Member Info for WolfofWarks

I can’t believe that CP really think they’ll be getting anything back.

When this is spun into a new entity the CP action will fall away.

HNS - I suppose that would depend on your view of empire building on leverage.

Hi Hexam - I think there needs to be some criteria to becoming a public company. Maybe a certain size, scale of level of assets. Saying that though this still managed to sneak into the NASDAQ.

There’s too many of these companies that were ramped up during covid off the back of PI cash that have ended up falling by the wayside.

If Bitcoin goes back up they might be able refinance by then. It way to much debt though when you’re not breaking even.

It’s hard to see a path out when you can’t use the convention markets for refinancing.

When does all this debt have to be paid back?

The saving grace might be for Argo, and forgive me it’s probably been six months since I looked at the accounts, is that they own the Helios building outright. Could they not lay everyone off, turn the machines off and hunker down for the winter? The company is effectively a data centre right.

That’s a bit simplistic I know but I’m sure you get my drift.

On reflection Perry leaving should have been a massive red flag as well.

There has to be an RNS tomorrow, the company has a responsibility to let you know what is going on.

‘ as no one inc the BOD was expecting the court to approve that $785m in new financing
of a possible $1.94b, i think that caught a lot of people out''on that rise back to 9p’

That’s absolute nonsense mate. The whole facility was laid out in the first RNS. They just had to iron out the wrinkles to have access to the remainder of the facility. Which is being provided by its current lenders so was never really in danger in my opinion.

It was a rise on ‘no news news’.

On reflection maybe someone else should have taken h the second penalty.

It’s a shame imagine what might have been possible if we had got past them.

Poor - companies are not suspended to stop insiders trading. By virtue of the law insiders are not allowed to trade on non-disclosed information.

Chapter 11 is the US version of administration. The management have very soft control - every penny spent has to be approved by the court. Then 2/3 is the approval needed across each class of creditor I think.

This is going to be interesting. With Bitcoin at current levels is the business likely to be viable going forward enough for the creditors to agree to the re-organisation plan? What's the breakeven point? There's a massive asset to distress against in Helios as well. Does anyone know if any of the creditors have security over it? I can't see any charges registered on companies house.

I don't think this one's clear cut in terms of C7 vs C11 - that's if it goes through the US of course.

'Why would they waste millions on lawyers fees covering all options.If all options are not on the table
Just a thought ATB ;-)'

Jeff - I had an email about a settlement agreement from a partner at one of our lawyers the other day. I responded and the lawyer billed me £58 for reading the reply.

They bill you for every second. Now apply that to top dollar corporate lawyers, a complicated process and proceedings, involvement of a public company and the sensitivity that brings, and you can see how the bills end up in the millions.

I'be never seen a bill like that in the millions before, I've seen them in the hundreds of thousands though.

I think the only reason this has a docket is because they settling a prepetition claim and Bookers don't want the details of the contract on the public record because it would contain commercially sensitive information and put them at a disadvantage against their competitors. It looks like the details are being sent sealed to the top 30 unsecured creditors and various other parties who presumably have an interest or a right to know the detail.

"Wolf and a few others on this board , don’t think that is allowed lol."

Poor - your suggestion was that the shares would be suspended to stop insiders trading. Section 313CA refers to the non-disclosure of inside information. These things are not one and the same.

Elvis Booker are not a material supplier to CINE as far as I can recall. At the start of the court docs there's a list of the top 100 unsecured creditors. I'd be surprised if they are even on there.

I think they are on an offshoot of Tesco - do they even have an international business?

Yes GM was a victim of the 2008 financial crash, they were heavily indebted in the run up and were basically bailed out by the government who took 60% of the Newco equity, leaving the existing shareholders with 1%.

The point being and Elvis has now alluded to this - it was a bit of a special case being the one of the largest corporate insolvencies but also it was a government bailout that used C11 at the mechanism for getting it over the line.

Elvis - can you tell us what happened in the infamous GM C11 to the existing stock holders?

Bookers are one of thousands of suppliers to a global group like Cine. From the off suppliers have been told they are getting paid - that's what the DIP finance is for. I'm not sure why that would be RNS-able? Bookers may have restarted supplies, but they won't be the only supplier of popcorn, drinks, etc, and as far as I'm aware Cine theatre's concession's have been running as normal.

Elvis - I didnt say the lawyers bills have no relevance, simply cautioned against reading too much into them as they are highly summarised and you don't know the exact detail nor what exactly is being discussed. The items contained within the bills are exactly what you would expect to see being worked and advised on in a chapter 11 scenario. They give no insight into the actual outcome though.

Taking your tax fixation as an example - almost every major business decision will have some tax implications. In this case here the original company is probably going to be replaced, as in most other distressed financial situations, with a Newco - so the tax implications will be huge for the company. Plus of course a company that has struggled for a couple of years will have big tax losses on the balance sheet. This will not resolve the outcome of the C11 though as you are implying. This will be sorted by Mooky coming to a deal with the creditors.

For an accountant some of this stuff should be relatively straight foward, they should be light bulb moments like they seem to be for you.

Invested are just one actor in this. There are many moving and ever evolving parts, and we really only at the very start don't forget.

Elvis - no one dissed you on this. This is your child like mentality at play and is the reason I don't feel it's worth getting into any of this will you.

Kirkland and Ellis seem to be the court representatives looking at the dockets with Slaughter and May doing a lot of work in the background I would say.

LTH - I've had a scan down most of it and they are taking advice on a wide range of subjects and working on many outcomes which you would expect as this is complex legal work. They obviously have a draft RNS in the background which is being updated and reviewed by various parties as they are going along, going back to early December and I suspect if we looked at last months invoice there might be mentions as well.

I think all these mentions of takeover panel, FCA, Newco, de-listing, etc, are exactly the kind of snippets we would expect to see when carrying out this kind of work in a chapter 11. I'd careful of drawing any conclusions based on this because there is a complex negotiation going on and until the RNS is released, unless you are a fly on the wall, no ones knows for definite what is going on here at the moment.