. They have nothing to say because they understand nothing.

"90000 staff to be made redundant, I believe the last audited head count was 89k ISH globally."

err...No.

BT global headcount is currently around 130,000.

The target is 75,000 - 90,0000 by 2030.

So headcount reduction is between 40,000 - 55,000.

Fortunately I have flitered out the scum so I won't see them gnashing their toothless gums in anger. However, I see a green post that one of them just stuck in, probably denying that Ms Kirkby knows what she's doing and that Openreach will be sold when Mr Mittal sacks her.

She's right to say that she doesn't know what impact AI will have, because nobody really knows. Better to be honest than to make false claims. As the late, great David Bowie said:

"If she says she can do it

Then she can do it, she don't make false claims"

Roll on the dividend reinvestment.

Openreach generates money from providing connectivity to service providers, providing network infrastructure and maintaining the network for BT and all the service providers whose services use it. It contributes the biggest slice of BT's overall income. It does all this without owning the network.

No, I'm not wrong. BT Group own the network infrastructure. Openereach is a BT owned subsidiary company that provides connectivity and maintenance on that netwrok. Openreach do not own the network or any part of it. They manage it for BT but they do not own it. Yes, Openreach is a fully autonomous entity but it is owned by BT Group and all the profit, after operating costs, made by Openreach, goes to BT Group. Trust me, I worked for BT on Network planning, voice and data and I know how it works. I hope that makes sense. Bud.

Mararab - The network and infrastructure is owned by BT Group. Openreach are a BT owned company that provides connectivity on the BT network to more than 600 service providers. Openreach own nothing. There are some argumentative cretins on this forum who can't or won't understand this simple truth. I have filtered all of them (or all of the aliases of the same idiot) so I don't have to continually see their idiotic ravings so candied fruit et al, don't bother replying because I won't see your childish drivel.

If Openreach is sold, which I don't believe will happen, the Network doesn't go with them. I have explained why in previous posts.

All the migration work will be done by Openreach, regardless of who the retail service provider is. Altnets don't do any work in BT exchanges or street cabs.

Hello Albert, nice to see you swing past.

Now, let's do a quick refresh on Einstein's special theory of relativity.

Having worked out that light travels at a constant speed that cannot be exceeded, he used this knowledge to create his famous formula - E=mc2. Which, as we all know, means that the amount of energy contained within any object with mass is equal to the weight of that mass multiplied by the speed of light squared.

Using this beautiful equation we can work out that the amount of energy contained within 1 kilogram of mass - that is any mass, the material is of no consequence - is equal to 90,000,000,000,000,000 joules. That's a big number, innit? To put it into perspective, that amount of energy would power a 100 watt lightbulb for 28,519,279 years. Astonishing, no?

Stick with it Albert, your evolution depends on it.

That's more like it.

You've found your level again.

Have a banana.

Kirkby's interview with the FT was on Sunday 15 June.

On Friday 13 June the share price closed at 184.05.

On Monday 16 June the share price closed at 185, a massive increase of .05p

On Tuesday 17 June the share price closed at 188.2, a huge increase of 3.2p

As we speak, the share price is hovering around 188-189.

As I said, the announcement by Kirkby has, so far, had a negligable effect.

Try again.

Indeed it does include humans, an evolutionary state which you may one day attain if you continue with the banana diet an dividend reinvestment strategy.

Now, Einstein's special theory of relativity proved that the speed of light is a constant which cannot be exceeded. He proved this, not by hypothesis but by empirical evidence.

Oh, I know exactly what a simian is, as I have already explained to you, Albert.

Banana?

Dividend reinvestment is a good idea for long term investors. Lovely free money compounded over the long term reaps rewards.

Holding BT shares at an average of £5.85 is a hairless Greek tragedy.

Have a banana.

Oh dear, you are sinking into a morass of confusion and befuddled incomprehension.

Have another banana.

As you like to present yourself (and your laughable witterings) under different identities, I have a very suitable new nom de plume (or alias if you don't understand French). I shall henceforth address you as Albert, in honour of your heroic ancestor, Albert II, who, as all skoolboy do kno, was the first primate to reach space in 1949, thus paving the way for human space exploration. Albert II was a true hero, a pathfinder and a credit to your species.

Sadly, Albert II didn't survive the journey as his capsule didn't deploy its parachute on its return to terra firma and he perished upon impact. But a hero he will always be and thus you should be proud of your ancestor.

So, let's raise a banana to Albert, our befuddled simian!

Hurrah!

What I said: Openreach don't supply end-user products, either wholesale or retail.

This means Openreach do not supply broadband, telephony or any other end-user products. What Openreach provides is CONNECTIVITY. This means Openreach CONNECTS service provider products, such as broadband, to customers. As I said before, this equates to the gas fitter connecting your gas oven to the mains gas supply, but he doesn't supply the gas or the oven. It's really quite simple (as are you).

The wholesale product that Openreach provide is connectivity, infrastructure and maintenance to large customers, i.e. businesses, including service providers (more than 600 of them). The wholesale bit means that they provide connectivity and maintenance in large amounts. Rather like buying a large amount of cheese from a wholesale cheese supplier.

Now, the bit you are failing to comprehend is in part two of your missive - These CPs then use this wholesale access to deliver services to their own customers.

This means that the CPs (service providers - the companies that sell broadband, telephony, etc) provide customers (the end-user) with those products using the connections provided by Openreach. And here we return to the gas fitter analogy (you can look it up if you don't understand the word). Once the gas fitter has connected your oven then you will be able to connect to your gas supplier of choice, just like you can choose your broadband supplier.

Now, if you have to consult AI to tell you exactly what I have already told you, then I fear you are a lost cause, intellectually.

I will leave you with this thought: You can sit with a monkey for a thousand years explaining Einstein's theory of relativity and after a thousand years you will still be talking to a monkey.

You, my friend, are the epitome of that Simian.

Have a banana.

"The next few weeks and months will tell us all we need to know."

Here are some things you need to know:

BT owns the network infrastructure.

BT sells end-user products - broadband, telephony, mobile etc which Openreach connects and maintains.

Openreach supply connectivity, infrastructure and maintenance.

Openreach don't supply end-user products, either wholesale or retail.

Mr Mittal doesn't run BT.

Mr Mittal is not the de facto CEO of BT.

Mr Mittal did not read the riot act to the BT senior management team.

Redundancies will come over a period of time, not in the next year.

The BT share price will gradually increase to a level between £2.50 - £3 over time, but probably not in the next year.

Reinvesting BT dividends is a good idea for long term investors.

People holding BT shares at an average in excess of £5 are a bit cattle-trucked.

Aus3009,

It is not a matter of terminology, it is simply that you appear unable to understand English, as well as being completely in the dark as to how BT and Openreach work.

You say: 'A little bit of think on your part would see I refer to the classic definition of a “provide”'.

Is that so?

Classic definition of "provide", you say?

Provide as in to give something to somebody that they need?

Provide as in to make something available to someone to use?

Provide as in the legal terminology that states that a particular piece of legislation will cause something to be carried out as a result?

Provide as in something can happen as long as certain terms or agreed measures are adhered to?

All perfectly understandable uses of the word 'provide' and every one a classic, no?

Have a bit of a think about it.

You say: “Communications providers (also called service providers) are the organisations that sell phone, broadband, data and TV services to homes and businesses.”

Yes indeed. Congratulations. However, Openreach is not one of these organisations, is it?

You say: "As in “retail” in my post."

Openreach is not a retail organisation.

You say: "I’m referring to the provision / provide, as in the engineer who connects the fibre (provides) will likely be Openreach".

Most likely it will be an Openreach engineer but he won't be providing an Openreach product, will he? In the same way that a gas fitter will connect your gas oven but he doesn't sell the gas.

Are we still on the same page?

Good.

You say: "I thought that was clear. I guess “provider” is an Ofcom invented noun, where as I’m talking about the verb, an action to walk to my house carry a cable / fibre / provision."

No, it is very far from clear because, to put it in simple terms, you don't know what you're talking about. As for Ofcom inventing the "noun" provider, that just about sums up the level of your intellect and the paucity of your grasp of things.

Here's a bit of advice: try to educate yourself a bit; you never know, people might give you a bit more creedence if they could see a modicum of intelligence at work.

I should start with reading about how BT and Openreach operate and then, perhaps, how to construct a compelling argument using grammatically correct English, along with factual evidence to support your argument. Correct spelling is also, of course, essential.

I look forward to your erudite reply.

Take your time.