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The vision and spirit of Helios cant you see it fp? ignore and forget the numbers lol
Blimey AB, all the chimps are out tonight aren’t they lol!
A measured post is called back peddling, anything positive is called ramping, and apparently rookie investor is the guru on ARB! Lmfao.
Oh look, ARBK finished up….again, BITF finished down…..again! But hey, it’s way better.
All those who championed Mara don’t even wanna talk about it anymore…yeah let’s buy a ton of machines we can’t run, great shout. Lol
“Backwards looking on Argo and not understanding or just ignoring Helios” - no that’s false. I’ve factored in every since machine that Argo has funded to date. Even if you throw in another $50m of debt to fund the Intel OEM machines with Epic and push them up to 5.5 EH they are still not as well positioned as Bitfarms who have already paid for 6.0 EH and have a goal of 8.0 by EOY. Then consider difference in mining output pre-halving to March 2024, the opportunity cost. Helios gives Argo a very strong base but expansion needs $ and they have maxed out the credit cards to get to 3.9 EH and still need another sizeable lump just to fund phase 1 to 5.5 EH. So had Bitfarms until their margin got called in by Galaxy but they have the benefit of being far more down the track then Argo so their credit crunch has still left them in a robust position. Then the final crux is that Bitfarms productivity is second to none, we see that every month. They don’t have old dodgy S17 machines like Argo & Riot. I appreciate Argo should be on the up and up now with roll out in Texas but no credible case to put them alongside Bitfarms on any analytical basis.
When/ if helios starts to help argo catch up with all the other mid miners , I'll be here to gain from it.
Still can't see the point of losing most of your money here to hope you'll make it back at a future point in time personally, but each to their own
I should also say that none of what I have said about Argo v BitFarms means that Argo at current share price will not be a very profitable investment down the track, after all their market cap is very low; but it is also fairly high risk given the size of their debt and limited cashflow - they are on a bit of a tightrope.
Can't disagree on your last post rookie. Bitfarms is the BTC per EH that I will measure against going forward, to hopefully prove the benefit of immersion overclocking. I fully expect Argo to take number 1 from them by year end. Yes ideally we'd have no debt, but ideally bitfarms wouldn't either. All miners are high risk just now, and it's built into the price. Any miner that survives this downturn, however long or short, will likely see their share price multiply.
AB
But my usual answer is don't buy Argo if you don't think they are going to succeed, rather than posting nonsense on this forum.(what was the nonsense part)
Then Rookie investor posts his ‘facts’ ie the numbers
And then you say this
Bitfarms is the BTC per EH that I will measure against going forward, to hopefully prove the benefit of immersion overclocking.
Its mad how biased towards argo you are AB when any modicum of research shows that right now argo are one of the worst performing miners worse than mara per eh equivalents, and you love telling people about the **** show of mara.
They mine and own a hodl btc that argo are trying to aspire to numbers wise.
You went from nonsense post with rookie investor to using bitf as the benchmark for output eh equivalents. I find it very bizarre! And I go back to this ‘crisis actor’ for argo because unless someone puts you in your place like Hexam did with the all in mined figures and now rookie, it then becomes agreeable to you. You mentioned investment in bitf but didnt know anything about them, but always always you say argo are the best, and then of course the calamity of your eh predictions!
You have a lot of shares here I guess that doesn’t help the cognitive dissonance you have in Argo but that doesn’t mean all the negatives for argo are false because you say so. Argo have little cash and little hold and that is extremely precarious at this moment in time. Its becoming clear how biased you are and clear facts in other miners are derided by you as nonsense, id say slowly but surely your investment case in argo is becoming nonsense, so tread carefully x;)
Btc needs to go up and fast! if it doesnt Argo are in a lot of trouble !
Yes I'm pro Argo. No issues with bitfarms, but to say they are better on every measure I disagree with. I'm sure I could come up with plenty of stats where Argo wins out.
Yes I mention mara as they are your example of great management, given you say how bad Argo's is all the time and hold mara in better esteem.
Yes I underestimated the 200mw eh. Got that wrong I admit. Typical Argo outperforming lol.
"I'm sure I could come up with plenty of stats where Argo wins out."
How can you be so sure without looking?
I'm not so confident. Rookie seems to have covered most of the main stats and on the costs side BITF had similar or lower costs per coin mined (whether all-in, direct only or on a cash basis) in Q1. So whatever stats you might find where ARB is currently better I'm struggling to see what they might be and, even if you do, how important they are.
Just because the current stats are better though (and some of the projected stats too that Rookie provided) doesn't mean BITF is a better investment than ARB. That depends on many other things as well, for example relative market cap as a starting point, execution of their respective strategies, immersion benefits for ARB and the success of the intel tie-in, activities beyond mining etc. etc.
A lot of this is a matter for judgement and I don't know BITF well enough to make that judgement but I certainly wouldn't make it myself without looking and that seems a worthwhile thing to do especially as the stats appear to compare so favourably for BITF at the moment.
Typical Argo outperforming lol.
Where?
Lowest mined numbers, lowest eh equivalents (lower than Mara) but typical Argo outperforming lol you cant make this 5hit up anymore x;)
We were going to receive news soon about the mining pool fiasco its all gone very quiet as Terrapool mines the correct equivalents without Argo ? that news soon was 5 weeks ago ! lol
Lets see what hodl is left in next weeks update and the collateral thats needed for these loans/ debts !
Im sure its gonna be a great update.....
for me x;)
It’s funny isn’t AB, all these numbers get thrown up on here seemingly to try to highlight how ARB is doing everything wrong yet where are all these other superb miners with huge hodls and impressive mining numbers?? Nowhere is the answer. Their hodls will be exhausted just to keep the lights on, mara will be lucky to survive (although I don’t think their board give a s**t really), most of them will be switching their machines off if this continues…all those machines doing nothing! “But it’s a race” I heard you all say…nah, PW has played this well, smart growth, cheap clean energy, absolutely not looking at others in the market and being tempted to race (to the bottom as it turns out) with them.
ARB well positioned to be there, at the front, we’ll into the future.
"Typical Argo outperforming lol.
Where?"
Outperforming its peers , by losing massively amounts of btc equivalents in argo labs.
“Outperforming its peers , by losing massively amounts of btc equivalents in argo labs.”
This statement sums it up really. There’s no looking to the future with you lot is there, finding other ways blockchain technology can be used effectively, keeping an eye on the future whilst operating in the now. How much do you think Boeing, Airbus, Tesla, Microsoft, Apple, Bosch and so and so on spend on R&D for the future? Smart growth!
If I didn't see a bright future I wouldn't be invested here. Time will prove me very right or very wrong.
and if i didnt see a bleak future here I wouldnt continue either. Time keeps proving me correct and it keeps going lower.
I guess we can debate that again at 8-12p x;)
Good spot FP I underestimated the 'breakeven' capabilities of Argo Labs lol its gonna be a fun update next week.
ARB 8-12p
CHAE GLA X;)
And that’s the nub of it AB, if you think the future of a Company is worth investing in, then do it and be confident of that future. If you don’t, then don’t, but don’t waste your time posting about how awful you think it is, go find something you think is worthy of investment.
Outperforming its peers , by losing massively amounts of btc equivalents in argo labs.”
"This statement sums it up really. There’s no looking to the future with you lot is "there,
We are dealing with real time facts.... Not future hopes, based on so many variables outside of miners control.
But for any miner to be compounding their losses in a bear market by gambling & losing money in argo labs is reckless at best....
If btc is struggling, crypto will be struggling . That is a fact
“Their hodls will be exhausted just to keep the lights on”
What makes you think ARB is any better position than the rest? The numbers you are so ready to dismiss as unimportant?
Do you have anything of any substance whatsoever to back that up?
It can’t be a bigger HODL than others. It can’t be that they are not exposed to sizeable debts that are backed by assets that have crashed in value. It can’t be because they are generating cash at the moment. It can’t be because they are more efficient.
So what on earth is it? Please enlighten us.
The differentiator is Helios and the low power costs plus immersion overclocking, plus a focus on cost. However we haven't seen this yet as the may update was dire. Looking forward to next week's update. Hopefully they start unleashing the machines a bit more.
AB - My issue isn’t with the future. Like you I am still confident that in time Helios will, or at least can, be a differentiator.
It’s going to be at least six months before they really feel that though and the start, production wise, hasn’t exactly been encouraging.
In the meantime they are in a precarious position at the moment based on the facts we do know and possibly things we don’t know too as they evaded a lot of questions at the Q&A.
I know you recognise this and are are not happy with the current mining numbers etc. You are pinning your hopes on the future but not ignoring the present. Fair enough. I am too, just a lot less optimistically than you.
But some others seem to have their heads completely stuck in the sand.
Hexam, you get so wound up mate, just be calm. I know you are a numbers guy and that’s great as I’ve said many times before.
For me, I’m not sure how effective all these calculations are when you can’t see what’s going to happen tomorrow right now.
If you took historical snapshots of other very successful, big Companies in other areas of business you could no doubt find times where numbers look less favourable than at other times, it’s the way things work.
I look at the bigger picture, I’m delighted PW wasn’t tempted to enter an arms race, I think Helios is well thought out and ahead of its peers. I like the community engagement (much like Boeing in Seattle, Microsoft etc) it shows people they are here to stay not just pillage and leave. I very much like the focus on green energy, I like the regular investor updates (market space leading with that one), I like the involvement PW has in all things “this space” as he gets to see first hand what works and what doesn’t, and most importantly he’s run the Company in a manner that’s within itself, not overstretched, and with a good weather eye on where he’d like to take it in the future when conditions permit.
Onwards and upwards!
I am perfectly calm. I just have my eyes open.
As do I Hexam, as I keep saying.
In my view you clearly don’t or at least all you can see is anything positive. Anything negative or potentially negative seems completely hidden to you.
Not at all Hexam, the current conditions are undoubtedly a big negative for everybody in this space and indeed just about every other space across the markets.
I just don’t get frothy at the mouth and flap about it as there’s nothing we can do about it. The qualities that attracted me to ARB are still there today and I’m very confident given the cautious approach to date. Eyes wide open my friend.