London South East prides itself on its community spirit, and in order to keep the chat section problem free, we ask all members to follow these simple rules. In these rules, we refer to ourselves as "we", "us", "our". The user of the website is referred to as "you" and "your".
By posting on our share chat boards you are agreeing to the following:
The IP address of all posts is recorded to aid in enforcing these conditions. As a user you agree to any information you have entered being stored in a database. You agree that we have the right to remove, edit, move or close any topic or board at any time should we see fit. You agree that we have the right to remove any post without notice. You agree that we have the right to suspend your account without notice.
Please note some users may not behave properly and may post content that is misleading, untrue or offensive.
It is not possible for us to fully monitor all content all of the time but where we have actually received notice of any content that is potentially misleading, untrue, offensive, unlawful, infringes third party rights or is potentially in breach of these terms and conditions, then we will review such content, decide whether to remove it from this website and act accordingly.
Premium Members are members that have a premium subscription with London South East. You can subscribe here.
London South East does not endorse such members, and posts should not be construed as advice and represent the opinions of the authors, not those of London South East Ltd, or its affiliates.
Ecuador’s main indigenous peoples’ confederation Conaie is looking to nullify a presidential decree that regulates the environmental public consultation process.
The president of the organization, Leonidas Iza, said in a press conference that the organization together with Frente Nacional Antiminero (national anti-mining front), will file a lawsuit against the decree before the constitutional court on June 13.
That date marks one year since the protests against the Guillermo Lasso government by indigenous groups erupted and which, according to official data, cost the country some US$1bn.
The decree was issued on May 31 by President Lasso and would help unlock a series of projects in various sectors, including the US$250mn Curipamba copper-gold project and the US$176mn La Plata polymetallic project.
The indigenous and anti-mining groups plan to carry out marches against the decree next Tuesday in various provinces and in capital Quito and go to the constitutional court to request that the decree be declared unconstitutional.
Fernando Benalcázar, a board member of Latin American mining organization Olami and former undersecretary of mines, told BNamericas that if the Lasso government does not stand firm in the face of the protests, the situation could get complicated and slow down the progress that is expected with the decree.
"The stability of the processes may once again be threatened and a detrimental environment may be generated for the sector, in the midst of the political instability that the country is experiencing," said Benalcazar.
On May 17, Lasso invoked a constitutional article to dissolve the national assembly, call early elections and govern by decree in the interim.
On August 20, Ecuadorans will go to the polls to elect a president, vice president and all 137 legislators, who must serve until May 2025 when a new government and legislators will take office who will be elected at the beginning of that year.
Let's make the bold assumption that these indigenous groups are not entirely stupid and that they are are capable of recognizing mining will be of considerable benefit to the economy.
Similarly, let's assume the government recognises the importance of the ecology of the nation.
This being the case, why don't they reach a compromise? No mining in protected areas, but no objections to those which are not, provided they conform to all environmental conditions. Is this a practical solution?
Adic. Sounds like a plan.
Maybe Dg1, shippy or copperpot, can suggest it to scott next time they chat. Or maybe the 3 of them can chat to the indigenous leaders direct. That's if Dg1 s calender is free
It's important to understand the issues in Ecuador surrounding mining. Ironically, many of the indigenous groups are ok with likes of SOLG and other mining firms that have taken care to relocate locals and reimburse them handsomely. Not to mention doing environmental and school/community works.
The biggest problem and damage to the environment is from the cowboy miners. These are illegal miners which are now prolific in Ecuador due to surge in Gold price over last 2 years. These are not professionals... but criminals. They don't have permits and just leave pollution and devastation behind them. What the indigenous people need to do is work with Ecuador government to sanction the projects under 'professional' mining firms based on committed environmental promises. And then fight hard against the cowboys which ironically are mostly local people lol!
Article below worth a read
https://www.context.news/nature/will-ecuadors-illegal-mining-crackdown-protect-indigenous-people
Poll to support this or you made it up:
"many of the indigenous groups are ok with likes of SOLG and other mining firms"
Never mind. You made it up. I don't know why we even bother trying to fact-check this fountain of nonsense: it's all tosh. In 24hrs we've had:
- not unusual for Chinese companies to bid against each other (no evidence provided)
- Brazil are trying to use Ecuador as a trade route to the Pacific (no evidence provided)
- many indigenous groups are fine with solg and other miners (no evidence provided)
He's working overtime today!!
I should add, that after the last consultation between these groups and the gov it was agreed that there would be around 10 or so mining concessions that would be deemed 'professional' and SOLG was one of them. If that means that all other licence blocks become illegal then sobeit. That's a major win for indigenous groups. It's also a major win for SOLG shareholders as we effectively become almost a state backed company and with licences in short supply, the likes of BHP or Forstescue only have one way into Ecuador (near term) and that's through buying up SOLG lock stock and barrel.Chinese know this and appear to be ahead of the game which bodes well for them when 2025/2026/2027 copper deficit hits home across the globe.
Fort, I didn't know that. Do you know if it's extant?
Hang on, dm, this is fort we are reading here. Where is the report on this consultation which says exactly what he is claiming it does? Because we've seen misinformation from him before, remember. Pinch of salt time.
Addicknt- if a so called civilised country like the UK can ban fracking in its entirety……conaie can decimate mining in its own back yard simply by protesting for months.
We are not looking at a stable country here!
The only player with any ‘teeth’ in this conundrum is China.
Hopefully “behind the scenes” they can ‘ manipulate” decisions……….as they have done in Ecuador for many years…….it’s our only lifeline.
Fortissimo. I'm afraid your post is flawed.
FMG. Won't be desperate. They're pulling out. Most of they're aus employees are now back in Australia. Not sure if your aware but FMG are now focused on Gabon. And that's where the aus geos are now heading. I'm afraid your big words and epical post, as usual. Don't pass scrutiny
Well said DM.
Ecuador can continue to live off oil, shrimp, bananas, coffee, cut flowers, cocoa, and Panama hats if they want to. But these are tough jobs and the 'new' youth of Ecuador are not interested in 'tough jobs'. They want white collar jobs. Engineering etc. Mining is far from easy but there are many more lucrative jobs in that industry than there is in Panama hats or shrimp!
At end of the day, you have ingenious groups that are right to fight mining that is not legal. It's a real danger to the country in terms of environmental and health. But as I said, they are not against mining 100%. They know that mining done correctly is actually good for environment. Good for communities and good for jobs.
In past there was no real limit on mining activity or permits. By limiting these the indigenous groups are doing a great job. Ecuador doesn't need 1000 mines all working at the sometime. Cascabel by itself could run for 50 years and would not require a huge amount of environmental change to where things stand today. Cascabel would deliver multiple rev compared to existing mines. So is it better to approve several 'MAIN' mines which do the lions share and then close down all the damaging minnow mines that are mostly illegal??
In years from now (20 years) Ecuador might be doing 5 to 10 main tier 1 mines. Do they need more than that? Business gurus will say yes but gaining the right compromise between where they are now with zero Tier1 mines and loads of little illegal mines to having 1 or 2 tier 1 50 year long mines makes more sense to me. But you gotta discover those tier 1 mines first! And SOLG have done that already. No one else has. Fact!
A lovely monologue, fart, but have you got that report you alluded to, or are we just taking that as BS? Anything to back up your other claims about Chinese companies competing for TOs would be good (if it exists) as well.
In summary, I think I'm with the indigenous groups in that they would prefer mines to be the big mines that are well managed and protect the land vs having loads of little mines doing small scale production (illegal or legal) and creating many many scars and environmental issues across the green green land of Ecuador.
Far better to have a few mines that are the big producers. One area is then effected but carefully managed.
DM - what's the point of all the other licences if nothing comes from them. SOLG will be relinquishing a bucket load soon in my humble opinion. As for future growth... do me a favour... Cascabel has more than any super major needs. And there is much to do in and around that area. Porvenir is in the south and very much within the Lundin/codelco/chinese regional play with infrastructure and mining already accepted. What else do SOLG have?? Plenty but we are years and years away from finding out what that holds and most of us would have cleared off long before that.
If SOLG were one of a handful of operators that had the only permits and mines in Ecuador... then can't you see how that boosts our value several fold?
I don't think it's fair to pepper all Ecuador with small mining operations. Just stick with the big established ones for now and things will no doubt change in 10 years+ time. Walk before you can run is the phrase.
ANOTHER lovely monologue, fort, but have you got that report you alluded to, or are we just taking that as BS? Anything to back up your other claims about Chinese companies competing for TOs would be good (if it exists) as well.
Fortissimo. Do ever do research. Or do you post the first thing that comes into your head.
You say Ecuadorians can live of oil exports. Do some research mate. The indigenous residents don't want oil either.
Report from reuters.
QUITO, Feb 15 (Reuters) - An indigenous community in Ecuador's Amazon region ended a weeks-long protest affecting production at two oil blocks belonging to state-run energy company Petroecuador, the company said on Wednesday.
Facts fort. Facts. Not your fiction
Fear not, DM. Fort hasn't substantiated the claim that this had been agreed between (ex-) government and indigenous groups. Until he does, I would assume it is more BS. You are right that regionals are what lots of us are here for- long game stuff for people who aren't over-exposed.
Assume fort has most realists filtered, so someone please ask him:
"after the last consultation between these groups and the gov it was agreed that there would be around 10 or so mining concessions that would be deemed 'professional' and SOLG was one of them" - where is the official report on this consultation?
Spot on again, DM.
DM,
In my experience, businesses that operate in a region and get along with the gov ultimately get first dibs at new licence blocks when they arise. SOLG is a classic example of a first country entrant of which gained them many licence blocks. But let's get real here. The new SOLG (CGP guys included) are not going t be splashing $50m or $100m a year on exploration even if they had permit licence' drill ready' approvals.
I think most are expecting SOLG to split the business into two parts. ENSA part 1 and Exploration folio part 2. How many licence blocks and exploration plays do you want in part 2? Do you want 50 licences with $7m commitment each as minimum? For many investors, monetisation is priority right now. Not all want anything to do with part 2 (if that happens).
I'm not sure where you got the idea of a firesale? Where did that come from?
And yes as Mr Mather has said on numerous times... growth comes from exploration. But for now, SOLG is preoccupied with selling or negotiating terms on Ecuadors first tier1 mine ever. It's a shame exploration has had to take a back seat but maintaining a healthy cash balance to see us through the SR and ENSA discussions actually adds value and strengthens our position.
Colonel Drake - bless you. You see the world in rose coloured specs for sure. Let's stop for a second and take a look at Peru and Chile, now remaind me, what are they up to as a future mining fraternity?
Mmmm.......latin americans have a totally different outlook on life matey, especially the indigenous brand.
If Conaie get anywhere near control of the country in August - we're in deep doo doo.
As for yesterdays blitz by dubious outsiders about a takeover........................cruel, I thought.
Z
Slight correction, I'd happily call Fdn Tier One.
Zoros,
Have you read EY's recent Chile review? Keep yourself informed and you'll do ok. Have you changed your GGP Len's colour yet? Try yellow? Nice glow on that one.
https://assets.ey.com/content/dam/ey-sites/ey-com/es_cl/noindex/doing-business-mineria-2023.pdf
Goodbye and good luck novice.
On your plus side, you can still fight the good fight on the other boards you inhabit.