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Agree entirely, LordLash - one scenario that worries me is a "lose the battle(FRR) but win the war(energy independence for the Caucasus).
FG a MassDebater - It's the way you tell 'em!
Bigun2 - what a lazy reply / deflection to what could have been an interesting debate. You tell others to go offline - but you are still here. As you put it - "says it all really"
Looed keep on posting all you find (et all) it is up to the individual to decide what is (or not) the truth based on as many inputs a they can fined. Truth is the first causality in a propaganda war and this is a political fight over the freedom/control of a region between two/three super powers (don’t forget China). All sides will pump their views as the total truth and all others are telling lies or fooling themselves (sound familiar). What you should never disregard your common sense (very hard for some posters on here) and take everything with a view that they may/will be an alternative agenda.
This is where the BB’s can come into their own as folk can discuss what is found/posted and then decide what they believe or what is more likely based on history and current information.
As some have said many times there is nothing we can do until this current situation is finalised (arbitration or other) and results are officially published.
FRR are front and centre in this propaganda war and although no matter how many issues we find out about GG and their backers the Arbitration judges will base their judgement on law and not political feelings. However, based on ZaZa interview I’m sure Gov interference/support will feature as a reason for any none compliance in the PSA plus I’m sure his friends in high places (GG/US) would have helped with information as FRR success with help damage the Georgian Dream party Government.
Don't rise to Fire. When people used to moan about the lack of information coming from Frontera he used to say "well we knew what we were investing in". He likes to play devil's advocate and make people think alternatively, just loves a mass debate. If we were all on here sympathising with the workers and saying how terrible Frontera are he'd probably pop in to post about what Frontera have been up against etc etc.
It is a very confusing time, but one thing is clear to me. This has gone so high politically that there is more to this than was meeting the eye, and in the grand scheme that makes us little investors insignificant noise.
"wacky conspiracy theory". Emotive language Timothy. Says it all really I'm sorry to say. Ignorance is bliss I guess. OAO
Bigun2 - your command (as that's how it read) received but I am sorry to report I cannot comply. I will continue to post any info I find relating to FRR be it Russian, Georgian or whatever the language. I also include the source and increasingly try to find information on the company behind the posting. There are some who accuse FRR / Zaza / Georgia / ground staff etc as being liars or part of a grand conspiracy. Where to draw the line on censorship?
I took the liberty of looking at your posting history and on 12th Feb your wrote "Do you not think that the GG kicked off the expected demise of FRR with the Arbitration in cahoots with Hope whom in turn fed the shorting team; TW et al to aid/accelerate the demise?" Might seem realistic to you, credible to some, but a wacky conspiracy theory to others. IMO it doesn't mean you shouldn't feel free to post your thoughts or any info you might come across.
Don't guess just wait...preferably offline. Any news posted onto this board related to anything Russian just ignore. They are playing chess with your heads....and they are very good at it. If you want to play then you must be too.
Yes, Free. Most of the info we're getting on the wages issue originates from Russian sources and, according to Zaza's interview, the '3.5 billion counterclaim' was apparently also a fabrication. We are caught up in a propaganda war where truth is the first casualty. Maybe when the litigation is exhausted, the smoke might clear and we'll be able to see what's really going on. Until then we just have to guess (and try not to step on any booby traps!).
Accurate facts on which to base opinions
Very hard to come by here....with propaganda machines churning out so much detritus.
Workers.....I didn't like the story right from the start.
I'll wait for Zaza in English, and comment on that.
Morning.Appreciate you must be very busy Pyro but doing a very valuable service to local communities.
None of us know the actual situation re the workers apart from yes they do not seem to have been paid but who is specifically responsible is unclear and again it dies nit reflect well on FRR if it is purely down to them.
It appears in the early days the workers continued working on the understanding they would be paid abd if course should get their dues.
It does seem clear though that “ third party” influences are mobilising they local workers as part of a wider anti FRR campaign rather than a spontaneous outburst of action by the workers themselves.
The fact the workers should be paid is not in doubt just whether their actions are been i is Ted by themselves or wider dark forces
Whether right or wrong, true or false, it doesn’t matter. We can’t do anything about it, just like we can’t influence the court actions, the arbitration or Zaza’s willingness to talk to us. What will be, will be. We just have to sit on the sidelines and wait for the result.
I did notice one subtle difference in the latest rinse-and-repeat coverage - they mention Zaza by name. I don't recall seeing him named in any of the earlier articles. I am sure it's not at all connected to his recent and seemingly positive performance on state TV.
Not this old wages story again, do any of you actually now the truth, all just noise once again. Not read any posts today, but to bring this story back again and again, is obviously push down the line a credible post.
Heilovitch,if you think the benefit system here is generous you really need to do some research ignorantus .
Remains to be seen which lemmings have been led over a cliff.It isnt hard to imagine the workers like s holders were habitually waiting for their promised presents to no avail .
I’m no tool but seriously people not getting paid is despicable!! That’s the first thing you always do pay your guys regardless... maybe I’m old school but without your guys you won’t go far?? People saying get over it your half the problem in this world sorry but not getting paid is wrong anyone thinks otherwise well your a complete ****...
From what Ive read i believe these guys did try to work something out with FRR, but you cant go on with endless promises.
ive said before on here I wouldnt care who paid them frr or gg , in fact it would be a feather in the cap to those who paid.
UNfortunately I cant spend all day on here writing posts, I have to work to make up for the loss in this share and a non payment from a scum--- company
We have alot of new posters here that were very quiet when the share was live, just stating that first.
Drango, says a little sarcastic comment about getting a job i Georgia.
Fair point mate.
However does that not lead on to it being rather sensible to negotiate with the employer you have and work something out that is practical for both sides.
Best option is probably not to stamp your feet and down tools with threats when the other side is already with its back to the wall and fighting to survive for everyones sake. negotiation would probably been the better option.
I have no doubt things were difficult for all, but i also believe the path taken made things almost impossible
Sure was.
Tsb is my bestest bestest mate. Don't you know :-))
FG, it happened matey, i chose to vote not to strike, but majority voted strike, so i had to go with majority, no pay when on strike. So yes been there.
I do not think its just FRR fault that pay was impossible every other month, but they were paying bi-monthly whilst they sorted it out. It appears that some of the fault is with GOGC and thats most likely Russian influence.
Pawns in a political game i am afraid, not nice, but i feel they chose the wrong path that led to it being even more difficult to pay them.
Imagine you have a small building business, You have 5 employees. You finish a job, and customer does not pay the bill. You need that money to pay for your workers.
You have some cash, but much of it is for equipment for the next job.
Your choice is
1. Pay all workers fully, but then tell them no more work as you have no capital to continue.
2. Pay what you can, part wages, keeping enough for the next job and so they have on going employment.
If you do no1 its all over
if you do number 2, its a little hardship, then maybe you can make it up in the future, you may be able to claim the money owed in the courts too.
Plus you can go to the bank for a loan, but only with no2, because bank will want to see the order book to ensure the money is safe.
Sound familiar, it should do because thats how i see the situation that FRR were in.
Free I'm guessing hopeing that was aimed at wadassistant what an idiot
Ah, at last...someone with all the true facts at their disposal.
Do share with us.
Please include all times and dates, as I'm sure our guys here would like to match them with other events and goings on.
Await your reply with great excitement.
Tool
For fukk sake not being paid for this long is disgusting and damn right disrespectful regardless they should be ashamed of themselves imagine not being paid for a month or two you would go crazy regardless of whose fault it was it’s not right and Zara sn and everyone else are disgusting human beings to even contemplate doing such a horrible action?
Fg ffs do they look like they're starving? Georgia have one of the best benefits programmes in the West. Even more lucrative than over here....do your research pal...
and when is the last time u had to wait for ur pay packet to put food in ur fams mouth....
blame anyone but frr eh!