Member Info for Phimx

Shez123: I've done my research where exactly are the strong buys?

Old blue: Almost as much time as you spend ramping it. You said it, tiny mCap and why is that ? The vast majority of sensible investors think it's a no hoper. Obviously the recent rise didn't allow you to recoupe your losses, you'll have to keep trying.

Over at Octagonal John and Nilesh do rather better. Their total emoluments
J Gunn £540,000
N Jagatia £75,000

Presumably that's where they work hard for their money

the.buffalo: Mr Nilesh Jagatia is the sole shareholder in NJK Associates. So acting as the FD of Inspirit he gets 30,000 for writing the financial reports. With his other hat on, at NJK Associates, he picks up another 30,000 for consutancy fees to the FD at Inspirit. He must consult with himself ! Excellent work

the.buffalo:
J Gunn 80,000
N Jagatia 30,000
A Samaha 12,000
S Gunn 12,000

Also is the statement " In addition to the above 148,000 wages and salaries for employees has been included in the development costs. Since there is 3 declared employees which include directors I'm not sure what employees would be paid. Presumably P. Booker gets paid somewhere !

Now the Development cost is 169,000 - 148,000 = 21,000 so a massive amount spent on development !!!!!!!!

Also 30,000 was paid to NJK Associates for consultancy fees. N Jagatia (the Inspirit FD) being the only member of that company !

PM709: I followed the Flowgroup story on LSE. It was plain the FLOW wonder/game changing boiler couldn't deliver what was promoted, electricity and heat from a boiler using a scroll compressor. The basic problem is how do you extract energy from an already efficient boiler. Of course on that board as this, people fanatically ramped the share. FLOW went to the wall and £50 Million was fleeced from the great British well intentioned. The FLOW boiler was never physically seen but there were many RNS statements pushing the story. I want people to invest with their eyes wide open, unfortunately even intelligent people can't control their common sense when the promise of easy money is waved in front of their noses. The lure of millions of boilers replaced each year in Europe is a good line to use!
I believe the Charger will never be a viable/commercial product. Inspirit dangle carrots for fools but the carrot fades away over time and is never seen or heard of again. Never a breath of follow up from them. Is that the strategy of a company with a world leading product about to go to market.

While I'm here your statement " These calculation have no impact on marine development! you see they are not going to buy it as product it more like they going use parts of the tech."
You are mistaken , see the latest RNS
… we continue with our discussions on how we can progress adapting our Inspirit Charger engine on two versions of their marine engines…
This clearly means the Charger will be adapted to be used with their marine engines, so Inspirit say! It will run from the waste heat of the marine engine. Therefore the operational performance and efficiency of the Charger is absolutely fundamental to any marine application. Using parts of the tech means simply adapting the heat generating function to run the Stirling engine part of the Charger. That has always been an advantage of the Stirling engine i.e. being able to use different fuels to provide the heat but that necessitates using different burners or heat feeding mechanism to the Stirling engine.
IF THE CHARGER DOESN’T PERFORM AS STATED THERE IS NO MARINE PROJECT, HENCE THE EFFICIENCY FIGURES ARE VERY VERY RELEVENT.

Weathergeek: So how is it possible to get 6.4 kW max out with 20 KW max in at 15% efficiency ? The point is, you cannot produce 6.4 kW with ONLY 20 kW in if the efficiency is only 15%

Dulyred:
What do Inspirit mean by 15% electrical efficiency ? Is it gross or net ?
Converting 20 kW i.e. the maximum input available - they say so, at 15% efficiency I would get 3 kW out - not 6.4 kW
What calculation gives an output of 6.4 kW with a maximum input of 20 kW ?
Show me please, where's the boffin when you need him ?

From the INSP web site
Max Gas Heat input (GCV) 20 kW
Max heat Output @80/60 15 kW
Min Heat Output @80/60 5 kW
Max electrical Output 6.4 kW
Min electrical Output 1 kW

And also
“ The appliance offers an overall efficiency of ~90%, divided between electrical efficiency (15%) and thermal efficiency (75%), and compares very favourably with conventional boilers, which typically run at lower efficiency in real world situations and deliver no electrical output at all”

Remember the beauty of the Charger lies in its ability to produce electricity from the waste heat produced from a hot water boiler and there lies its supposed advantage.

Now to produce 6.4 kWe at 15% efficiency you need burn 42.6 kW worth of gas. First question how do we get 6.3 kW out for a maximum heat input of 20 kW ? Second question, the cost. To burn 42.6 kW of gas is about 3.5p per kW so it has cost the owner 3.5p x 42.6 kW = £1.49 for 6.4 kW of electricity i.e. 1.49/6.4 = 23.3p per kWe. That’s a lot more than you would pay the Grid and in the summer your house will be hellish hot – because 36.2 kWt was heating water somewhere or else it was thrown away.

Alternatively if we burn Max Gas Heat input of 20 kW at 15% efficiency the Charger will produce 3 kW. Again 20 kW x 3.5p = 70p. For 3kwe. So it has cost 70/3 = 23.3p per kWe. Again more expensive than the grid.

In the winter perhaps your radiators are going full blast and you need 15 kWt then you are burning 20 kW and have 5 kW waste to produce 5 kW x 15% = 750W of electricity, lets hope you don’t need lights or the freezer or the tele on !

Lets look at another case; what happens if the Charger produces the 1kWe minimum. So we need 6.6 kW into the Sterling engine i.e. it needs 6.6 kW of waste heat, since the boiler is only 75% the boiler needs to burn 26.4 kW to produce the 6.6 kW waste. Cost 26.4 kW x 3.5p = 92.4p equivalent to 92.4p per kWe. Wow that’s some price for a kW of electricity. AND
Note I haven’t even included the 10% waste of energy that occurs because the combine efficiency is only 90%

For newcomers. For many years the Inspirit web site claimed the Charger produced 3 kWe and 15 kWt, simultaneously from 20 kW in, work the sums! No I'll do it, for 20 kW in and 15 kW into heating water there must be 5 kW waste- this produce 3 kW of electricity thus the efficiency is 60% WHAT!! This was then upped to 6.4 kWe again with 15 kWt at 20 kW input. It seems perpetual energy had become a reality! the efficiency is now 128% ! Around December 2019 their web site went down and a new site appeared, it had been redacted and no longer was 'simultaneous' mentioned. Strange because many thousands of hours testing had been carried out, including by third parties ….. and nobody noticed any oddities. The claims for those figures are still in the RNS statements.

So being no boffin I doubt my figures, can someone correct my maths and explain how the Charger operates - given their figures ?

Perhaps the Hydrogen fuel cell will appear sooner than expected, so long the Charger.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-53238512

PM709: You deliberately missed the last part of my sentence, thereby changing the context.

"The marine engine "project" is an application of the Stirling engine technology i.e. the boiler to use the waste heat produced in a ship to create electricity, specifically Inspirit's Stirling engine technology"

The technology isn't being used as a boat engine but as an energy convertor - heat to electrical. That's what Inspirit have been attempting to do for the last decade.

Best of luck with your wait.

Your investing strategy may pay off in time for your funeral

PM709: Let me get this straight, you expect nothing from the boiler but "a constantly evolving r&d project". You are placing your faith and money on the "marine engine" To quote you " My only interests are with the marine engine manufacturer, that could be something if successful"

That makes no sense. You don't seem to appreciate the what the marine application is doing.
The marine engine "project" is an application of the Stirling engine technology i.e. the boiler to use the waste heat produced in a ship to create electricity, specifically Inspirit's Stirling engine technology. To make that plain, it is a larger version of the Charger - the boiler, I think a proposed 300 kW version. Now since you don't think the core technology, i.e. their 6 kW Stirling engine is going to get commercialised then why do you expect a totally undeveloped dream of a 300 kW version to be successful. Even if developed, how many would be sold? Although a Swedish submarine (Kockums) has successfully used a Stirling engine , the engine (powered by fuel on board) simply created electricity to drive an electric motor; the Stirling saving batteries, The fundamental reason for doing this was to produce a very silent running boat, one of the plus points of the technology. Economically it is a waste of money but that is as nothing to the defense industry. Large ships burn the dregs at the bottom of the oil industry and although nautical miles per gallon is pathetic, something like 100 m per gallon the fuel is cheap. So, the marine application will not power a ship the economics won't work but it may be a reasonable application to produce electricity. Even then large ships can use the waste heat to purify salt water, heat cabins etc. The question is how much waste heat is there ?

jimb2: Random ?

PM709: And will you risk your money ?

PM709: Elon Musk was in nappies when this Stirling engine device started development - that says it all

PM709: From RNS 27 Oct 2014

Inspirit Energy (LSE AIM: INSP) is pleased to announce that it has entered the stage of finalising its commercial design and committing to tooling with a number of its engineering partners and suppliers. This significant investment demonstrates Inspirit's progress towards achieving full certification approval and commercialisation of the Company's highly efficient mCHP micro co-generation boilers.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

How can anyone have any faith in a company that published the statement above in 2014?
One of the many examples of statements made but never to be heard of again.

I'll agree, a marine application could be a good environment for the Stirling engine to operate in, lots of heat to use to create electricity but I'm guessing that they already harness that heat in a modern ship. But since they don't have a charger to demonstrate the residential application, the marine development will be a long time coming. You being a boffin will also realise that it may not be straight forward to simply scale up a 6 kW design to lots of kW.

PM709: How do you make the jump to " This clearly means there is advanced conversation taking place regarding tech share or joint production"

No it means cut and paste from the 2019 report, nothing more.

Enertek were going to carry out certification many moons ago but that faded into nothingness - as usual. Read ALL the RNS statements

Pm709: regarding the statement "That a European partner may do EU certification" Below is part of one of my posts dated 25 April. Those discussions continue and continue

------------ 25 April -----------------

Oldblue: On the 30th March I wrote about spotting the difference between the half year report of 2019 and 2020. The 2020 version was just a cut and paste of the 2019 report. It shows the contempt INSP has for its shareholders, posting a virtually identical report, What this tells me is absolutely NOTHING is happening, there is nothing new to report in a year.

....2020 The Group has continued discussions with a European company that may carry out the certification process...
....2019 The Group has continued discussions with a European company that may carry out the certification process.....

Pm709: Look at the accounts. As you say there are many ways to develop a product. A major product like this will require more than 4 people it is complex. It is supposedly going to revolutionise home heating and reduce your electricity bills. Many people and companies have tried over the past 200 years to turn the Stirling engine into a winner. Please note that for many years and until they recently revised their web site they were claiming 21kw output for 20 kW input. Now you being a boffin should see that may be ever so slightly impossible. Also you should read the many RNS statements that claim trial and test arrangements and many other things but there is never follow statements or results to confirm what was claimed ever took place. You need to do a lot more reading and research. We now have claims for solar projects about 30 years behind the rest of the world!

This project started life 40 years ago !!!

PM709: Putting together an innovative device for the residential market is very complex and expensive. People, companies, consultants etc don't work for nothing. The methods of manufacture/production have changed but a product like this isn't going to come out of someones basement, that stage was a long time ago. John Gunn bought the basement device back in 2011 with the intention of going into production. From all the RNS statements they waffle on about the millions of replacement boilers that Inspirit could tap into, well lets no get carried away, just say tens of thousands. To turn out that kind of product requires muscle and money. Neither is in evidence from this outfit.

Why would they share tec, they are supposed to be creating something unique and world beating. They have patents for it !

I'm well aware you don't build 1,000 units of a particular prototype before you've figured out if the thing works. According to RNS statements there has yet to appear a working prototype of the latest incarnation, the device that will be launched upon the world this year. In 2015 John Gunn stated - in an interview - "we are actually producing our first units" 5 long long long years ago. No mention of EU certification, no studies completed or published. No trials completed in residential homes, no reviews etc. etc. NOTHING