Roundtable Discussion; The Future of Mineral Sands. Watch the video here.
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Thanks Doc, the feedback into the grid when not in use is a great bonus for the system,thats going to be very attractive to the incoming Government.
A very informative presentation today. I had the pleasure of sitting next to Bumble B and Jimmynan and I know the former made copious notes and will produce an excellent report either here or on ii. I encourage all to read it. Most of the points of note have already been made here but there were two things that stayed with me which I'll mention briefly if I may.
The first is that after 4 years of concentrating on the R&D and tech with the prospect of a commercial launch being somewhere in the future AB was very keen not to talk about the tech today, saying openly that that is all done and the product is ready to go. Questions of longevity for example are no longer of concern to them. This is a company that is now in the business of selling products and innovation, and not just inventing.
Secondly, the flexibility of the AFC system is only just becoming apparent to me. Apart from being highly adaptable and responsive to individual client needs I liked the following. It is well accepted that people would like to replace their dirty diesel back up generators. It was also discussed at length how EV charging systems in the work place will be needed, but that the local grid may often not be up to it (examples were cited). Well one AFC fuel cell tackles both problems . The fuel cell can power the EV chargers, but switch to back up power generation as and when necessary. So back up power solutions that currently sit there most of the time doing nothing can now be sitting there making an on going contribution.
I remain uncertain as to how quickly AFC will grow and how quickly the SP might rise. But I am more convinced than ever that this will be a billion pound business at some point.
An indication of how many more charging points are needed, estimate is for a factor of 10 increase is needed, that coupled with a constrained grid is a perfect storm.
https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/industry/analysis-who-will-charge-our-electric-vehicles
I’m not going, I will be hanging around on the board, but I will have my report on ii, where it will be easy to read, that will divert a minimal amount of screen usage to ii, but will help promote an LSE competitor and make a point that the tolerating of this ill informed shorter attack risks driving users elsewhere.
I watched the impact of these folk on PHE and do not want to see it here.
If you see anything posted on this site that damages the reputation of AFC take a screen shot and send it to Wendy asking her to put in a complaint, if the material is factually incorrect and misleading.
Funny how none of us combusted, went blind, suffocated or generally got killed in a hydrogen ammonia bomb! If you believe a certain poster we must have been lucky to escape with our lives. He’ll be saying electricity is lethal and should be banned next....
I think I meant spontaneously combust!
I agree with banaman, BumbleB, I used to use ii but they came with a "new & improved" version and destroyed it, so I left. So we really do need your report on here, and ignore the trolls! They will self combust in the fulness of time, shortly I reckon.
13thmonkey, great spot. Until today I thought AFC’s charger might have limited scope if it was focusing solely on locations where connection to the current grid was difficult. It’s clear now that extending the grid has such issues that AFC’s solution can have a much broader reach.
A little out of date also, but shows again what sort of project AFC can get built.
https://www.birmingham.ac.uk/Documents/college-eps/chemical/fuel-cells/FCH2-2017-Presentations/Suzannah-Hexter.pdf
BumbleB, your report would be greatly appreciated. II is not a user friendly site anyway. Or ADVFN for that matter. Just ignore the vermin. Hopefully they will just burn out and stop responding their rubbish to every post. Boring life they must lead
A little out of date, but if anything the economics will be better now.
http://www.elucidare.co.uk/news/Ammonia%20as%20H2%20carrier.pdf
Not just manpower. It is also the issue of getting planning permission for new pylon lines that soaks up a lot of time.
I see LSE still has a vermin problem. I am inclined to post my report on ii instead of here.
Interestingly there are Ammonia pipelines moving huge amounts already for the fertiliser market.
Pipelines
Ammonia is safely and cost effectively transported via vast pipelines. In the United States, the NuStar line (3,070 km) pumps anhydrous ammonia from the Mississippi delta and the Texas and Oklahoma panhandle region, into the heart of the corn belt, where it is distributed further by the Magellan line (1,100 miles). In Eastern Europe, the Odessa line (2,400 km) pumps anhydrous ammonia from the Black Sea port to fertilizer and chemical plants throughout the Baltic region.
Pitlick, manpower is the problem throughout infrastructure projects.
It's all very well saying they will spend a billion £ on upgrading the grid. - it only takes a minute to authorise a billion £ but a lot longer to build the infrastructure, and to find the qualified manpower to do it. Especially if we're not going to bring in European tradesmen any more.
Bsac, but it’s not the high voltage network that’s load constrained. It’s the LV network and that’s the most expensive but to replace as you have to dig the towns up to do it.
HV by comparison costs 1/5th of the cost of underground works.
How do I know the LV networks is maxed out? I used to instal switchrooms and electrical distribution networks in large projects in London and the provider would often refuse the KVA supply asked for.
Look how long it has taken the government to decide to spend billions on HS2.
If you apply the same investment decisions to the national grid then it will be 2050 before any upgrade is made.
Dream on Big Mac.
Yachtmaster, it may well be spent, I'll give him that, but it'll take decades, long enough for there to need to be an interim solution.
Sorry Big Mac but how do you know billions will be spent on the national grid? Where does it say so?
Bmac, making things up again I see:
From ITM's board, they have no need to discuss grid issues but here you are:
"
Hi all, new to the board but have been reading since finding out about this share about 2 weeks ago.
I am yet to buy in yet as still doing my research but just wanted to add to what [redacted] is saying about the infrastructure in the electrical distribution network.
I work for the south west DNO and down here we have been told that there isn't any capacity for any major supplys etc to large scale building sites with a lot of property's to be connected. We are able to connect individual new customers but anything substantial won't be allowed ( I wouldn't be surprised to see people with deep pockets get approval though).
We have no capacity out of slot of our primary substations and a fair bit of the 132kv network will need upgrading also to allow for extra capacity but nobody is willing to pay for all of this at the moment!
What I am trying to convey here is that in its current state, as anybody who has any understanding in this stuff will know, is that the electricity supply network in its current state is already redundant just for new house connections let alone large scale charging stations or charge points at everybody's houses. This to me puts Tesla and the whole ev industry down the pan as it's just not viable without huge upgrades and investment.
Due to this I think my money will be better off in tech such as H2 here and hope to join you all in investing a bit of my money in ITM Power.
Good luck all"
And
"Hi [redacted]. Welcome aboard. I just retired from a dno after 40 plus years. Same here, anyone applying for more than 100kva sends ripples of fear through everyone. :-)"
100KVA is nothing in EV charging terms. Please provide proof that they are wrong Bmac, whilst the grid is mandated to provide power, there are physical limitations that are being hit.
OMG . . . this guy is unbelievable . . straight from google search . . he has no idea . . it is like first year uni lesson about N.G.
Someone please take him away . . . in his usual jaket
chippyjo, re your .....How many times can you be wrong in one day Bsac?
All that gump you posted chippyjo, about the national grid. Way too much to record again here but to put you straight on the matter …..
The National Grid is the high-voltage electric power transmission network serving Great Britain, connecting power stations and major substations and ensuring that electricity generated anywhere on it can be used to ‘SATISFY DEMAND ESLEWHERE’. The high-voltage network is connected to the power stations and major substations. Power stations and substations provide the lower power demand side for commercial and domestic supplies, (usually 110v 3 phase and 240v single phase supplies). Please note...the low power distribution side can not meet that demand unless the high-voltage power transmission network serving it, is capable of suppling it in the first place. Hence the need to upgrade the National grid and undoubtedly, the distribution network also. Billions will be spent doing this over the next decade (or two). Jeez. Bmac
Totally agree chippy, looking very good for AFC, corner has defo been turned. Dawn of a new era for AFC. If one looks at our competitors in the industry and the way they have grown, there is huge demand and our tech is class leading. Worth £££££'s not pennies.
I agree jolly, nuclear isn’t the way forward. Any renewable energy used for production of H2 may in fact create a bigger market for Alkomem
Chippyjo, yes rate of EV uptake is looking like 100% year on year.