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Silvernight - Prim hold zero shares in BMN
Good Morning Silverknight
Rupert is crystal clear in how he runs OUR COMPANY.
Fees for BoD are one of the lowest on AIM.
All our investments are listed on our website and are updated regularly.
RKB
https://primorusinvestments.com/our-investments/
Does anyone know exactly how many shares PRIM now holds in Bushveld?
Thanks for the repost, i dont use ADVFN! maybe reduced some fears ref BMN and CPH2. RMM still appears to be a bad decision though even in the long term they are in need of capital and running at a loss.
Had a look at Interpac, lost money since inception in 2013 but the company is still in development phase and overheads must be small. Recently appointed a new Chairman and a NED (along with Hedley Clark). Their product is an end user cardboard processing plant with patented Technology. ideal for Just in time type manufacturing business. Will be interesting to see how this grows albeit still a small company so may take a few years to turn a profit and more importantly an exit plan for Prim.
Well, I have been reading some of your comments with interest.
Clearly with the macro-economic situation and an acute cost of living crises then people are finding times hard. With the disappearance of free money, a consequence of this will be investors having to liquidate positions. This clearly is happening in the small cap sector and Primorus is not immune to this either. What this is doing is creating a large disconnect between mcap's and NAV of companies.
It is up to individuals to decide which companies are better placed to deal with this downturn. I am a firm believer in the ability of investors to buy and sell and markets will find an equilibrium. If you have cash at the moment, then I believe history will be kind to investors as long as they pick the right stocks.
We have spent 2 years restructuring this company into what I believe now is one of the leanest investment companies on AIM. Our cash burn is relatively low, we haven't felt the need to raise any cash and in fact we are one of the few companies still investing- as in the Interpac deal announced this week.
Not all investments will be a success in the short term, but we possibly have a slightly longer time horizon than some investors. It’s as much about getting your timing of selling as buying.
Yes, it was us who sold GGP in the 20's and yes it was the old board who bought GGP. Nobody get every trade correct on timings but over a period and with a correct balance of investments then dividends will pay - and yes, we are one of the few AIM investment companies which is the board chooses and we feel it is the correct decision for PRIM shareholders we can pay dividends/share buybacks.
I notice talk about BBM - well we managed to independently negotiate a good deal to change our investment in MUST to a CLN in BBN. This has given us the ability to convert some at a profit and run the rest at a 10% interest rate. It’s about managing those investments which don't always work with those that are.
We strongly believe in the likes of FRESHO/PAYAPPS which are extremely well-run companies and we believe excellent value. The likes of CPH2 we believe are the future of the transitioning period and we have the firm belief that they will be very successful.
As always, I don't want to comment individually about your posts as everyone is entitled to their view, but clearly there are some very misinformed posters.
The line of communication is always open and please call or email -contact on our website. I’m generally quite friendly and welcome a discussion around our investments good or bad. It’s your company also so if you have a query get in contact rather than incorrectly speculating.
I wish you all well in these difficult times. I hope I have allayed some of your fears. Best Rupert
PS Now do you see why I am a LTH who has patience? RKB
[reposted with better formatting]
well I have been reading some of your comments with interest. Clearly with the macro economic situation and an acute cost of living crises then people are finding times hard. With the disappearance of free money, a consequence of this will be investors having to liquidate positions. This clearly is happening in the small cap sector and Primorus is not immune to this either. What this is doing is creating a large disconnect between mcap's and NAV of companies.
It is up to individuals to decide which companies are better placed to deal with this downturn. I am a firm believer in the ability of investors to buy and sell and markets will find an equilibrium. If you have cash at the moment then I believe history will be kind to investors as long as they pick the right stocks.
We have spent 2 years restructuring this company into what I believes now is one of the leanest investment companies on AIM. Our cash burn is relatively low, we haven't felt the need to raise any cash and in fact we are one of the few companies still investing- as in the Interpac deal announced this week. Not all investments will be a success in the short term but we possibly have a slightly longer time horizon than some investors. Its as much about getting your timing of selling as buying. yes it was us who sold GGP in the 20's and yes it was the old board who bought GGP. Nobody get every trade correct on timings but over a period and with a correct balance of investments then dividends will pay - and yes we are one of the few AIM investment companies which is the board chooses and we feel it is the correct decision for PRIM shareholders we can pay dividends/share buybacks.
I notice talk about BBM - well we managed to independently negotiate a good deal to change our investment in MUST to a CLN in BBN. This has given us the ability to convert some at a profit and run the rest at a 10% interest rate. Its about managing those investments which don't always work with those that are. We strongly believe in the likes of FRESHO/PAYAPPS which are extremely well run companies and we believe excellent value. The likes of CPH2 we believe are the future of the transitioning period and we have the firm belief that they will be very successful.
As always I don't want to comment individually about your posts as everyone is entitled to their view, but clearly there are some very misinformed posters. the line of communication is always open and please call or email -contact on our website. Im generally quite friendly and welcome a discussion around our investments good or bad.
Its your company also so if you have a querry get in contact rather than incorrectly speculating. I wish you all well in these difficult times.
I hope I have allayed some of your fears. Best Rupert
well I have been reading some of your comments with interest. Clearly with the macro economic situation and an acute cost of living crises then people are finding times hard. With the disappearance of free money, a consequence of this will be investors having to liquidate positions. This clearly is happening in the small cap sector and Primorus is not immune to this either. What this is doing is creating a large disconnect between mcap's and NAV of companies. It is up to individuals to decide which companies are better placed to deal with this downturn. I am a firm believer in the ability of investors to buy and sell and markets will find an equilibrium. If you have cash at the moment then I believe history will be kind to investors as long as they pick the right stocks. We have spent 2 years restructuring this company into what I believes now is one of the leanest investment companies on AIM. Our cash burn is relatively low, we haven't felt the need to raise any cash and in fact we are one of the few companies still investing- as in the Interpac deal announced this week. Not all investments will be a success in the short term but we possibly have a slightly longer time horizon than some investors. Its as much about getting your timing of selling as buying. yes it was us who sold GGP in the 20's and yes it was the old board who bought GGP. Nobody get every trade correct on timings but over a period and with a correct balance of investments then dividends will pay - and yes we are one of the few AIM investment companies which is the board chooses and we feel it is the correct decision for PRIM shareholders we can pay dividends/share buybacks. I notice talk about BBM - well we managed to independently negotiate a good deal to change our investment in MUST to a CLN in BBN. This has given us the ability to convert some at a profit and run the rest at a 10% interest rate. Its about managing those investments which don't always work with those that are. We strongly believe in the likes of FRESHO/PAYAPPS which are extremely well run companies and we believe excellent value. The likes of CPH2 we believe are the future of the transitioning period and we have the firm belief that they will be very successful. As always I don't want to comment individually about your posts as everyone is entitled to their view, but clearly there are some very misinformed posters. the line of communication is always open and please call or email -contact on our website. Im generally quite friendly and welcome a discussion around our investments good or bad. Its your company also so if you have a querry get in contact rather than incorrectly speculating. I wish you all well in these difficult times. I hope I have allayed some of your fears. Best Rupert
While its a disappointment rmm has underperformed
and bmn also
the mkt cap is only 4 mil
some of the other holdings may exceed expectations
i hope management will take the oppurtunity to buy back now
Very disappointing. The quoted elements have slumped badly and the rest of the portfolio is illiquid. I'm marginally down but disinclined to top up right now. Can see the Nav taking a tumble.
Exactly, I was in here for GGP and stayed for Engage - I sold out pre-covid and wont be buying back in until the board decided to do something. AC in my view had the right idea however was given a massive salary for it...now what do we have, more people doing nothing and being paid for it!
Investments in Mustang/BMN and RMM both appear to be poor decisions, everything else seems a bit stale. No updates on ALTE since incorporation, the 3 SPAC companies which were registered (what for) etc etc
Its a shame as I had high hopes for the new board but Prim seems to be lacking a direction and any urgency at the moment.
Oof what's going on here, big drop on no news. Somebody getting impatient? The half yearly report didn't sound particularly positive and none of the new investments have blown the lights out. RMM a dud. Rupert needs to deliver some good news, and urgently.
Glad to hear. I too am a long term holder but don’t have half of the knowledge of stock market investing as you do. However, this is now looking to be quite a poor gamble at best!
I am still positive, I am a LTH and will reap my rewards when the Market wakes up.
RKB
what RKBeekeeper has to say now?
Honestly, this was incredibly stupid. They did a great job in exiting Greatland Gold at the right time, but ever since it's been poor - emptying promises from the board.
energy storage will be massive, but flow batteries are 5 years out minimum. Not what we wanted in terms of return on investment.
Has been a disaster of an investment. Always felt uneasy when Prim started to invest in miners. They often disappoint and are sensitive to the economic cycle. Perhaps we should have scaled into these loss making companies rather than making big investments in one go? Great land Gold was probably just an exception to the rule but look where the price is now.
The main investment which looks the most interesting is Fresho but I think we have never had the profit, turnover etc figures so we can assess ourselves what the company might be worth.
However, it's hard times all round at the moment.
Seems like PI’s are being left in the dark a little bit to much.
Yes rather strange not giving any exact details.
I'm sure when RKB gets a chance he will be able to give us an update of the changes in our investments.
GLA
There is a notice on the prim investment page that the investment information was updated yesterday 17 August, but I don't have a record of what changed, perhaps someone else can see what it was: https://primorusinvestments.com/our-investments/
PRIM has staged something of a slight recovery from a very low level recently.
Mr Samworth was appointed a director of ALTE on 20-7-2022.
It appears that he was appointed a director of Dominvs Group around 11-7-2022 -
https://www.propertyweek.com/news/dominvs-group-appoints-former-cbre-boss-samworth-to-board/5121249.article
Nothing at Companies House as yet -
https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/07746921/filing-history
The family running that company are worth around £500M -
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sukhpal_Singh_Ahluwalia
ALTE appears, possibly well connected .
No linkage of course, but possibly well connected.
T321, if you look at the top of the column which has the figure of 0.098987 in it is titled "price paid per share". So as PRIM can convert at a fixed price, that appears to be the fixed price they are paying for all the BMN shares, irrespective of the price in the market.
If they are then selling the shares, at the present market price they are making a loss as the current market price is 6.10p.
However the latest accounts dated 10-6-22 showed that PRIM had converted 4,157,637 BMN shares (the same number as presently on the PRIM website) so it would appear that the conversions have ceased for the moment, and indeed actually date from April 2022.
On 26-4-22 I posted on here -
"The conversions so far are
6-4-22 - 2,069,063 for £204,810 = 9.89p (agreed price)
26-4-22 - 2,088,582 for £206,742 = 9.89p
On 6-4-22 the BMN price was between 11.5p and 13.1p so had they sold that day they would have made a tidy profit. Did they sell? I'm not aware but volume on 6-4-22 was quite high by recent standards. Would be more difficult to make a quick turn today, price currently 9.8p - 10.0p, but I would guess the decision depends on whether they "need" the cash."
So it looks like PRIM likely made a decent profit on the first conversion, maybe a small profit on the second, but now the BMN price has slipped significantly below the conversion price the conversions and sales have ceased, PRIM hoping for better times.
It is also worth noting that the p/e ratio of the S&P Metals and Mining index is 5, which is a 25+ year low, and equal to the low during the Great Recession and financial crisis of 2008.
In 2003, 2011 and 2017 that p/e was above 30.
Given the current market conditions and geopolitical matters then PRIM's timing for the BMN investment and others may not have been the best, however the S&P 500 M&M index p/e ratio can show wild swings over a period of less than 12 months, so what appear duff investments now, could be tomorrows spectacular winners.
It is all a matter of timing, and this may partly explain PRIM's present day crackers share price.
If thats the case and it seems so it was a good move
I hope they are buying back shares in the market at the moment
at what i think are bargain prices
On Prim's website it now says that 4,157,637 BMN shares (including payment in shares for accrued interest) have been converted and sold, looks like at a price of 0.098987? Which means Prim now has about £411,00. Hopefully some share purchases coming soon
https://primorusinvestments.com/our-investments/
a few little buys recently
nice if if was share buybacks