Member Info for WiganWarriors

@Notsofast. When the Commercial Director pledged his shares last August, the likely agreed loan limit would be around 70%. As the shares fell he would have had to meet margin calls which by January would have meant he had to stump up millions. Goldman are not known for being slow off the mark, or sympathetic and would not have cut any slack.

GS would likely have been sell the loan collateral down all the way until the pips squeaked and he / they forced the towel to be thrown in. A stressful situation no doubt.

@Birchmittens. ... Yes, it is definitely going to be the next Amazon, Microsoft or Facebook. Keep averaging down, that always works ...". In their early days A,M,F all had leading edge tech (and still do) underpinning their fledgling businesses, I'm afraid that THG has plain vanilla eCommerce platform (christened Ingenuity to try and con the venerable ...), with a few bits and pieces bolted on to complete an eCommerce platform.

It's just an expensive IT liability which will requires £100's of millions to maintain each year, including very significant tech refresh every three to five years and accompanying accounting write downs. Hard to see what the attraction is, as SoftBank have no doubt discovered.

@Poker. You are correct re TNCP.

ECHO doesn’t meant that they are from abroad, it’s just a standard mechanism for reporting trades that were not executed live on the LSE. Could be Turquoise, OTC, Dark Pools, inter broker trades etc.

@ROCK. The 3.25m (two trades) booked at 1407hrs (ish), could just as easily been sells, as buys. Those trades were recorded at that time, but took place earlier, so you cannot determine what order type they were unless you have access to the dealers books.

I guess we’ll have to see how the City takes this. No doubt Elliott will respond with their views shortly.

@comeonvog. You assume that someone might want to buy these shares. No institutional buyers are interested, just the retail punters who are "trying to catch a falling knife" ... to no great effect for far.

I don't own any. BTW, whatever happened to SB's cash injection in May for 10% of THG. Have you done the sums ?

Well, most posters on this BB need to stand back and take a long and unemotional look at how THG has fallen from over hyped "tech" business, to the current reality of a fallen star with little chance of trading its way out of this situation.

The City (Investing Institutions, not Investment Bankers who arranged the IPO) have good reason to stay clear, and will not forget . These Investment Institutions (Pension Funds etc.) have hundreds of billions of AUM, and their loses on THG will not even move the dial when publishing their quarterly reports. They will not throw good money after bad, and some will continue to discreetly undermine any attempts for rehabilitation. The City has a long memory.

As for all this talk (desperate pleading) for THG to be taken private, just stop and think about what that would entail. Nobody will put much more that a sliver of their own equity into any deal, and will look to borrow the bulk. This will require much due diligence before any bank will lend, and any consortium will likely require MM to stand down from any executive role. MM will be required to hang around as a consultant (he knows where the bodies are burried) , and probably be subject to an earn out deal.

All this corporate activity will no doubt leak, so there will be plenty time before any buy out will be publicly disclosed. Don't forget those disgruntled Institutional Investors who will likely play hard ball with the terms offered, and my well kibosh any deal.

So, IMHO, if your loses are not life changing then I would move on and put this one down to experience.

Why would anyone take THG private. MM does not have the money, and would require external investors to fund that. Given the markets view of the company's prospects, and trading uncertainty, its a stretch to see how that might happen in the near future. All the skeletons in the closet need to be exorcised before anyone will pony up cash.

It's hard to see any meaningful upside in the share price in the short term until new management take control. However, I am sure that there is an opportunity for professional traders to make a few bob in the meantime, at the expense of inexperienced retail investors. As usual IMHO.

IMHO. From where we stand at the mo, it seems we have pretty much priced in all the building sector headwinds, and risk around replacing the CEO at these sub 150 prices.

However, as always, there is a risk from the macro environment turning down again, but I think that the markets have tested the Fed re interest rates rises, and the Fed has stayed strong, so I reckon the markets will accept that and move on.

Finally, there is potential upside (sector outperformance) from potential news flow re Elliott, and a potential share buyback on the cards. We will see.

THG PLC (the "Company") announces that it was notified on 12 August 2021 of: (a) the paying up and conversion of 116,101,671 existing F, G and H ordinary non-voting shares of £0.005 each in the capital of the Company into ordinary voting shares of £0.005 each by FIC Shareco Limited ("FIC Shareco"), classified as a person closely associated with Matthew Moulding, the chief executive officer of the Company, in connection with existing, vested share awards granted to Matthew Moulding and Steven Whitehead pursuant to the Company's historical employee share incentive arrangements; and (b) the entry by FIC Shareco into a security agreement with Goldman Sachs International Bank in respect of only those ordinary voting shares beneficially owned by Steven Whitehead but registered in the name of FIC Shareco and which are to be subject to such security agreement on or about the date of the conversion of the above referred F and G ordinary non-voting shares beneficially owned by Steven Whitehead, as security for a loan facility made available to Steven Whitehead pursuant to a loan agreement dated 10 August 2021. Details of the full notification received by the Company are set out below.

Today's RNS is just reporting that FIC has sold shares in THG. As of last September FIC had terminated its loan arrangement with Barclays, so it is likely that shares held in FIC are unencumbered and as they are directly controlled by MM and his wife they are at liberty to sell, or buy for their investment company (FIC) as they wish.

@Hosai. No I am not a "retail short". I am an experienced investor and I have no position in THG, just friend who is a retail investor things he should buy some THG. I have advised against given the lack of clarity, governance and uncertainty of the business.

There will undoubtably be more revelations. As for ECHO, it is as I said, and general reporting mechanism for off book trades which enables those trades to be recorded on the reference exchange, in this case LSE.

@Poker. It's a bit of a stretch to say that ECHO trades often come from Swiss Investment Banks. ECHO is a standard mechanism for reporting off exchange (LSE) trades. These can come from many different sources, dark pools, other exchanges etc.

You're looking for spooks behind every curtain ...

Of course with THG, there are many spooks behind curtains yet to be disclosed. MM must feel a little like Boris, with respect to embarrassing leaks.

@EchDelta. There are no real shorts in THG. Less than 1% is negligible. This is selling (dumping) by institutions who have lost confidence in THG management. No institution is likely to buy into THG until all the skeletons are exposed.

@Peteret. I there is a war in Europe, personally I don’t think Putin is daft enough, it will affect the markets big time ; at least initially. Wimps are part of that market and will tank like everything else. It’s irrelevant whether war affects builders, it’s market sentiment that will affect the builders as it’s risk off again.

@Aspers. maybe Wimps will see £2 later this year, although given the headwinds that might not be realistic. Are you able to provide a some rationale for your prediction, or is it just a wish ...

Sentiment may well stay poor for a while, given the immediate issues:

Need to reach an accommodation with UK GOV re "cladding", by March

Interest rates WILL rise, and soon priming for "tech" sell off

Central Banks are reducing money supply, which puts markets I risk off mode

As long as Boris survives, UK GOV will continue to play popular politics with the builders

Wimps specific, uncertainty re Elliott and appointment of new CEO

All of the above will have a depressing effect on sentiment as the big investors wait for some certainty before making major commitments. Its hard to see any uplift in share price in the short term, and may be next year before Wimps share price (and builders in general) can start to reflect a more realistic valuation.

Can't understand why people believe there is value in :"Ingenuity". Its just an expensive commodity IT platform, with no "special sauce". It' s very expensive to build and maintain, in the hundreds of millions, and will be written down within the next three / four years requiring another massive capital cost to replace.

MM need to bite the bullet and get it onto the cloud before that capital cost is due.

Add this to expected write downs from acquisitions, and its hard to see how THG growth and profits can out run the inevitable. When, and if, a new Chairman gets appointed (if they can find any decent one to accept), then the first job will be to control costs (reduce staffing), move to the cloud and find a new CEO and CFO. Only then will THG have a chance.

Thanks Ben