Member Info for RayPointer

Hopefully, this just could be the bottom.

I reckon Sweden had the best looking female fans.
I hope Leas didn't have his book upside down again.

Yes, but if we play Russia in the semi watch out for them wearing Chemical Protection Suits

ONW
I was not at the 2012 AGM but I knew about the proposed split and that's why I brought it up.
So I got it either from this BB or a proactive investors interview or some thing.

From memory I think it was a RG interview and also discussion on this BB.

However, I don't think it is worth discussing further since the landscape has now totally changed with a BionTech deal now being the most likely first monetising of assets.

ATB

I remember the strategy being to sell Immunobody after the SCIB1 trail and use some of the money to develop Moditope. The rest being distributed to the shareholders.

Do you know if that strategy has changed in light of not selling Immunobody?
Or is it a case of wait and see what happens now, especially with moditope now receiving a great deal of attention.

I hope she doesn't read this BB, otherwise you are really in trouble LOL

Has Mrs Leas gone shopping?

Keep the faith or walk away

Exactly. What matters is whether or not Scancell's products work.

Inan has thrown down the gauntlet for the alternative view. Any doubters should take him up on it.
So, pick a specific statement he has made and get him to expand on it.

"Ray, I'm sure most of us would prefer any of those side-effects to death. "

Can't argue with that!

So, the obvious question is

Is the probability of death greater with Anti PD1/Chemo combo or Anti PD1/Immunobody?

Well, we already have some evidence on the answer to that question.
Hopefully, we won't have to wait too long for more evidence.

ATB

Boom tells us that it is a well worn path for big pharma to conduct combo trials using a PD1 inhibitor and chemo.

But what are the side effects of chemo?

"Many side effects go away fairly quickly, but some might take months or even years to go away completely. Sometimes the side effects can last a lifetime, such as when chemo causes long-term damage to the heart, lungs, kidneys, or reproductive organs. Certain types of chemo sometimes cause delayed effects, such as a second cancer that may show up many years later.

Fatigue
Hair loss
Easy bruising and bleeding
Infection
Anemia (low red blood cell counts)
Nausea and vomiting
Appetite changes
Constipation
Diarrhea
Mouth, tongue, and throat problems such as sores and pain with swallowing
Nerve and muscle problems such as numbness, tingling, and pain
Skin and nail changes such as dry skin and color change
Urine and bladder changes and kidney problems
Weight changes
Chemo brain, which can affect concentration and focus
Mood changes
Changes in libido and sexual function
Fertility problems"

source

https://www.cancer.org/treatment/treatments-and-side-effects/treatment-types/chemotherapy/chemotherapy-side-effects.html

This coming combo trial is hugely important and IMO may herald replacing chemo with immunobody in many cancer treatments - not just melanoma.
So, hopefully, for many this will mean replacing the above list of side-effects with a sore arm.

Personally, I would want that sore arm to be as sore as possible since, as Inan said, it shows that immunobody is doing its stuff.

ATB

Crumbs, well if its anything like Japan v Belgium I will be in detention for not handing in homework

Great, thanks for that Inan,

So, one of the battles is between the CD8 cells turning the lingand off and the tumour expressing more ligand.
Immunobody in a healthy patient with an already robust immune system is likely to result in a win for the CD8 cells.

And KeyTruda removes the need for that particular battle.

Thanks Wild

My homework for tonight whilst watching the England match!

Sorry, try this instead.

This is my take now of what happens at the tumour end

a) The killer CD8+ cells are primed and with high avidity are able to attach to their target epitopes and kill the cancer

b) But one of the other effects of the immune system is the release Interferon Gamma. The tumour recognises this and tries to defend itself by expressing PD-L1. So, in this respect, the Interferon Gamma is not helping.

c) However, the attack of the CD8+ cells is strong enough in most cases to overcome the tumour's defences despite the defence launched by PD-L1

d) Enter KeyTruda into the fray. This supresses the activities of PD1 and its ligands, <br />This means that the CD8+ cells have a much easier task of infiltrating and killing the cancer. The defences are weakened.

I found this

http://clincancerres.aacrjournals.org/content/22/10/2329

"These findings indicate that although IFNγ is thought to be a representative antitumor cytokine, it actually has dual roles: one as a hallmark of antitumor immunity and the other as an inducer of the immune escape phenomenon through various mechanisms, such as PD-L1 expression."

So, I totally agree, Immunobody and KeyTruda work perfectly together to defeat the cancer

Yes, couldn't agree more.<br /><br />This is my take now of what happens at the tumour end<br /><br />a) The killer CD8+ cells are primed and with high avidity are able to attach to their target epitopes and kill the cancer<br /><br />b) But one of the other effects of the immune system is the release Interferon Gamma. The tumour recognises this and tries to defend itself by expressing PD-L1. So, in this respect, the Interferon Gamma is not helping.<br /><br />c) However, the attack of the CD8+ cells is strong enough in most cases to overcome the tumour's defences despite the defence launched by PD-L1<br /><br />d) Enter KeyTruda into the fray. This supresses the activities of PD1 and its ligands, <br />This means that the CD8+ cells have a much easier task of infiltrating and killing the cancer. The defences are weakened.<br /><br />I found this:<br /><br />http://clincancerres.aacrjournals.org/content/22/10/2329<br /><br />"These findings indicate that although IFNγ is thought to be a representative antitumor cytokine, it actually has dual roles: one as a hallmark of antitumor immunity and the other as an inducer of the immune escape phenomenon through various mechanisms, such as PD-L1 expression."<br /><br />So, I totally agree, Immunobody and KeyTruda work perfectly together to defeat the cancer.<br />

"Interferon gamma is released by activated T cells ... this up regulates PD1 ligand on the cancer"
It is the high avidity CD4 helper cells that relase the I G?
So at this stage the cancer is better protected?

"a t cell detecting that ligand is turned then OFF suppressing the inflammation"
Do you mean that the ligand is turned off?
Which T cell are we talking about here?
So after this process the tumour is more vunerable?

"The T cells are binding to the epitopes displayed by the cancer
... this activates them to kill the cancer cell its detected."
This is the CD8 killer cells?

Inan, Boom

Trying to understand Immunobody a little better at the tumour end of the process.

Am I right in the following

a) Immunobody increases the avidity and sometimes also the population of CD4 helper sells

b) The high avidity CD4 helper cells help to inflame the tumour.
Does this mean that the tumour expresses more PD-L1?
How exactly does this process work?
Does the tumour feel threatened and is trying to protect itself by expressing more PD-L1?

c) The high avidity CD8 cells bind to the PD-L1?
The tumour cell is killed.
How does the binding of the CD8 cells result in the killing of the tumour?
Will the CD8 kill anything that expresses PD-L1?

As always, thanks for your help.

Although I have found this:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10188057

"NY-ESO-1 expression was detected in 11 of 16 small cell lung cancer lines, three of seven non-small cell lung cancer lines"

which suggests that NY-ESO-1 could also be a target in SCLC.

But, you are right in that there is no mention of SCIB2 and SCLC in any literature I can find.

ATB

Yes, you are right.
My mistake.

Thanks for pointing that out Inan.

In that case, it looks like Roche must be lacking a lung cancer vaccine to combine with Tecentriq. So they are falling back to combining Tecentriq with chemo.

Another reason for Roche to be interested in Scancell.