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I've often wondered why we don't speak with ITM or them to us. After all they produce hydrogen which we need for our fuel cells. They're also going to be a big presence at Shell forecourts for fuel cell vehicle refuelling so why not have some of our EV chargers there as well being fed by ITM's electrolysers. Seems a no brainer to me.
I don’t follow ITM (as I sold out in the teens so don’t like to look anymore) but if they’ve done a deal with Shell then perhaps Shall has other ideas regarding EV chargers?
I know Heath, I used to hold ITM. Big regret as they have really motored since back end of last year. 1.1 billion MC I think so proof that their technology is valid and relevant, which I believe ours is too. I think that sourcing hydrogen is one of our biggest short term problems as it doesn't look like the ammonia cracker equipment has been manufactured yet and the HiiROC option is still very much in development and as ITM can make hydrogen easily and currently why aren't we linking up. If it means approaching Shell too, then let's do it. I'm sure they'd be interested in being able to cater for all types of EVs at their forecourts some of which are in remote areas without infrastructure for quickly ramping up grid supply.
Not so sure its about the sourcing Garonne, I think its the cost.
I regularly pass through Beaconsfield Services on the M40 and always look to see if anyone is refuelling at the H2 pump which is supplied by ITM's on site electrolyzer equipment. I've never seen anyone using it yet. So as the infrastructure to produce H2 is already there I would've thought using it to its full capacity e.g. to power fuel cell EV chargers as well would surely be cost effective. There is definitely a current need for EV charging much more so than replenishing fuel cell vehicles with H2.
It certainly makes sense to me Garonne... Does the ITM equipment deal with storage which an AFC unit could tap into or does it just produce hydrogen when directly in use?
I don't profess to be an expert on ITM's technology Heath but from previous observations the plant, which is enclosed and located about 15 metres adjacent to the forecourt, is quite extensive and includes a large metal cylinder which I can only surmise is a storage container for the electrolysed H2. It does look impressive but is clearly largely redundant as it doesn't look like the H2 pump is getting a lot of use so presumably would have capacity to supply some fuel cell powered EV chargers!
And people on here told me i was mad when i said exactly this at the beginning of covid .https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8351649/Lockdown-waste-time-kill-saved-claims-Nobel-laureate.html
Would the costs of ITM's hydrogen be prohobotive. I say that because I presume they produce 5 9s hydrogen for use in PEM fuel cells. Our cells only require 3 9s.....one of their big advantages and one that I think has been under appreciated thus far.
Transport and storage of the hydrogen is already taken care of by ITM and if they had an opportunity to earn money rather than the unit sit idle doing nothing then perhaps the economics could work out - no doubt at a cost to the driver, but then motorway service fuel has never been cheap.
I thought the idea was afc would be doing that themselves by producing hydrogen on site .So they would be able to fuel up vehicles with hydrogen or charge ev
I believe you can select the purity of the hydrogen depending on which electrolyser setup you go for. I've seen some offer .99 up to .9999.
I've often wondered the same thing, I look at nel who have teamed up with Nikola, if Nikola are setting up all these hydrogen filling stations in California, why not have a dual purpose, hydrogen filling and ev charging, the ev side of course powered by the hydrogen.
Don’t know about that Mucksy but the more I think about it the less I like about us using ITM hydrogen. May work while things are quiet for them but longer term we wouldn’t want to be dependant on them - especially if they go under!
Hi Agusta - I can see that ITM kit contains a purifier and it claims ‘up to’ 5 9’s so in theory could be configurable. PEMs need 5 9s and if these are used in FCEVs then it would be the only option for an ITM link. Roll on the AFC ‘s’ model...
Afc have mentioned it somewhere i believe.
I remember the battery but that isn’t something they appear to be prioritising at the moment. The question being raised here is whether you centralise your hydrogen production with everything consuming off a single point or have a producer per consumer. Multiple may be better as centralised creates a single point of failure and sounds like we’re back to the grid problem again.
The ITM angle is interesting, especially as one of the major reasons for the updated lengthy broker note was to compare/contrast AFC with ITM and CWR.
With the conclusion being that there was potential room for cooperation between AFC and ITM (but not really as CWR as they are more like competitors), it makes you wonder whether this might lead to some institutions looking to create synergy between the companies or at least to invest in them both.
Everything is starting to get very interesting again after the global.madness over the last couple of months.
I was under the impression that AFC were aiming to run their fuel cell system off of H2 cracked ammonia....do we need to invest in ITM ?
From the WHIreland: AFC, ITM, Ceres report one thing that stood out for me was that AFC are not looking to sell electricity but rather to sell their systems to EV charger operators.
Keeping with the ITM analogy, I see both ITM and AFC are up around 10% on Tradegate, which for ITM is 100 million Euro! Roughly equal to our current MC. Surely with a fair wind and that elusive first contract we should be heading for similar territory.
Muscorum....Precisely my point ....why we discusing ITM.