Member Info for HeadInTheSand

...and after that brief interlude, a brief reprise (yes, it's a copy n paste... I've clearly come down with an advanced case of Dougal-itis). What could be worse than where PIs find themselves at the moment? What's at risk? What "won't come cheap"? Or to flip this on its head, does anyone think that the respectful and conciliatory approach has achieved anything at all? If so, on what grounds? "I have yet to see a single sensible opinion as to why this is something we shouldn't do." Surely, if you hold a sensible opinion as to why the proposed course of action is a bad idea, why not spell it out? It'd be a lot more helpful and informative that vague doom and gloom mutterings, IMV? Separately, WM, you state that "I HAVE NEVER REPRESENTED ANY SHAREHOLDERS, NOPE- NEVER EVER". Fair enough. However, I believe that you did attend the recent meeting with ABH and Bligh? Was your attendance there not in some capacity of representing (even informally) certain PIs? Or were you only there for yourself and thus your own objectives alone? Nothing wrong either way, let me hasten to add...

WM, the questions to be answered (and I fully acknowledge there may be valid answers that I and apparently others can't think of) are simply.:- What could be worse than where PIs find themselves at the moment? What's at risk? What "won't come cheap"? ...not wanting to put words into his mouth, but that's pretty much what K27M's post was saying, I believe. As can clearly be gleaned from Tim's dispassionate report from the recent meeting, the "nicey nicey" approach was just met with more completely unsubstantiated claims, puff and buzzwords... and possibly more tellingly, the bizarre attendance of Bligh,who claimed to be representing the original shareholders who sold out ages ago? What's with that? Why was he even at the meeting? Why even more murkiness? To flip this on its head, does anyone think that the respectful and conciliatory approach has achieved anything at all? If so, on what grounds? Again, let me quote K27M here (as he'll also be aware, this is somewhat ironic, since he and I have certainly had our robust differences back in the day on this stock): "I have yet to see a single sensible opinion as to why this is something we shouldn't do." If you hold a sensible opinion as to why the proposed course of action is a bad idea, why not spell it out? It'd be a lot more helpful and informative that vague doom and gloom mutterings, IMV? AIMO.

Now that the extra - and without a doubt, essential - background detail has been given... On the mere basis of "what's the potential upside" vs "what's the potential downside", I find it nigh on impossible to argue against K27M's logic as expounded. "I have yet to see a single sensible opinion as to why this is something we shouldn't do. " Indeed.

WM, again thanks. I don't think there's a disconnect. My point was that there's no STATUTORY obligation for a private Caymans listed company to inform PIs of anything at all... hence my agreeing that it'd take an arm-twisting EGM with suitable resolutions being approved (appojntment of an independent NED maybe?) to get any clarity at all. Gaffy, yes. An EGM is definitely a two-edged sword and ABH could use it as an attempt at a face-saving excuse to shut up shop, no doubt then blaming PIs for "failure just as we were on the point of success". That needs to be borne in mind. Having said that, the question remains begged... how could PIs be any worse off and/or things be any worse or more murky than they are currently?

K27M & especially WM, thanks for the more detailed info... Firstly Dougal, you say "You will gather there is no interest in taking action". By all means feel free to express your own opinion, but I really don't think you're in any position to speak for PIs in general. WM, presuming what you've posted is accurate, I'd also like to know the history of Alon Moss's involvement with Cloudtag. It's certainly true, looking at Tim from the original SAG's report of the recent meeting with ABH and Bligh, that the latter two seem extremely keen on discrediting Alon Moss for whatever reason - not that that's necessarily a bad sign, given the current incumbent's shall we say less than stellar performance so far at the CTAG helm... It's almost like ABH was trying to dissuade people from supporting any further involvement from Moss before such was even a possibility. Anyhow... I certainly agree that trying to achieve some level of clarity on where CTAG is (if anywhere), where it's now intending to head with any shred of realism (again, if anywhere), what it has so far achieved (if anything) and what it's spent PIs' invested money on (again, if anything) would be extremely useful. I also think that the only chanceof getting independently audited and truth-tested answers to some or all of the above questions is via EGM. There's no way that ABH/Bligh are going to volunteer any useful info to PIs (again see Tim's meeting report - just another load of unsubstantiated claims and buzzwords from the company) - and there's no obligation for a private Caymans incorporated company to inform investors of anything anyway. So the company would need to be strong-armed in some way to get this stuff disclosed. However, I don't see why the above course of action would require involvement from this Alon Moss guy? (Who may be a simply wonderful human being or not - I wouldn't know, because I don't have an earthly who he is). So yes, a bit more explanation/background from the alternative SAG would be most welcome to help people make a more informed decision... AIMO as ever.

Question just for info... Is this potential course of action being managed by the original Shareholder Action Group, or a separate body of PIs?

It's all ancient history now of course, as far as CTAG is concerned... ...but I found this rather well-written article on an investment blog that neatly encapsulates the methods, stages and telltale signs of Pump n Dump. Pretty much sums up everything I've ever thought about CTAG, but might be useful reading for some, in terms of avoiding getting burned on other AIM stocks in the future. Take a read, consider events at Cloudtag over the last 18 months or so and see if you can put bulletin board poster names against some of the roles defined in that article. It shouldn't be difficult.. Then avoid other shares with similar BB/social media modus operandis like the plague. https://shareinvestors.co.uk/2017/04/24/a-dummies-guide-to-spotting-a-pump-and-dump-on-aim/ And Dougal, my own personal answers to the four questions that are occupying your thoughts are as follows:- "How much?".... Nothing "Timescale?"... Never "Operational status of the Track, ASpp and DHP?"... None "Commercial status of the Track, ASpp and DHP?"... None Just my opinions, mind you... ATB

SPF & Bignose, the millennium's least surprising news is that I (almost) entirely agree with you both. To me as well, it did look both orchestrated and fairly sophisticated as rope-a-dope schemes go. I personally suspect that much of this was quite deliberately and knowingly done by (of course) the company and a few notorious leading-light rampers for their own personal gain. However, I also suspect that said wrong uns were much to their delight ably yet accidentally assisted by some of the blindly faithful flock chipping in with well-intentioned (but of course utterly wrong) slick yet empty pump material as well. And yes, herd mentality and induced tribalism/zealotry were leveraged to great effect throughout by those so busily hustling. I've said before that someone should use CTAG as a case study on some thesis about how effective sociopsychological manipulation can be. Where I actually disagree is regarding the final denouement - I'm not sure there'll ever be a visible one, so poor long-suffering PIs may never really get any closure on this. Now that the company is both Caymans incorporated and private, there's almost no obligation on it to come out with any information at all. I therefore reckon there's a very fair chance of CTAG becoming nothing more than an inactive file sitting gathering dust on some shelf in some office in George Town, CI. It would indeed seem to be far less hassle for the company to vanish into silence, rather than announce its own death. And I don't think there's one single means of legal recourse now to compel it to do otherwise... But as ever with CTAG, who knows? And whoever will?

If only ABH had made as big a success of CTAG as Reggie did with Grot!

Dougal, consider me any or all of:- Your carer Your confessor Your reality check I keep a nostalgic eye on CTAG, because IMV it is the perfect type specimen of and object lesson in how the unwary can get hustled to hell and back on AIM - both by a company and by a fair few "caring, expert and altruistic fellow PIs". A cautionary tale indeed. It should be required reading for anyone thinking of dipping even a toe in the extremely murky and foetid waters of the AIM market.

I imagine that Dougal keeps religiously copy/pasting previously made CTAG claims because he believes that to do so may strengthen any sort of legal remedy that he or others may seek in the future. Personally, I think he's entirely mistaken and that his assiduous copy/pastes don't change the price of cocoa, but even so, where's the harm? (Unless he ever starts to believe the content of that which he posts, of course...)

As have I and presumably most other PIs. The problem is that those minutes/notes were (quite correctly) a dispassionate report on what ABH and Bligh claimed at that meeting. What they said got reported, that's all. The credibility of those making claims at that meeting remains tissue-thin - which is something of their own making, given how wildly inaccurate and misleading prior claims have been,

I just don't understand the technicals behind that tie-up with EE. Sure Avanti (or any other satellite broadband operator) can offer backhaul connectivity to any new mast almost immediately - which of course saves the likes of EE digging in miles of cable or setting up numerous short-hop fixed wireless access relay points. But the latency unavoidably inherent in satellite broadband is still going to be there? The speed of light's the speed of light, after all....

Errr Dougal... Perhaps you should re-read StockPickfree's post whilst bearing in mind that the word "irony" does not mean "a bit like iron"...

Stockpicfree, beautifully put and I could not agree more. It's a real relief to see that Dougal's very peculiar and apparently permanent attack of self-harming Stockholm Syndrome seems to be an isolated case among the many long-suffering CTAG PIs...

Beebop, I do understand the pessimism. To me it's all a question of whether overseas growth - either from existing operations or via more acquisition - can offset (and more) the undoubted worsening hit to UK satellite-based revenues. We all saw the recent "EE will get you on 4G broadband for �100" article. What's been forgotten is that, if you're eligible for a BDUK Better Broadband grant, you can get on 4G broadband with pretty much the exact same equipment for precisely nothing. 5 minutes with Google shows that the smaller UK based satellite broadband providers are almost all now offering 4G as well - and some of them have stopped offering satellite entirely in favour of 4G. The major selling point of satellite has always been that it can offer a reasonably fast connection anywhere. But as I said before, now that 4G coverage is spreading inevitably ever wider, people will always switch away from satellite - due to speed, latency and price per GB factors - as soon as a viable alternate service becomes available. Satellite broadband's position in the UK has always been as the connectivity option of the last resort - and unfortunately other options which will be taken up first - or indeed transitioned to by existing sat customers - are becoming rapidly more widely available week by week. SSW's potential therefore either lies in other territories, or in other transmission technologies, or both. AIMO.

I don't disagree that it's a growth company... but its growth is not going to come from delivering satellite broadband in the UK any more. Quite the reverse.

IMO growth for SSW isn't going to come out of the UK (not unless it's via its Quickline acquisition). The issue with the UK is that current satellite technology is getting ever more rapidly marginalised by wireless and especially by 4G. Sure there is new technology due to start operation over the UK in 2020 what with the Viasat/Eutelsat JV, which will offer greater speeds and more competitive costs per GB per month, when compared with today's birds. However, the problem is that it's all looking rather "too little, too late" as far as the UK alternative broadband market is concerned. Satellite's always going to suffer from latency and jitter - plus with the MNOs (mobile network operators) already delivering speeds up to 100 Mbps or more over standard 4G and with END-USER pricing already having dropped to a new low of 30p inc VAT per GB per month (!), it's becoming increasingly hard to see the appeal of satellite broadband, even with the improvements promised by the 2020 new bird. By that stage, 4G coverage in the UK is going to have increased to 95% geographic (so 99% by population), not least thanks to EE's blue light emergency services contract - and we'll be seeing 5G starting to be deployed in anger (albeit probably in non-relevant major urban areas to start with). Moreover, nobody's ever going to switch away from an alternate service over to satellite... there will still be some very small market for satellite broadband in the UK at the outermost extreme edges, but it's going to be extremely small beer. So, if I were SSW, I'd be looking even more towards foreign markets and acquisitions if it wishes to maximise earnings from satellite technology - as it has done/is doing with its operations in France, the Nordics, Australia and the old Eastern bloc countries. AIMO.

DougB, re Bligh, unusually in this case, I don't hate the game, but I do despise the player.

...unspun report. I'd have had to add my opinions on the credibility - or lack of it - within Amit's various claims.