Member Info for toneman

I'm not actually against batteries either. I just think we should be open to using whichever technology suits what we're trying to achieve - even if it's not the most energy efficient. I certainly believe that battery and solar is an ideal partnership - repeatable cycle of generation with a predictable capacity of storage to spread the energy throughout the 24 hour cycle. Hydrogen is more suited to wind because the wind may blow for 1 day, 10 days, or 0 days, and you can't match that unknown quantity with a fixed battery capacity. Battery cars are great for repeatable short journeys and charging from home. Hydrogen is better for long journeys, heavy goods and for those without home charging. To me efficiency is too crude a metric.

It almost doesn't matter what green hydrogen is used for as there won't be enough to meet every application for a couple of decades. But it does matter for grey or blue hydrogen. I would argue that even grey hydrogen is acceptable to displace diesel as it still has a benefit to local air quality even if it doesn't tackle CO2. But grey, or even blue hydrogen may not offer a significant benefit to justify its combustion for heating in place of existing natural gas, especially if it's only a 20% mix.

Unfortunately a lot of discussion seldom gets beyond the simplistic concepts of efficiency and carbon. If you only consider those two they generally lead you to believe that the only solution is electrification and batteries. I would argue that hydrogen for heating, although less efficient, is more effective. I would argue that hydrogen as transport fuel, although less efficient, is more convenient (for a lot of home-owners at least). But you try having that argument with a battery evangelist...oh boy.

I'm seeing a few new names on the board so I'd like to ask again for people to sign and share my petition for the government to kickstart nationwide hydrogen refuelling on garage forecourts. I'd appreciate your support and sharing through your social media channels. Many thanks.
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/561614

The arguments put up by those against hydrogen are often pretty weak. Even if you ignore the actual numbers for a moment the argument that we "have to generate all the hydrogen ourselves through our own offshore wind" is ridiculous. We don't even produce all our current requirement of natural gas ourselves. So if we're allowed to import energy today, we should be allowed to import energy tomorrow too. The CCC gentleman obviously hasn't even considered the 100's of TWh of hydrogen that can be generated in North Africa, the Middle East, and Australia. Why don't they ever compare apples to apples?

Garry, ITM MC already exceeds CWR, even with CWR great rise today.

Mucker, don't forget the H2Bus Consortium - Everfuel, Wrightbus, Ballard Power Systems, Hexagon Composites, Nel Hydrogen and Ryse Hydrogen. I have no idea whether an order of Wrightbus supply automatically introduces the H2Bus Consortium or not, but it'll be interesting to look out for the above names in relation to the Belfast order.
https://h2bus.eu/

NLLeeroy, I agree with you on UK refuelling. Have you signed my petition to do something about it?
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/561614

Please sign it and share it across your social media channels.

Garry, it probably depends where they source their methane. If it's from Natural Gas, which is what some of their literature suggests, then I'd question what happens to the other typical constituents like Propane, Butane, Ethane, even existing CO2. At best I think they could claim 'blue' hydrogen as a final product, and in the end I believe the world will be demanding 'green' not 'blue'. Also, their production process doesn't solve the 'excess renewables' storage/conversion issue which will continue to grow as more renewables is deployed. Again, more renewables is what the world will demand. I think I'd only be concerned if the whole world suddenly decided that nuclear was actually the answer and were able to control it properly
to deploy only the electricity required at any given time of day. I just don't believe nuclear will ever get that popular now that renewables have such recognisable potential.

Smithy, before you go. I don't remember seeing you all last week on the board and wondered if you'd missed the petition I started for nationwide refuelling. Maybe you already saw it on one of Graham Cooley's tweets. Anyway, I'd appreciate your support if you would sign it and share it. Many thanks. https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/561614

The Facebook post by Riversimple has made a significant impact speeding up the rate of new signatures. We've just past 1000. At this rate we should at least hit the first milestone of 10000. I've had no response yet from Jo Bamford or Robert Llewellyn.
https://www.facebook.com/riversimple
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/561614

Riversimple has generously posted the hydrogen refuelling petition on their Facebook page. If you haven't posted/shared it already perhaps you would give a 'like' and share their post. Many thanks.
https://www.facebook.com/riversimple
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/561614

Riversimple has generously posted the hydrogen refuelling petition on their Facebook page. If you haven't posted/shared it already perhaps you would give a 'like' and share their post. Many thanks.
https://www.facebook.com/riversimple
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/561614

Riversimple have generously posted the hydrogen refuelling petition on their Facebook page. If you haven't posted/shared it already perhaps you would give a 'like' and share their post. Many thanks.
https://www.facebook.com/riversimple
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/561614

SaleSale, it's not about the past it's about the future. Consider this minor adjustment to your figures...Revenue 3.29 bn £, MCap - 20 bn £

Exactly right taskmaster. It seems a little like reinventing the wheel. There is more than enough energy already hitting the earth from that giant orb plus the winds it creates indirectly. We already know how to harness all that.

To be fair, I'm not against experimenting to see what's possible, but it really needs to get to a significant working prototype before you start building peoples hopes up. That's why all these technologies, hydrogen included, get so many false dawns. On that note, all the calculations I've done with hydrogen, wind and solar over the past couple of years suggest hydrogen is now the real thing...but I could still be wrong.

My grateful thanks to all that have signed and shared today. Many of you will have far greater circles of influence than I, so I really do appreciate your help and support.
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/561614

My grateful thanks to all that have signed and shared today. Many of you will have far greater circles of influence than I, so I really do appreciate your help and support.
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/561614

Great, thanks for the heads-up Licancabur. He's got a couple of thousand twitter followers who are hopefully like-minded.

Yeah, that's a good idea SP. I'll start looking for some names. Being able to email them should also give an opportunity to outline why starting to build the infrastructure is important even before 100% green hydrogen is available.

Thanks Jmc_mcr. Just hit 500. Long way to go. Thanks for your support.
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/561614