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@NigeCo.. I don't think they would have been bought in the US over-the-counter market, its possible though some were bought on the Frankfurt Exchange ( https://www.boerse-frankfurt.de/equity/bt-grp). The only thing that seems evident is that on the 7th June (the date the threshold was passed) over a third of the stake was obtained via SETS on the LSE, and the rest were probably off-book.
Nige, I think BT delisted from the NYSE circa Aug/Sept 2019.
Just a thought, if there is still a BT listing in the USA, maybe Drahi has purchased up to 10% threshold in the USA, compared to possible 5% in UK?
"I'm not 100% sure Velo, although BT does still maintain a listing on the US over the counter (OTC) market."
"I think this might mean that 5% threshold applies."
I think BT is the issuer, and as BT is a UK entity the 3% rule applies.
But beggars can’t be choosers.
That old adage in the music world, even bad press is good press, still rings true. But, would I prefer Dealings with DT or US telcos such as AT&T etc buying into or increasing BT holding, over Altice. God yeah!
"One thing is for sure, he’s not straightforward, plain and simple, if we are reading this correctly Drahi seems to be a bit of a modern day shyster."
I wouldn't use those words. I haven't got an issue with him building his stake, but the current UK stock notification rules appear inadequate. What's the point in having notification rules, if they're easily avoided? Accumulating 1.2 Billion shares isn't something you do in two days.
One thing is for sure, he’s not straightforward, plain and simple, if we are reading this correctly Drahi seems to be a bit of a modern day shyster. On the positive side though, his planning to meet CWU reps demonstrate a longer term view of his holding.
I'm not 100% sure Velo, although BT does still maintain a listing on the US over the counter (OTC) market.
https://finance.yahoo.com/quote/BTGOF/
I think this might mean that 5% threshold applies.
Just to add, BT shares are now only traded on the FTSE, since delisting from the NYSE. Altice UK holds the stock, so wouldn't the 3, 4. 5,...% rule apply in this case?
Where was the reporting as the stake was accumulated?
"- Yeah :) they put it in after both casa and I read only the 2 RNS's. We're innocent of all charges."
The FCA say:
"A person must notify the issuer of the percentage of its voting rights he holds as shareholder or holds or is deemed to hold through his direct or indirect holding of financial instruments falling within DTR 5.3.1R (1) (or a combination of such holdings) if the percentage of those voting rights:
(1) reaches, exceeds or falls below 3%, 4%, 5%, 6%, 7%, 8%, 9%, 10% and each 1% threshold thereafter up to 100% (or in the case of a non-UK issuer on the basis of thresholds at 5%, 10%, 15%, 20%, 25%, 30%, 50% and 75%) as a result of an acquisition or disposal of shares or financial instruments falling within DTR 5.3.1 R; or
(2) reaches, exceeds or falls below an applicable threshold in (1) as a result of events changing the breakdown of voting rights and on the basis of information disclosed by the issuer in accordance with DTR 5.6.1 Rand DTR 5.6.1A R;
and in the case of an issuer which is not incorporated in the United Kingdom a notification under (2) must be made on the basis of equivalent events and disclosed information."
If Drahi had tried to obtain 12+% in one go it would have really pushed the share price up, so how did he get around the 3% rule since indirect holdings are also notifiable:
"A person must notify the issuer of the percentage of its voting rights he holds as shareholder or holds or is deemed to hold through his direct or indirect holding of financial instruments falling within DTR 5.3.1R (1) (or a combination of such holdings) if the percentage of those voting rights:"
Hi Velo.... It's very difficult to work out how Drahi built his stake because the FCA directives mean that holdings in BT under 5% are not disclosable. Without access to the share register at Equiniti (BT's registrars) it's nigh on impossible because there will be several holders under the 5% reportable threshold. My personal opinion (and it is purely a guess) is that some of his stake came from Orange SA (via Atlas Services Belgium) who took a strategic position in BT some time ago. About 4 years ago, Orange sold about a third of their holding and fell below the disclosable limit. As I say though, this is purely a guess.
Please DYOR
I'll plead guilty for a reduced sentence!!
... Although casapinos does offer an intriguing get out of jail free, card.
- Yeah :) they put it in after both casa and I read only the 2 RNS's. We're innocent of all charges.
Thanks again IAPR. Bit of grey creeping into my brain as well as my hair.
There were 3 RNS's released on the 10th June. When I read the generalised one on Altice I read the next and a different subject so must have assumed the third would also be on another subject as probably thought 3 RNS's dated the same day couldn't possibly contain 2 on the same subject. It's all I can think of. It's even up there on this site all along! Doh!
Anyway it proves they are legally registered in his company name, wherever he's obtained the finance support from.
That's wierd , I have been checking the LSE website for this and it IS NOW THERE.
https://www.londonstockexchange.com/news-article/BT.A/holding-s-in-company/15011551
but I am pretty sure it has been uploaded retrospectively. It is clear that Altice do now own DIRECTLY 12. 1%, though the compensating reductions elsewhere are not visible and I'd be amazed if they could have hoovered up that many without a few compensatory lowered holdings .
Still, it confirms that Drahi has actually spent over £2 bill on his holding and IMV means that something significant is likely. As we all know there is mega unrealised value in Openreach, maybe Drahi has a cunning plan?
Hi Velo.. The RNS is on the BT site:
https://otp.tools.investis.com/clients/uk/bt/rns/regulatory-story.aspx?cid=1470&newsid=1482489
Thanks IAPR. I've quickly glanced at BT's investors site and still can't find an RNS detailing the exact details of Altice's holdings bar a brief RNS mentioning Altice in a sweeping generality. I do realise this site often misses some RNS's, but would have thought such an important update would have been "clearly" visible on BT's site by now.
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Oops, error from yesterday:
Got my days of the week mixed up with -
"Possible consensus analyst update v late tonight or tomorrow is due (missed the June 4th update, but hardly impactful on the SP in these circumstances)".
- That should have been for tonight (Friday) or tomorrow morning, Saturday.
(My only interest in this update is to see if Altice has impacted the analysts perceptions).
Hi Velo... That list was entirely compiled from RNS Holding(s) in Company (FSA TR-1 notifications). I automatically extract data from all these RNS announcements for all companies. They are then checked against a company's annual report when companies have to disclose significant shareholders.
In the Altice case, the data was extracted last week from:
https://investegate.co.uk/bt-group-plc--bt.a-/rns/holding-s--in-company/202106100700094049B/
Good luck to all holders.
Thanks for the heads-up IAPR. Also fascinating career-reveal in your exchanges with Nige. Interesting.
After seeing that Altice entry I was going to post that I now defo expect an Altice-themed RNS tomorrow, but now that you've said you compile it yourself on a shoestring budget I have to ask, did you get the Altice holding data from official sources - or just from your personal, general knowledge of the situation?
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Anyway, it's fair to say, from the SP perspective, the narrative Fleccy has posted about, does appear to be in full raging bull mode, taking no notice of analysts, media et al, etc., Just like the 5 year downtrend when no matter the good news (what there was of it) it never failed to prevent the relentless drop in the SP.
Just one thing before I subscribe to the raging bull narrative - the Triple Witching Hour commences tomorrow, where all futures/accounts are settled with often unforeseen consequences. It won't be just Friday, but the days following right to the month's end.
If Nil effect and the raging bull remains locked, loaded and in full combat mode, taking no prisoners, and pffing, tsking, and dismissive of any bearish media news, then it's all still on, but let's see first as the exponential last few days SP trend direction is now almost perpendicular, and exacerbating the overbought condition further.
Possible consensus analyst update v late tonight or tomorrow is due (missed the June 4th update, but hardly impactful on the SP in these circumstances).
The June 4th update was a little dismal in tone this time; will the dra'H'i :) effect, influence their next update? I'm pretty sure it might. So I'd expect even more fuel on the fire.
Anyway, separate to the above, I said earlier I'd do a quick post on the top 5 holders in BT so that next in a separate post as now it might not all fit on this one page.
Yes, that screenshot brings back memory's. Lol
@NigeCo.. Good luck to you too, mate. I've just updated mine. I just did a screenshot. You'll see it hasn't changed at all!!!!
http://www.investorease.com/iease.jpg
IAPR, sorry to hear that you didn't make a killing out of IE's mate because it was that good, you would have deserved it. I've just checked my copy's of IE's CD-Rom's I have quite a few with different upgraded versions. I think that the first one is dated 1995, with the last one 2006. I thought that maybe the internet was it's downfall, not knowing that it was down to the very expensive stock exchange fees for the info. Good luck mate.
NigeCo, not as well as I'd have liked lol. With the LSE and news feed fees there was no money left for advertising. In the end Financial Express (formerly Prestel, now FEFundInfo) took it over. They were interested in the data but not the retail investor side of things so they discontinued that. I still do work with them though.
IAPR, it may well have been 20 plus years since I subscribed mate, I thought that IE's was very good with downloads in the evenings through my phone line, waiting to see if there were any comments regarding the companies that I had invested in. Like you say pre-internet. If I remember rightly the subscription was very reasonable I thought at the time at I think £9.73p per month. I still have the CD-Rom but I would very much doubt it would load on Windows 10? It was good for the portfolio that updated daily. You must have done very well out of InvestorEase?