Charles Jillings, CEO of Utilico, energized by strong economic momentum across Latin America. Watch the video here.
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Silures,
Here you go with the transcript. He did not rejects sale of the Ammonia Cracker, and from what he's said it is clearly one of the options they are looking at. His analogy about understanding the generator replacing vs an Ammonia Cracker is undoubtedly directed at the shareholders and investors lack of understanding of the value of the Ammonia Cracker, which explains why, if it is worth well in excess of the AFC market cap, that AFC say the company is undervalued.
From 50m 46s on the video:
"In the results regarding the Ammonia Cracker you say that 'we are reviewing options to capitalise on this unrealised value', do the options include a sale of the part of the business, or what other options are there"
"There are lots of options, and this is probably not the right forum to talk about those options in public"
"What we are very much aware of is, when we speak to investors, whether it's a private investor or whether it's an institutional investor or whether its a strategic investor, everyone understands the concept of displacing a diesel generator with something that is green, and provides functionally the same outcome. So that's an easy sell if you like, or an easy proposition to understand"
"Once we start talking about Ammonia Crackers and the role that it plays, those who are producing large amounts of Ammonia, those who are looking to consume large amounts of Hydrogen, those who are au fait with the global trade of Hydrogen, will tend to understand the opportunities around the Ammonia Cracker technology, and, were we a private company, we would see a very different valuation being attached to the technology than if we are part of a bigger public company"
"So there are opportunities that we can look at to try and drive value into a Cracker business which is clearly a little bit more early stage in terms of it's, not only development of technology but also its deployment, and how you value that, we are obviously privy to some of those opportunities and the scale of those opportunities, but most of that we can't talk about without giving away some form of confidentiality or maybe even intellectual property around the application and use cases of the Ammonia Cracker."
"So it's difficult to quantify a market value in the company, however, we do know from discussion with industry, that the value of that Cracker, IS WELL IN EXCESS OF THE CURRENT MARKET CAP OF AFC ENERGY"
"So, when we look at it in that light, you've got to say well, there's got to be something we can do to create value in that technology, which is not currently seen in the share price, and these are the options that we're looking at and evaluating as a board, as a management team, and you know, at the right time we'll sort of, advise on we've concluded"
https://www.investormeetcompany.com/
The 200kW delayed partly due to software issues ? What was the other reason, hardware ? So the reason for the delay is it’s just way behind, nice of Bond not telling anyone again until he had no choice.
Silures,
"I haven't watched the presentation back yet, but I'm sure AB responded to one question by stating that AFC wouldn't be raising any funding via sale of the Ammonia cracker in 2024."
He didn't say that as far as I remember. The video isn't available yet, it should be there tomorrow so I will check and transcribe what he said.
The first thing I noted was his body language, he looked very surprised by the question and gave a wry smile as if to say "that's a cheeky little question, now I need to say something that doesn't breach any NDA's!!". He then went on to say there are many options and explained that we we dealing with the huge Ammonia producers and they were very interested in the technology.
There are indeed many options, but do AFC take a few hundred million for the IP and use that to fund a fast global expansion of the Fuel Cell business, or do AFC keep hold and licence out the technology as per the CWR model whilst doing a slower rollout of the Fuel Cell business with associated fund raising later this year, or do AFC form an Ammonia Cracker joint venture with one of the Ammonia producers, or do AFC take in a strategic investment into AFC as per the ABB agreement to set up mass manufacturing of the Ammonia Cracker in return for some level of exclusivity like the 3 years Speedy have. And I'm sure there are other options.
There's pro's and con's for each choice and hopefully the board will choose the one that creates the biggest shareholder return in the shortest time frame.
Taking a few hundred million for the IP would also allow AFC to give shareholders a special dividend. This is what has happened with many UK companies that have sold off part of the business for a big chunk of money. Who would turn down a 5p dividend at the end of the year? Not many I suspect. The ii's would love it.
Also confirmed was the reason the 200kw S-Series liquid cooled system has been delayed, is due partly to software problems that have had to be resolved. The system should be completed and delivered to ABB in the next 2-3 months, with CE marking taking up to a maximum further 6 months. So could see orders and CE marking by end of 2024
I haven't watched the presentation back yet, but I'm sure AB responded to one question by stating that AFC wouldn't be raising any funding via sale of the Ammonia cracker in 2024.
A good presentation from AB and PD-C. From the meeting I feel that AFC know there is substantial demand for their products but do not want to rush into a position whereby signing contracts with everyone will see the demand outstrip the supply, similar to ITM. This would not reflect well on the company, and so by focussing on the short to mid term supply with current partners, AFC can expect to meet their contractual obligations and revenue targets, whilst expansion of the company is aligned to it's commercial growth. Very sensible IMO.
Just catching up, reading the comments it seems none of my questions were answered just like previous years, no surprises there then. As Anneowl said, £27m orderbook but not going to be delivered for at least 3 years, pathetic given every fundraiser for the last few years has been for scale up
More trollocks.
Haggis working overtime tonight! There must be a placing coming!
More trollocks. It not a concern, IT'S FANTASTIC!!
The £27M order book, be that contractual or implied or MOU’d sounds terrific, but it was unfortunate to hear expected revenue for 2024 was just £5M to £6M.
Why can’t an order book of that size be met with delivered product inside of one year? - perhaps due to our limited in-house manufacturing capacity?
Why can’t an order book of that size be met with delivered product inside of two years, when we’re meant to see contract manufacturing agreements signed later in 2024? - that’s an unknown.
And for three years? - that’s a concern given we all hope the order book will continue to grow throughout that period!
@MelvinAFC, if AB is making up the financial stuff, what's the CFO doing? Why do you ascribe everything to AB, idiot.
What an incompetence again, no recording messaged or linked up and webpage down and nada. Before BSwhatever comes again, yes I did not make it, some people have real work, not like you sitting the whole day infront of a PC because of welfare payments...
Time for you to go Garonne - Filtered again.
Just got in so haven't seen the presentation but judging by the SP, the market is unimpressed. My early enthusiasm for yesterday's results was clearly misplaced, particularly the bit about £27 million of orders. I guess we all want to believe but I suspect Bond's credibility is holding this back as in the absence of facts and figures, few believe a word he says. With an income of less than £300k last year, his remuneration package is outrageous. Time for him to go?
>Where is the £27m order book if it's taking 3 years to get to that amount of revenue?
It was explicitly stated it's contractual. Not sure of your trying to correlate over previous years where it didn't exist.
There's no way on this planet Bond has under done figures and been cautious! Not in his entire history here has he done that
Very early stages? We keep hearing that every year. Amazing how much investors here just accept it all. Don't argue it all.
Where is the £27m order book if it's taking 3 years to get to that amount of revenue?
Interesting prezzer. The revenue figures are way underdone IMO - the next three years were what - £6m/£12m/£30m?That’s not even twice the current pipeline. Once TAMGO gets going things will crank up, and the cracker will add something eventually. Point is, it’s still v early days and almost impossible to establish accurate estimates, hence an abundance of caution. The cracker is also at far too early a stage to realise its potential value, but I can believe AB’s view of its worth to the company. Very positive about the future.
I think the trolls should use barchart rather than British bulls .Barchart have afc as 100% buy
Would be better off aim less manipulation as there would more book runners so it would be watched more
Why would you sell your biggest potential money earner for the company. With the cracker revenue they probably wouldn't need to go back to shareholders. I'm sure their are plenty of investors lining up to put funds into the Ammonia cracker tech in order to speed the finished product up. As Adam said they have been in discussions with chemical, major energy providers & others greatly intrested in having this technology.
Maybe they will be.
Or alternatively they are waiting for the validation and testing to be completed, and the shrinking of the Ammonia Cracker into a dishwasher sized unit, followed by validation, FAT and CE Marking of it, whilst talking to AFC about how they can form a JV or invest in it, or license the IP and mass manufacture it like Bosch and Weichai do with CWR.
INTERESTING
The one about selling the Ammonia Cracker business, his reply said it all, including that it's worth more than the Market Cap of the company, which is currently £139.77m.
If this were true, and AFC had a decent 1st movers advantage over the competition - then imo they would be taken out in a heartbeat.
I quite agree. I got several questions answered, plus a few where AB couldn't say anything due to NDA but still managed to tell us as much as he possibly could so that we understood the situation.
The one about who manufactured the stacks, he said we'd be told soon.
The one about selling the Ammonia Cracker business, his reply said it all, including that it's worth more than the Market Cap of the company, which is currently £139.77m.
Selling that would sure provide a huge amount of money to quickly scale up the Fuel Cell business, with zero dilution for shareholders.
Pretty positive meeting I would say