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The reasons why things are as they are have been detailed on this bb time & time again & have nothing to do with Shorts, as you understand them. Unfortunately the Stock Market works in many ways dependant on the stock listing set up & Trader participation….volume. Not all things are equal or simple. As I have mentioned many times, everyone want to buy at the bottom but that doesn’t add the 'value' needed to increase the SP. Next time the stock reaches 40p don’t sell, buy more shares & when it reaches 50p don’t sell, buy more shares. But that won’t happen will it.

Anton has already addressed this Short position issue, highlighting that they were not closed in the 2020 plummet to 7p. You can look back for his post detail. They are not being used in their most simplest form. Used for some other reason. If you can figure that out within you lifetime, you’re a genius !

If your asking this question, what is that telling you ? Some Markets around the World are at record highs. Your question should be, what happens next …..

Power, all stocks are price managed by the same firms using the same algo programs. Think of it as a very sophisticated computerised version of the penny slot machines at the Seaside amusement arcades. Eg: At Open Ask up 4% in the shop window, Bid below PDC. Any one bits ?, no, so both down. Next up, low risk tiny trades of minimal value. Standard algo programs.

Hi Stupmy, I should be able to answer your 13:31 question but I’m don’t understand your point. Can you make it clearer. Are you saying that different traded volumes have the same price impact on the SP ?

There are tensions in the Middle East but Oil is still over supplied. Thus the possibility of trading spikes. Spikes as in sharply up & back down. Additionally if the Middle East gets out of hand this could cause a market plummet. Also Chinese property firm Evergrande is being liquidated & there might be others. There has been hints that there will not be any support for these firms. China’s Ghost Cities. Remember TLW is a stock not the commodity.

The ‘so-called 'fundamentals' are the Traders Long Short & Derivative positions. Shorts that PI’s are unaware of. Same goes for da Stocks. Oil traditionally rises with conflict, in this case even when it’s over supplied. Spiky spiky ?

Hi Scrodingercat, good post. I’m of the view that the change has come about due to computers, which can micro calculate everything in 32 milliseconds, faster that We can blink. In the old days account settlement was sorted manually in the back office, so not the clinical, microsecond calculated control. I’m sure the US, commodities & currency’s all work on the same programs, because the graphs are very similar. The difference with the US is that there are far more external participants, ie PI’s. PI participation in the UK looks to be virtually nonexistent, so the Industry can do what they want. And in the absence of paying salaries from traded volume fees, with some listings they turn to managing Client accounts. This is why the moves appear out of sync or irrational. Next generation, AI programs.

I do wonder how shocked folk would be if a book was written clearly & precisely explaining all aspects. If they would understand the complexity which is akin to derivatives & if so continue or walk away. Assuming that it was allowed to be published but as one is not in existence, I assume not.

Hi Stupmy, no in general there has to be a sale / trade resulting in negative value. Long or Short exercised against the Bid. It’s not just moved down.

Hi Stupmy, there are 3 systems at play. Logical Share Pricing, the system that overrides it & the system that the whole market operates on. What you see could be viewed as virtual. This is why sometimes there is no rhyme or reason to what is occurring. PI’s don’t even research Share Pricing so are unaware of anything else. From time to time I look at a well known video site & there’s nothing posted about the inner workings whatsoever. Keeps Joe Public in the dark.

Da Tomato oscillates down & We profit take, some tink it’s buying. Da Tomato oscillates up & We profit take, again some tink it’s buying. So…. what happens next then ? What’s occurring that We ain’t figured oot, why that be plenty that be, ain’t it so. Red or Black take a good guess, your only risking Tomato’s.

I would highly recommend researching & fully understanding ‘Share Pricing’.

Upon completion you will be aware that there are other factors involved. Both elements will present more questions than you can find answers too. Unless you know the right person to ask. Alternatively gamble responsibly.

An Oil price of WTI $80 to $90+ and buyers inputting the value needed to increase the Market Cap. Not just buying at the bottom, which doesn’t add the value needed. Oil is forecast to be flat for most of the year.

Wow Stupmy I’m impressed !. Although charts are historical data they can indicate where the SP is going and include other important indicators that the Industry reference from. I would expect most posters to discuss charts. The fact that they don’t shows how little they know. These bb’s are entry level at best.

Power, I guess you didn’t see my last post, which makes the 38p irrelevant. The Director couldn’t buy at the bottom due to insider rules.

Adieuk32, you’ve been promoted to Co Director & have £100k worth of shares ! The same Industry that manages your Co listing also professionally manages your holding. And is able to borrow it & Short sell it. Over a period of 5 years the SP drops 33%, 3 times. The Income from the Shorts less fees equals almost £100k, so you hold your shares for Free. It’s not a level playing field & the Stock Market is not as simple as people think. Reason for the six & seven figure salaries, plus bonuses.

JMAX, thanks for taking the time to reply

JMAX, at 10:28 yesterday, you stated that Anton missed a big signal just over a year ago, what was it ?

JMAX hi, you do moan at Anton.

These bb’s do give a good insight into the General Publics perception of the Stock Market. Some years ago I found a stock with a continuous dilution program to fund it’s expenses & six figure payroll. I was curious re the psychology of the Share Holders funding it. The vast majority didn’t realise. Over 17 years it never tuned a profit, apart from an investment funded by additional dilution & the SP fell from 40p to 0.8 of a penny. I don’t understand why people only focus on the listed company & not the mechanics involved. I am also amazed that the discussions don’t include any technical detail whatsoever. The intelligent poster’s appear to be the worse delving deep in to the irrelevant detail.

I think I finally may have my answer. In the Pub on Saturday a Women said that people are viewing this from the pre computer age. Back office admin etc & have no idea of the current set up operating in the background. Additionally there is the smoke, mirrors & distractions. They only see the stock. I have also found that folk have no interest in the workings involved.

Re external trading, the participation levels are nonexistent. Where are the ex Industry guys ? Is the UK stock Market viewed as too high a risk ?

Publican, your so right ! more than you probably realise. If someone explained the mechanics operating in the background, you would be amazed by the complexity, shocked but not surprised. It is impressive how secret this is. All surrounded by smoke, mirrors, distractions & Marketing. But complexity to one side this is just a zero sum game thus you only make money by taking it off someone else…. Joe Public.

Dose the Industry managing billions loose money ? why do you think that this is so simple because it’s not, it’s very very sophisticated. The Directors position will be professionally managed with not just exotic Shorts but derivatives too. Currently He’s most likely at a 5% profit. What’s discussed on these bb’s is entry level at best.

If you want to be successful in life you need to play by your own rules. If your playing by someone else’s rules you better know what they are or your going to loose. But to make it even worse We don’t even know the rules here do We, were just guessing…