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Bozi, thats absolutely fine. Nothing to apologise for. I didnt take it as a slight, just a fact.
I wonder if the merger has been prompted by a third party? Discussions were taking place and the bidder said they would only move forward if they could be assured of the 15% interest held by CGP and the only way that could be guaranteed was to do a deal first.
Btw Bozi, yup, I fit your description. I've been holding here a long time and want a return asap.
If only cascabel is sold, and Solgold continues exploration, what will happen to the 600+ workforce? will they go all with the new company?the remaining firm cant justify 600+ persons?
BPhil - interesting post with some good points.
You're spot on about us not being the major players, but at the same time, we're thinking about our individual investments, our exit points, etc. We're not thinking about Mather, Irwin etc although we do acknowledge them as major players and ultimately the controllers of the company's destiny.
On your second point, don't fully agree. The asset is of course important but so is the management. Some investors will look at management performance over the last couple of years and have doubts as to whether they will achieve value. There's little doubt of the quality of the asset, but as I was saying earlier, the barometer now for the management is the deal they deliver for shareholders going forwards. For example, I hope Warren and the CGP crew treat their SOLG shares with the same pride that they did their Cornerstone ones and extract as much as they can from an acquirer as they have from Darryl and the company.
I'm not sure I buy the cabs off the rank policy. I think it was wishful thinking from Darryl. I have reservations about how well a Cascabel sale would work for SOLGs SP... for example, say SOLG have 3bn shares in issue fully diluted after the merge and someone buys Cascabel for $1.5bn, that's about 40p. Factor in any tax take by the Ecuadorian govt and budgets for Porvenir and the regionals and I just don't think it would be the blue touch paper many would expect. Happy to be proven wrong though.
Sorry Jerry - didn't explain myself well there. I'm talking about short-termism in terms of outlook from this point onwards.
You make a great point. Many have been invested here for 5/7/10 years. A long time. Many of the folks invested long ago in their investing careers, and such is the nature of the SolGold beast that we're still sat here waiting for studies to complete and wondering what the future holds.
Certainly not accusing you of being short-termist on your investment.
A couple of points there .
Firstly the PIs are weary but let’s be honest ; we aren’t the major players when it comes to company strategy and decisions on the end game . We’re just here for the ride. “We” might settle for 50p .... I doubt the likes of Mather and Irwin will
Secondly, as you rightly point out, the boards performance has been questionable to say the least. But , apart from having a low SP (which imo can change very very quickly with funding , pfs , pea) that is largely irrelevant . It is about the assets . Nobody is buying the past performance of the board , they are buying the future performance of the mine.
Having said all that , I am of the opinion it is cascabel that will be sold soon and Solg will continue the cabs off the rank policy . That in itself will bring a price multiples of today’s SP
Relevant also is the macro economic situation - that isn’t favourable to us but is not something that will stop the likes of the majors looking 30 years into the future and acting now
All in all , I’m much more confident than at any time in the last year. This weeks news re the Japanese and the merger should not be underestimated . If I had funds I’d be adding ...!
Smickster - I've got to ask you, what is your problem?
I didn't say everyone was of the older generation. I didn't say everyone was fatigued. I said that was the general position, i.e. there are exceptions.
There's a small and sturdy band of us on here who I think, given the choice, would be happy to see SOLG continue on the path for true value for longer than say, the next 6-12 months. Of the frequent contributors, I'm talking me, you, Mathersfinger, Rcgl2, FTJNY and Quady. Everyone else I'm either not sure or I'm pretty certain they'd be in favour of a quick conclusion. Your Redknight1's, SeanHunter's, SharketMare, Jezzoo, probably Addicknt and potentially a few others like DBW, Bubble, Shipright, etc.
Now I'm not saying everyone who wants out is old or wrong to think like that, but if you've been listening to what people are saying and have been saying over time you will have realised that of the SOLG PI base, there's an aging demographic. Moreso there's fatigue and that comes from what people perceive to be slower than ideal progress.
I'm not trying to offend anyone. I say it how I see it. I don't have any stats but I've spoken to enough shareholders both privately and within a group setting to have a fairly good feel on the make of of our collective.
Bozi, you have certainly defined me well. I would be delighted with 50p atm. I have been invested in Solgold for 4-5 years which is an eternity for me, and certainly not what I would call short termism, but its all relative.
Its still a great asset and they are still useless management. I cant say that I have enjoyed being a shareholder in this company. Maybe I should have sold when I first met NM. Anyhow we appear to be in the final furlong and I will glad when this donkey gets over the finishing line.
Bozi, you do have a terrible habit of having a negative slant on things though, don't you?
I'm all for reading views on potential pitfalls of solg bit in the last 8 years I've followed this board we have had a large number of posters who seem to post constant doom.
Tbf your posts are a bit more subtle than your impending doom that some others have been guilty of.
Bozi, that's pure speculation on your part.
I don't think talking to a few investors verifies this either.
I'm not of the older generation and Im certainly not in any rush to seea quick(undervalued) offer.
I'm quite happy to hold for the next 5 to 10 years as long as we progress.
Solgold shsrehilders, the PI base at least, is in general very fatigued. Many wanted a takeover 2,3 years ago. The demographic of PI holders frankly shows many of the older generation and they simply don't want the uncertainty of the company continuing. They'd favour 50p in the next 6 months than £1.50 in 2-3 years from now
*shareholders.
So, BPhil, i think it boils down to whether the enlarged SolGold can drive the result we've been waiting for and what shape that takes. £1+ places a chunky premium on the mine for whoever wants to shoulder the construction costs but could we see an auction propel us into that sort of area? Hopefully.
Any work we can do to further enhance Porvenir and maybe make another discovery in the regionals will help us.
BPhil - I'd like to think it is but there needs to be some reading of the room here.
Solgold shsrehilders, the PI base at least, is in general very fatigued. Many wanted a takeover 2,3 years ago. The demographic of PI holders frankly shows many of the older generation and they simply don't want the uncertainty of the company continuing. They'd favour 50p in the next 6 months than £1.50 in 2-3 years from now.
And that isn't a criticism in any way. But it is why the general view is dominated by short termism. That and some less than stellar performance from the company in recent times.
It's something I've discussed with various members of this forum and people I've become better acquainted to through a common interest in Solgold. It's not my way of thinking but it's one I've accepted.
Personally, if we're going to the trouble of joining forces with Cornerstone then we're doing any interested parties a favour in the sense of a substantial cost saving from 1 transaction vs 2. My belief is that we should push on, treasury pending and push an optimised PFS and DFS out there. We should push on with our plans to build the lowest carbon copper mine on the planet from the no1 ranked undeveloped asset (RFC Cambrian 2021). Then we should see what Citi have pulled together in the meantime.
Well I certainly dispute it.
Far too much emphasis on the current share price - that can double in a week from these levels no problem. Sort some funding out, get the PFS and PEA out and we’re in the 30s and 40s . Then this talk of 50 to 70 looks silly.
As always, it depends on multiple bids/interest. But who doesn’t believe that is the case ?
No , I believe a quid and over is well within our reach.
Japanese need copper gold and silver as they expand and cut off supplies from China
Don't dispute any of that Sean.
Sean
I think if all goes well you may well be in the right ball park.
The world is in a bit of a mess but your expectations don’t seem unreasonable.
Lots of i’s to dot and t’s to cross to get there though……….good luck
Colonel, can I just correct a few things in your 1212 post.
They are pre-emption rights not presumption rights.
Its Mitsui not Matsui.
Henry is CEO of BHP. Bristow is CEO of Barrick.
Good afternoon Zoros BHP would never buy CGP as it's a fragmented strategy.
The drop in the SP yesterday makes me shake my head in amazement. One shoe has dropped and all we have to do is to wait for the other. Yes, it was costly, but the way ahead is now clear. BHP is no longer the only way forward.
In my opinion, the only question is whether our BOD (and advisors) can seize the opportunity.
Fair enough Bozi, I'll take your word for that and won't mention it again - and I apologise.
But my basic retort to all the negative things you are saying is - yes, you may be right, but we have paid the price. From the PFS release to now, we have gone from 37p to 17p. We've been punished. All the negatives are factored in. The casual buyer is not interested right now. major news allowed all the recent bargain hunters to escape with a 20% profit.
Yes, we are still in a hole. But we are in a much better position after this week to climb out of it. the Japanese interest - big news in itself - was completely drowned out by the merger news.
The days of hoping for a £1.36 or a £1 bid are behind us. LTHs need to get used to that. 50p is no longer lowball. It took us 5 years to get into this mess and we have only ourseves to blame. But there is still a huge upside to where we are. If we were just sitting at 30p I doubt you would be so concerned with the things that suddenly look life threatening at 17p.
I don't see a quick recovery, but I do see a 40p - 50p exit sometime fairly soon. Anything above that is gravy.
Sean, let me tell you for the last time you are completely wrong.
I haven't sold anything. I've been a continuous holder of SolGold shares since 2013.
I just don't subscribe to the whole notion that everything I say about SolGold has to be Uber positive all of the time.
It's no more complicated than that.
Absolutely Addicknt - I'm not saying more money won't be raised. In fact, I'm confident they'll do even better than what our minimum expectations might be.
I'm just saying how I think the market is viewing it. For want of a better analogy, I think yesterday's news was the keyhole surgery yet the market is still consumed with where it makes the incision. As such, I think a resolution on the funding now sees a much more positive reaction that would be expected.
It could be the solution that Lunch Money has flagged from DJ Crisp.
Also remember, that the AGM is fast approaching and could be as early as end of November. At this AGM, SOLG will IMHO be putting new resolutions to the vote. One of which could be to issue shares without the same presumption rights as before etc etc. In simple terms, the shareholder base changes dramatically once the CGP deal is done. NCM and BHP drop down to just over 10% each. SOLG friendlies (inc CGP) increase to nearly 45%+. That's almost a shoe-in for all resolutions assuming shareholders understand the reasoning behind them.
Suddenly the handcuffs are off and SOLG are no longer backed into a corner or being bullied by their super major shareholder.
SOLG pretty much secured all BoD's future by bagging the bulk of the votes.
Valuestone, Matsui, Boliden... loads sniffing around with interest. Darryl told you months ago... funding is not a problem. We have plenty of options. Looks to me that BHP's attempt to play hard ball may have just cost them a lot more. That will teach them. Losing to Wyloo no doubt still smarting. Lose solg to someone else and BHP shareholders are going to think Bristow is looking a bit old and tired for the future of BHP. Biswas also looking weak after getting a wyloo shoeing on GGP.
Love it.
Bozi all the negative points you keep hammering away at are valid. That's why we are currently at 17p and not 37p like we were a few short weeks ago.
I'm pretty convinced you sold up recently hoping to get back in lower, but even taking you at face value, it's worth reminding you that all the current problems can be fixed and s has been pointed out CGP and the likes of Irwin would not have been up for a merger had we looked (behind the scenes) like we are going to crash and burn with no funding in a few weeks.
The only way is up from here.
This isn't the "market value" today by any means, we are just sitting in the sin bin for the dire performance of our board.
Bozi, I understand your position but would mention one thing: CGP are fully aware of the funding need and I'm pretty sure they wouldn't be doing this if they felt the money couldn't be raised. Either that or they know a corporate deal is already being worked on.
I'm equally sure that if they do the deal and things get bad, they'll be on the receiving end of legal action from their shareholders for gross negligence. Remember, when doing a corporate deal there is an all embracing disclosure process, so they'll have access to whatever information they ask for. This gives me comfort.