Member Info for extrader

Hi calamari,

I 'get' that there's a risk if they actually sell, but -if you've got 5 billion shares to play with (if , Heaven forfend, they were to talk to each other) , you've got a lot of muscle for a short attack.
You're only really at risk if something 'unexpected' happens.
And even the fanclub are now openly acknowledging that the s/p is being manipulated, so it wouldn' be a big stretch to speculate that these 3 might - conceivably - be dancing to the 'ring-master's whip', too. Or , at least, be aware of it.
Whoever he/she/they might be.

IMO
ATB

Hi apunter2,

Thanks for this.
(1).."There has been a problem with the share register since the TAG take over
If you look the total shares reported is well over 100%
There are two reason that can happen, shorting and not reporting to the register.
I now believe both financial Partners Group SPA (FPG) and Eurofinleading Fiduciaria SPA (EF) are double accounted.

I think the double counting is because Eurofinleading is holding for others, not a holder in its own right- hence the double counting. And that FPG is double counted because of the cross and reverse shareholdings.
Shorting/non-reporting ? ...mebbe a case of 'not only but also' ?

(2) .."2x 4.98% ( the share register shows three BDC holding 4.98%/4.71% and 2 others showing 4.98%.. so the other three BDC are are already included in holding via 1AF2 and TAG, although the other two could be holding for BDC , just covering possibilities there).
If BDC is Ceresio, I think you're wrong there : Parrot Global ISN'T Ceresio/Fogli's Global; and Pictet ISN't either.

(3) Why doesn't someone who has AZ's ear ask him to update the Company's official website ? He's in a position to know a lot of what is actually going on and is arguably misleading the market by allowing misinformation about HIS company to subsist ?
IMO
ATB

Hi IraMil7,

(1) CVC takes equity stakes in mature businesses, none of them AFAICS banks, 2 points that argue against.
(2) What is their likely tie-in with Ceresio, mentioned in Weathergeek's post ?
(3) We'll supposedly find out soon enough, what difference does it make at this stage ?

ATB

Hi Mr008,

Quite ! The Morton's fork (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morton's_fork ) that then arises is that either
- AZ is as financially sophisticated as he and his CV suggest...yet for some reason he allowed this to happen; or
- he isn't.

Neither conclusion is particularly attractive.
IMO
ATB

Hi Weathergeek,

Yes, it's just a guess.
Pretty sure it's not CVC, wrong nationality, wrong decade, wrong activity (buyout/asset-strip, rather than fund management).

ATB

Hi Mr008,

Thanks for the explanation, which supports my thesis at the time that the 3 x holders of pledged securities would/could be in a position to trade them anonymously to their advantage or potentially (as you appear to suggest), to the advantage of others.

ATB

Hi all,

Interesting RNS.

Not much to go on re identity :.."The Investor is a leading global alternative investment fund manager, founded in the 1980s, with a globally diversified investment portfolio valued at more than $70 billion..."

Try this one for size : 168 Mediolanum Group Italy 74,080 75,717
from https://www.ipe.com/Uploads/j/e/b/Top-400-Asset-Managers-2019.pdf

And start date : "The Mediolanum Group
When Ennio Doris started the Mediolanum Group in 1982, he was launching an innovative project ..." from https://www.mediolanum.com/ENG/12236.html

Banca Mediolanum S.p.A. is an Italian bank, insurance and asset management conglomerate which is the parent company of Gruppo Mediolanum (Mediolanum Group), per wiki.

Main shareholders appear to be "... Doris family and Fininvest. They formed a shareholders' pact for 51% stake. However, the voting rights of Fininvest was in fact suspended as Italian court ruled that Silvio Berlusconi could not own more than 10% stake of any financial institute..." , per wiki.

The story being : .."Fininvest's voting rights on Mediolanum S.p.A. was capped at 9.9999% by Italian Insurance Supervisory Authority despite owning about 36% share capital of the financial conglomerate;[6] the company reverse merger with subsidiary Banca Mediolanum in 2015. Fininvest had a shareholders' pact with Ennio Doris (the pact only bind to 25.5% share each, excess amount of share was not bind),[7] the largest shareholder of Banca Mediolanum, making the pact had an absolute majority in the bank for 51% share capital..."

The reason for the 10% cap ('allegedly') being : "The Berlusconi family does not control the company directly. Instead, its shares are owned by 38 separate companies, all named 'Holding Italiana' followed by a number (1-38), most of which are in turn controlled by Berlusconi. These 'Holding Italiane' have repeatedly come under investigation by the police for various financial and accounting irregularities, slush funds and money-laundering. All of them were created at the end of the 1970s by covert associates of Berlusconi's and received significant investments (several hundreds of millions of euros at today's value) from still unknown sources. Some of their liquidity was even deposited in cash. Much of the documentation of that time relative to the early financial and banking operations of these companies has been lost, in one case in a fire...

A report on those matters was commissioned by the general Dipartimento Investigativo Anti-Mafia (Bureau of Anti-Mafia Investigation) of Palermo in the 1990s from a finance expert working at the Bank of Italy, Francesco Giuffrida, to supplement the evidence in a tentative case against Berlusconi and associates for their alleged involvement with the Sicilian Mafia. In 1998 the case was temporarily shelved because of lack of sufficient evidence to go to trial..."
See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fininvest

IMO

HTH and ATB

Hi Spotify,

.."Extrader 'I can't speak for Chalker' - Your kidding right?."

When I wrote this, I wondered briefly, who'd be the first to rise to the bait. Actually, not briefly - there are a lot of contenders.
But you won !
;->

A bit childish, I know, and I'm almost ashamed of myself. But the behaviour on here is obviously contagious.

Have a great day !
ATB

Hi Nelly71,

To put things in perspective, SJF reports 37 active directorships and 9 past directorships.
Of the 2 'fails' you reference ,
-Viapost Communications had directorships held by STEPHEN Fletcher (dob 1947) and Lowry Trading (presumably Scott, he uses the Lowry link often), both between 10 Oct and 17 Nov 2009 (resigned) so unlikely to have had much say in the longer-term running of the Company.
- the UK Bond Network Group appears to have been some kind of EIS scheme, where Scott was Director, but not named as 'significant control'...and most of the creditors appear to be investors in the EIS. They lost about £ 600K, Scott's vehicle Lowry was the only secured creditor and recovered about £200K of its £500K owed.

Obviously, making a loss is never good, but you'd expect this to happen to an entrepreneur from time to time.

Some - the 'glass half full' types - might even think that making a (partial) recovery showed the sort of 'business smarts' you'd want to see in a Director of a company where you were invested.

ATB

Hi poorinvestor,

.."Before you look into symes business plan, you should understand the concept of joining finance and technology, I don't have the time to go through it with you but it is the need of now and the future. .."

I can't speak for chalker, but I think even the non-specialists amongst us 'get' that

- the concept sounds great and has lots of applications/potential;
- SYME has a business plan to harness that potential;
- SYME's business plan is in course of being rolled out, it says in RNS's that it's 'proven' , hasn't shown what most reasonable people would regard as 'proof' - but is expected to do so shortly.
- there's a lot of behind-the-scenes movements in shareholdings that suggest SOMETHING is going on, but until we see either (1) details of a successful first monetisation and/or (2) details of 'final' shareholding structure,

nobody can be 100% sure of how this will play out.

IMO
ATB

Maybe not...but Flu-v is nebuliser delivery, AIUI.

On an unrelated matter, I believe the Pfizer vacc is joint with Fosun China and BioNtech of Germany
Making 2 + 2 = 5+? maybe CF was seeing them...?
ATB

Hi 99icecream,

Thanks for the link...and good to see that the CFO sees things the same way as Ivan !

ATB

Hi Trader_3,

Thanks for the link !

Worth re-playing this also , from a US listing perspective, ex pogue on a d v f n :

.."Interesting commentary on ORPH 6min 30 secs in is the beginning
hTTps://shows.acast.com/uk-investor-magazine-flash-briefing/episodes/us-elections-impact-on-uk-equites-and-is-it-more-important-t

One point brought up was the comparison between ORPH and our partner in antibody testing Quotient Sciences, who provide pharma services as well, got me seeking the sedatives again hTTps://www.quotientsciences.com/
$32m revenue however made a loss, Market Capital $665m (its listed on NASDAQ).
We are currently circa £120m.

We need to have a word with CF to get his passport out and get over to NY..."

ATB

Hi 99icecream

.."Glencore, because it will want a higher price than it could get currently..."

Not sure if you're talking about (1) iron ore or (2) Zanaga here.

Re (1) , GLEN's a trader, so would hope to make money whatever the spot price;
Re (2), it picked up Zanaga as an afterthought that came with Xstrata and has probably already been written down/off (as ZIOC has done - down that is).
So , if (2) anything it gets for Zanaga goes straight to the bottom line/into cash coffers.
Which may, if this is correct, affect its attitude to 'sorting' Zanaga...and timing, esp. if it is of a mind to be de-leveraging, which is supposedly the case.

ATB

Hi 99 icecream,

Good points !
But...and there's often a 'but'....one could argue that - as the macroeconomics have improved and the s/p hasn't, that the asset has been 'gettting cheaper' for some time...

And we're not talking about 'the market' in general but about some perhaps increasingly motivated 'strategic investors'....

;->
ATB

Hi Veteran10,

.."How can someone offer £1 when the sp is 5p. The DO need to talk the price up..."

Serious, sophisticated potential buyers will recognise that there's a misprice ( Buffett's 'voting machine vs. weighing machine') - esp. when they run the numbers - because of ZIOC's minority status and lack of control over its destiny : the complex, co-ordinated infrastructure development needed to monetise 'value', in a challenging environment.
As to 'talking the price up', by saying what ? People are already moaning that AT's 4-6 monthly updates are 'same-o, same-o', do you really think breathless monthly ramps would help ?
And remember, PI's are only relevant at the margin : Elphick probably only needs a handful of the principal shareholders to be able to strike a deal : an ability to 'deliver' /remove uncertainty that itself is worth a fair bit.

IMO
ATB

Hi Longlad,

Thanks for the feedback.
Re Ivan's track record at GLEN, his limitation (from thi armchair critic) is that he's a 'trader' not a 'digger' (indeed, his and Mick Davis's nicknames) and has generally preferred trading to mining, so GLEN had no competitive edge on iron ore, which has been one of the big turnaround stories since the merger/takeover with Xstrata...and the lead times / delays inherent have meant that it's too late now (if he's retiring soon) to change that.
I have idly wondered whether - as a 'dealer' - HE might do a bit of private enterprise and put in a cheeky bid for ZIOC in a personal capacity, with a view to flipping : he knows GLEN, he knows the market, he knows the likely players...and could act as 'honest broker' in a deal... £1 a share , £ 300 million, would be 'chump change' : the recently-passed GLEN dividend alone would have been worth £ 180 million to him.

Re US/China relations and relevance, whilst both sides now appear to agree that China is a rival, not a friend (Thucydides trap), I think there's a difference in approach Biden vs Trump that might , for instance , put the Australians on the spot.....and affect the urgency (for better or worse) of China's search for replacement resources. And not just iron ore.

I think Africa is likely to be the locus of a lot of proxy competition, both for its resources and demographics, over the next couple of decades.

All IMO
ATB

Hi Sidneysideline,

Ref your 1922, a couple of nuances :
- the recent approaches were FROM, not to, echoing the 29/9 RNS .." Approaches received from a number of strategic investors interested in investing in the Zanaga Project." and
- the costing exercise is a (qualified) sign of interest, IMO : if you costed out a serious house rebuild in 2014, you'd want an update if you were even vaguely interested in pursuing today...especially (continuing the crude analogy), if house prices had moved up big-time in the interim...It'd be interesting to find out the identities of who'll be doing the update, which might give a steer as to who's interested.

Maybe the AGM statement will give another snippet or two.

ATB

Hi all,

A couple of things that might have prompted AT to do an unsolicited (?) interview, mentioning a not-quite-RNSable increase in approaches from 'strategic investors, Chinese and Western' :

- next week sees the US election, in case no-one had noticed ;-<, outcome of which may have some bearing on US/China relations and the extent of the various unnamed investors' interest or otherwise in Zanaga; and
-this Friday is the ZIOC AGM, which will presumably include sign-off/details of the Management Team Retention package for 2020.
This is what they RNS'd last year, 3 days before the AGM :

.."The calculation of the Retention Fee for each Team Member in respect of the 2019 calendar year is due to take place in October 2019.

Each Team Member has agreed with ZIOC that he will use the Retention Fee due to him in October 2019 to subscribe for new Ordinary Shares in ZIOC at the market price of such shares at the relevant time. The number of the new Ordinary Shares so subscribed will be equal to the number of Reference Shares notionally attributed to him for the calendar year 2019. ..

The arrangements for the payment of a Retention Fee for 2020 are broadly similar to those for 2019 described above, except that the amount of such Retention Fee will reduce pro rata if the Team Member's arrangement with the Company ceases before or during 2020. The total number of new ZIOC shares which could be issued in 2020 is yet to be determined and further announcements will be made at the relevant time..."

It'll be interesting to see the size of this year's retention fee (last year 2.8m shares, 1% of shares in issue) , for now, though, AT and co have a vested interest in NOT talking the price up , IMO.

ATB

Hi lokiloo,

My son (who passed on the hack) anticipated that feedback, too, and said that that if it didn't work, maybe it was the size of my instrument...
;-> / ;-<

ATB