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R8 ,I know that zz is definitely economical with facts like why we de listed and encouraged people to buy shares knowing this sh,tstorm was coming and misled shareholders about the terms of the loan .
I dont believe any of the congressmen will have seen the full arbitration doc . I do believe that us gvnt pressure is our best and likely only hope of a reasonable ending , and that it seems to be getting some kind of results . Frr of course now have to come up with the goods .
Just out of interest why didnt frr hand back the land in 2017 ? And avoid this situation .
An arbitration is little more black and white than Iraq but then what would you know?
R 8 ,the us completely obliterated Iraq on false narrative .wake up ffs .
I think hypothetically its a storm in a tea cup dreamt up on this bb unfortunately, like most comments, even mine hahaha.
JV - your first question (Why has the US fully backed FRR if what they claim is false ? ) is the most important. There is no way that the US would have failed to conduct due diligence (for the arbitration and Hope situation) before giving a small exploration their full backing at such a high level. I, and probably 99% of this bb, have never seen an arbitration doc and can’t possibly say whether it looks legitimate or not or been slightly altered !
if the leaked arbitration is 100 % genuine why havent the georgians made more of it than they have
maybe its because they know theres pieces missing
why didnt zaza make more of it
why isnt frontera completely bust
something just keeps not adding up. hopefully we ll get to see why shortly
erazzel - I can't access his picture on Linkedin, but it may be due to my online security.
I'm with you JV, no way is this a 'commercial play' to motivate FRR. This is a geopolitical play by the ruskies and unfortunately this has been the case since at least 2013 imv. Just wished my 'view' came to me before I invested...
The GG and the oligarch are just prawns as is ZZ Top for Uncle Sam.
However, isn't his picture on Linkedin~?
jv123 - Also, the orchestrated campaign against FRR by the GD isn't an isolated case, there's other companies that have been targeted. Both ADC and IC have been recently highlighted and the Georgian Mining Company has had similar problems.
Mole - IMHO FRR has had to keep it's aces hidden in the cases against SH/O for a number of reasons. Firstly, showing your hand too early allows the opposition time to prepare their defence. Secondly, due to different state law, witnesses in Californian civil cases can be subsequently charged in criminal cases, whereas in other states, a civil regulatory settlement renders the criminal matter settled. Thirdly, as pointed out by Bryce Linsnmeyer, there's the safety and security aspect to consider. Take Troy Rillo, a probable witness for FRR as an example, his picture is the only one missing from the YA website.
Amongst all the hypothesising here.......
the LIGHTS ARE STILL ON and most/ majority stated almost 19 months ago it was game over.
Sit back and enjoy the roost coming home.
I hear both sides but I remain unconvinced by the leaked doc.
For me it seems too coincidental that since the GD team came into power all the issue started. It also seems (but not backed up with hard evidence) that as soon as the technical Issues were resolved regarding geology and discussions moved on to commercialisation the roadblocks appeared in earnest. In other words when GD/GOC/Russia realised block 12 was a potential game changer, they stepped in and blocked it. This was done by any means - the Russian way!
At this point the US joined in and amongst other things used FRR as a leverage to drive change on political fronts - and here we are.
The questions that should be answered are :
Why has the US fully backed FRR if what they claim is false ?
Why were the Georgian Gov not willing to discuss a consortium?
Why was the termination not carried through ?
Why have all these issues happened after the dream team came into power ?
Why initiate an arbitration?
FRR have been shafted because of a geopolitical situation.
All the real issues stem from this and Russia was behind it all. This is why the US have used FRR as their gateway to exert pressure and influence change - its important to them and Europe.
Personally i wouldn’t believe a word that comes from the current government not its associated organisations - they play dirty!
Just my opinion of course
No more ramblings from me ??
Also, if Zaza is truthful about the 2 from 14 result - BIG IF - then what kind of information could he have presented to change these results.
a) Pay your tax
b) give back the unworked areas as per PSA
a) the discussion about this would involve VAT offset - irrevalent say panel - ok we'll pay up
b) this would involve - you've made it too hard for us to work those areas - panel makes a 'sorry FRR' judgement
If it was clear the other 12 would be rejected - why should he present anything?
Jv - you'll not be surprised that I share Jim and ODR view - I think that leaked document is likely 100% genuine or so close as not to matter. The GG side are pretty confident and consistent on it. Meanwhile I find the constant alluding to obstruction without any hard evidence provided uncompelling. Its really very similar to what is claimed in the Outrider case. But making hearsay or vague comments without hard demonstrable evidence will not survive a legal process. The heart of both cases are pretty clearly commercial to me - but Frontera have made the GG case in particular very political and the Outrider one seems to have become very personal as observed by the Cayman judge. The problem for FRR I suspect is in the arbitration commentary not the outcome or even any specific details. The broad outcome is really not in dispute - other than Zaza playing semantics around the consequences of a finding of material breach.
Well the lawyers "won" as ever in arbitration. But on balance it has certainly cost FRR very dearly and the GG have at least the 99% returned as a demonstrable outcome. If FRR are happy with the most valuable 1% then they need to get on with it and come up with some ideas as to how to move forward. I do sill suspect it has been in large part more a commercial play to jolt Frontera into action or evict them than political but the danger has always been that politics starts to change the nature of the dispute. But losing on key points most definitely put the whole license in jeopardy as it opened the door to a politically calculated response that has triggered a full scale political and media war. That needs to come to an end at some point.
The current game with the GG has the onus now on FRR to respond (and close this dispute or try and kick it down the road). The employees should be paid and I'll add the company really needs to start to re-engage its shareholders. I hope Zaza tones it down now and gets on with re-building the company and stops the politics. If he is playing for time he needs to use it well.
As for the case against Outrider time will tell on that one but again if they have evidence then obviously they now need to proceed with caution else that needs wrapping up as well but that may have gone too far for that and they want a clear outcome. The obvious target there is loss of the loan notes as punishment but if this has now spilled into 2021 then something has to be done in the interim on the notes maturity and in particular sorting out who owns what.
What has been going on here is like a series of Dallas.
If the leaked Arbi Doc was so damning of FRR, why hasn't it brought FFR's 'House of Cards' down?!
If the leaked Arbi Doc contained information such that its publication by any party would see it legally contravening agreements, but that its leak already put it in the public domain, where the Doc was meant to be simultaneosuly damning of FRR, why haven't those seeking to bring down FRRs 'House of Cards' been able to make further capital out of it?!
There were 14 complaints against FRR as part of the arbi tribunal. GG won two of those. And OK, may be there is something in the '99%'. But it's not where we were working. Not to mention the often said matter of the entire Block 12 on its own being already too big for any SM to do on their own, let alone the other '99%'. Hardly a stunning victory for GG.
Attachment to that leaked Arbi Doc limits thinking about this, expecially given its leak has done nothing to subsequently harm FRRs prospects.
jv123: I have the same opinion as JimSlade has just set out.
It was published by TW I think subsequently but no-one in Georgia seems to have got hold of it; or if they have they're frightened of releasing it. As we know publication requires the consent of both the GG and FRR so I guess anyone else is scared of precipitating a legal case.
Yes: good to read DomFok's article. The pressure from the US/Zaza is certainly yielding reaction; let's hope it develops into more than just words.
jv123 I have read it and I believe its real. If it's fake they went to a hell of a lot of trouble. I didn't see any sensitive information but that's not to say there were other associated documents that form part of the arbitration result that we have not seen.
ODR - excuse my ignorance with regards to the 152 page doc - I didn’t read it. I’m convinced it was a fake however I’d be interested to know what sensitive information is in it which FRR would not want published ? This is the crux of the matter which Zaza has made ref to many times - so if the is genuine then it must contain a lot of this sensitive data ??!
As I said - personally I think it’s an attempt to distort the truth and since it publication on lse has never been quoted or made visible anywhere else. That’s odd - don’t you think ?
Anyway - as per domfoks last message it’s heartening to heat talks are happening !!
jv123 - you asked me "Why are you believing these corrupt people?"
I absolutely do not believe them. They appear to have caused us no end of challenges. But proving that may not be as easy as it my seem.
What I said was that no evidence of that was presented to the independent arbitration tribunal and I believe that the 152 page account that was leaked here looked completely genuine so I believe the tribunal.
daingean: that's a very interesting suggestion. Could you give an example of how that might happen please?
Disclosing all the information to the Arb board,may not have been in our best interest, as providing this.,would prejudice our fiduciary case against Hope.
"in the arbitration document it states that Zaza said all the kind of stuff he has now stated publicly about the GG blocking Frontera constantly. The committee requested evidence and Zaza didn't produce any. So it seems he has none as that would have been the place to produce it so that we could have 'won' the arbitration. So I wouldn't hold your breath that Zaza will produce anything now."
ODR - who said FRR didn't win the arbitration - the very same people who have blocked every attempt at FRR fully commercialising block 12? The same people who said they were terminating the contract but have now retracted on that. The same people who have refused to meet with FRR to discuss compromise and future planning?
Why are you believing these corrupt people? They have an agenda- and since 2013 they have tried their hardest to remove FRR from Georgia.
FRR are dealing with corruption at the highest level here - you need to be smart to win the long game......and it would appear Zaza is a clever cookie.
Obviously this all still can go either way & same applies to the unofficial arbitration document being 100%.
Good morning ZiggyZag. In answer to your question, I have no idea. It would seem a logical thing for GOGC to counter with.
Gipps: in the arbitration document it states that Zaza said all the kind of stuff he has now stated publicly about the GG blocking Frontera constantly. The committee requested evidence and Zaza didn't produce any. So it seems he has none as that would have been the place to produce it so that we could have 'won' the arbitration. So I wouldn't hold your breath that Zaza will produce anything now.