Member Info for danl90

Just had a look and looks like it doesn’t seem to be selling too well (obviously can’t see how many items were made, I’m “guessing” this purely on sold out sizes/ items of which there aren’t many)

The day after is probably the more vital for the stock price

All the trading update will give is a view on current trading

The day after will reassure investors about how big the “big picture” will be for Asos

"Instead if they build the system themselves the investment becomes an assets and one becomes an Amazon rather than a mere Boohoo, with no moat" - so what is it you think boohoo are renting? Every business has it's infrastructure on the cloud. That isn't unique to boohoo. Primark likely has it's infrastructure on the cloud. What is it you think boohoo is facing a rising cost to a digital landlord for?

Anything related to the platform is an asset and capitalised. Asos CME day on their supply chain answered this well. All third party for the functions but what Asos and developed was all the integration parts ie how do you make all the systems sing and hum together even if they are built by diff people. The other element they say is that they and they alone control all the data and insight. No third party see beyond their single function if at all

So what is it that boohoo are on the hook for? As I say all businesses are in the cloud

"Again you are very thin on proof just read a few articles and believe you know the ways of the world. The fact that Coke is using Hut group does not in anyway confirm that coke is getting value out of it." my point here was that some businesses due to a lack of keeping pace had to take the short cut. I never said coke was getting value. My point was linked to morrisons that they had not taken the decision to build the infrasture earlier so had to take a short cut (Ocado). You just haven't read my point here tbh. Maybe reading ain't so good for you

"Pay an online provider to cannibalise your own stores profits and pay the landlord to make space for returns of online orders, just to annoy the physical customers who stand the queues and watch this happening." - i agree it isn't a good model hence why i think a pure play online is better. It's the same with banks they don't need (or won't need) the branch network now. So many branches unprofitable as people moved to bank online. You are just seeing this shift happening now with clothing

Primark shoppers aren't boohoo shoppers

ok I'll add my thoughts and let you know what I think is exciting here/ things the board could / I'd like to see them shout about and add detail

- TGR system. Been talked about a lot and some very big statements but we need to here what the tangible gain from this will be. Even if it moves GM% by 1-2% that would be huge
- Flex fulfillment and partner fufilment - more detail on this and what the working capital gain will be. Also how will it work in relation to Premier? Ie how do you get next day delivery to Manchester if part of order comes from Barnsley and part from Atlanta? Or don't you
- M&A. Need a clear plan here. So far Topshop looks a good deal but then Asos linked with two beauty businesses and didn't get either. I think M&A can be accretive to Asos as they can give brands the agility and ability to go global. WhiteFox in Aus is a good example. Cool brand with IG world but dresses are the top end price of fast fashion (asos scale can reduce if desired) and the expensive shipping (asos can eliminate this via platform)
- further outline platform expansion. How serve Russia better and also US, do they need a second warehouse on West coast?
- Nordstrom partnership. Probs answer point re US above but to what extent will Asos partner. Can they share logistics networks? I thought it disappointing that Nordstrom acquired a stake in topshop brands. I would have liked to see them directly invest in Asos
- Mix of own brand to grow (organic and M&A)
- face and body. Not sure if we need an Asos own brand but maybe acquire a brand. Refy seems a real up and comer and is on Asos. Buy it now and take it global. Ultimately I'd like to see Asos have a pot (£10m so only small) which each year it takes stakes in up and coming brands. It can school them through marketplace etc and then fully onto asos. Have a call option for the future. But if they have an "incubation" system that itself would be very valuable
- guidance on marketing. A lot more influencer marketing than they used to. Zara does £0. I think Asos needs to pick a more refined strategy here
- renting out platform. Again to small brand which it has an equity stake in is very attractive
- setting out the long term financial goals ie is £6billion the end state or just the beginning
- comments on exchange. Aim doesn't work now

Any more for any more?

But for me if these are answered I see the price moving upwards

"All I know is experience from my company that I work in and other world leading enterprises is that when they implement cloud programmes the costs balloon uncontrollably" - initially but then is this not offset by the capital saving of not having to create this system yourself. Also cloud allows easier upgrades. The business i work for a few year ago changed it's central IT platform it was a nightmare due to the hardware etc. Now it's all cloud and upgrades are done with a lot less fuss (expect any human errors! ha)

Re morrisons it shows a misunderstanding as morrisons was a huge physical infrastructure heavy business before "tech" came around. Therefore it had a choice - invest in tech (it chose not too and fell behind rivals) or not. It chose not too and then when it realised it was behind it had to buy a quick solution. Same as coke uses Hut group

It doesn't make this guy bad at his/ her job it just means they had to react to the circumstance

Re the cost if it was material it would have to be disclosed. It isn't so it's not. Please outline for us exactly where in the business you expect the cost and an estimate of what it costs

I don't agree with the point re "afford digital and retail landlords" I think it is more the point that at some level online sales cannibalise retail so a store becomes a more expensive asset. Zara in Manchester is a good example. You see loads of paper zara bags (these are given when you shop in store) but you also see a few zara cardboard boxes (online orders). There will be a point where if online in an area continues to grow then the store revenues fall and it becomes unprofitable. Might as well close it and you hope the brand loyalty ensures the switch over (case example - asos buying topshop. People still want topshop and moved to shopping asos)

Primark due to low margins and value of goods chooses not to do online as the value of packages likely means the added cost of online would be too erroding to margin. Online cost (as such by boo and asos) are broadly fixed per items ie same time going through warehouse and picking etc. For primark on those £2 shirts you buy they would be firmly in a loss

Therefore Primark could only do online with a rather high minimum order value which fly against it's brand agenda (cheap or staples and essentials)

I write a lot without evidence? Read the articles you see it’s subsidised add to that the input cost of cotton is almost free if the labour is done by slaves

You’ve blurted stuff but not read the article

Digital landlord point tell me what costs boohoo have to Amazon etc?

It isn’t entirely untrue. The law mentioned has passed both the senate and the house

And there are a lot of discussions around data concerns with China. We pulled Huawei out of the 4G mast network on a suspicion

Has Shein as a threat for Primark

I guess as you say Primarks shoppers just want cheap and Shein is cheaper than Primark. If you’re not cheapest what have you got?

https://www.proactiveinvestors.co.uk/companies/news/959904/boohoo-asos-and-abfs-primark-to-benefit-from-international-pressure-on-ultra-cheap-chinese-competitor-shein-959904.html

Who was saying Shein would be a headache?

And the abuse I got...wow!

Next you'll all be talking about test and repeat :)

@rag the point on staples was that that is why primark was able to shift last year's stock. It's not trend

Let's look forward and keep eyes on the big picture here. What do we think we will see at the CME and what would we like to see?

boo bought debs fyi

A lot of this sell off is in response to investors not knowing what the impact will be of rising freight costs

Making everyone nervous. Issue with being a low margin business is only takes a little to whip it out

Long term these costs will normalise and everything return

Agree that Asos has made amazing strides (own brand, acquisitions and also investment into a world class infrasturture)

I really see this as a takeover target. Possibly a Chinese business who wants to cover off EU and US. I also see this as a fit for JD although the cheque might be too big. Amazon is also a key buyer

Nike also

Evidence of falling freight costs is main short term catalyst

Online marketplace IPO

https://www.investegate.co.uk/fruugo.com-ltd/rns/intention-to-float-on-aim/202109080700070447L/

Again Roths in Manchester advising. Being a team of ex-Pennywise staff is paying off for them

Expect the multiple to be very high demonstrating what you want to achieve from Debenhams. Get your valuation from a strong p/e rather than having to invest into a lot of "shelf filling brands"

@kallu

Distribution - not loss making. boohoo are profitable and if spend on expansion was removed would both be extremely more so

Data - all owned and collated by boohoo exclusively

Clothes - boo sells trend clothes to fashion conscious people. This is a different demographic to Primark (have you not understood that yet). Also some clothing items are staples and not trend

Up for sale

JD rumoured to be interested

Rothschild advising. I know a few guys there all of them ex-pennywise so I’m sure they are well placed to sell the business for best value

"There's more competition on line now re: style, attractive pricing, better photography & competitive websites" - exactly anyone can do this part. This nothing new and why these businesses trade on 12 - 14 forward earnings

What you have with boohoo and asos is a platform which allows two advantages which you haven't listed and what separates them from the old school

- distribution network which allows next day delivery for £10/ year. Most of the competitors you will be saying will be charging £6 a time. Also the ability for free return which competitors won't offer

- test and repeat using data and AI both to log individual customers, wider trends and then also use this data to create and push new trends with low cost (boohoo test and repeat with as little as 300 units. This would be in the thousands at a bricks and mortar)

- short lead times (in part nurtured through test and repeat) KM is a good example as lead times for seasons were 6 - 8 months. Boohoo have cut this to 6 - 8 weeks

All the above means other might have nice website and brands (or even good photos) but what boohoo have is trend. They are always on trend, always first (or very close to 1st) and they are cheap. All wrapped in a proposition where the customer gets clothes on demand and not rinsed for £6 delivery

Re Debs. There is a false narrative being oushed that somehow Debs and the brands there are the "game changer" they really aren't so don't get too excited. Pre boo buying they added only £100m of online revenue. Yes boo can improve that but vs PLT and boohoo that will be c.£2billion revenue this year you're missing the big picture

What is needed from Debs is a great operating marketplace as when working and scalable they are VALUABLE. Not on the high street sold for a very very high multiple. This is what Debs needs to focus on. Get investors seeing a valuable marketplace and get them to pay up - it's about value and not just profit

When you say "thin on the ground what do you mean?"

@rag - boo does women's wear. We don't want loads of women's dresses on their that aren't boohoo group. Why would we want to make 10% margin when we can make 50% on own brand

I have explained to you a number of time marketplace is to plug the "gaps" ie lamps, watches, jewelry

Come on @P help us out and play fair

let's just show why rag "cheats" he picked purely jeans as proof that the marketplace is taking time - remember his jeans number is 307 lines

Jewelry - 3981 Products - c.90% is marketplace
Watches - 3297 Products - all marketplace
Men's shoes - 879 Products - c.60% marketplace rest boohoo brand
Lighting - 504 Products - all marketplace
Home electricals - 12 Products - all marketplace
Travel essentials - 143 Products - all marketplace
Child girl shoes - 279 Products - all marketplace
Child boy shoes - 190 Products - all marketplace

I really could carry on. What rag is saying is that this is "taking time" when it's not. It is all there

- Tell me do you think all these products above would be there is boohoo had to directly buy and stock them?
- how much cash do you think would now be tied up in working capital?
- how much capex would have to be spent to get a warehouse used to shipping out clothes to ship a lamp?

Rag is confused as he thinks somehow this has been slower. When it hasn't. We have 3,200 watches on the website. You can buy them now

@Pmoran are you going to correct rag on this misunderstanding? It is irresponsible to allow general misunderstanding to be posted a fact/ opinion. It shows a huge misunderstanding of business

No AoD said this but wasn't aware of Karen Millen.

Boohoo isn't making micro tweaks it's a fundamental shift of the brands (from the mouth of JL and Carol)

Also a camera isn't a moat. Anyone can buy one. Yes it helps the items you say but it isn't a sole value driver as it's something anyone can buy

Please learn more about the fashion sector and how value works. Please explain what expertise you have in value and understanding companies? Remeber the share price is the representation of the value of the company so it is directly the reason we are here

So you've picked just jeans to show that the marketplace is taking time?

Do the same for shoes, lamps, watches, kids, jewelry and womens

Don't pick a one small example and pass this off

You've again misunderstood marketplace - it doesn't take time. The entire range of most brands is on there. Also it impacts the cost point you state as there is no stock purchase or delivery for Debs

It would help if you understood and not use just one small example to prove a point

https://www.debenhams.com/page/concessionaire-brands

The vast majority of the stock on Debs is marketplace. Then boohoo brands and then finally a small bit of wholesale

You've misrepresenting by picking a tiny example