Member Info for Handofjohnson

......So to you just joining the party I have been stating this was on the cards for nearly 3 years.

To the idiots who questioned my motives and attempted to 'muddy the waters', i hope you are pleased to have assisted in the loss of other investors cash.

The issue as I stated over, and over, and over again was the cash flow situation. This was (and still isn't) understood by many investors.

The very minute the clawbacks came from the suppliers, the business fundamental changed and extreme steps were required at this point. All non-profit/revenue generating areas of the business needed to be stripped back at this point.

The original business received income upon CONTRACT ACCEPTANCE with the supplier. This changed to 7 weeks POST LIVE date. This drastic change meant that staff could hot target, month in, month out and not actually generate any revenue.....but still be paid salary.....remember contracts can be agreed/renewed up to 2 years before the current deal ends.... but it would still mean £0 in the bank for 2 years.

This business model CAN work if built 'bottom up' e.g. sales staff in place first, once revenue received (not just recognised) then infrastructure could be built e.g. marketing, hr, legal, admin, health and wellbeing, subsidised canteen, company vehicles, Christmas parties etc etc.

The bloated infrastructure remained in place and did not adapt to the changes in how the business operated.

The initial issue was caused in part by the former CEO but his successors had over 2 years to rectify this matter and did nothing.

Their answer was to add additional revenue streams that had smaller margins but shorter journey time from sale to revenue.

They ended up diluting the brand and becoming a 'jack of all trades'. When they attempted to sell merchant services in November it was a huge red flag that cash flow was the main issue....I raised this and got shot down.

"Oh the order book is worth too much"
"Oh the market cap is only £4million"
"Oh it must bounce back"
"Oh it will be 20p by christmas"

Where are you all now?

Morons

My last post!!!!

Let's see if the attention span can manage more than 2 sentences......

Firstly, can't believe I'm getting into this but...."bensherb" my 2nd and 3rd post from a year ago are copied and pasted from a discussion on ADVFN ref this share from November 2016. My advice was to avoid the share.

There was an individual who goes by the username "bennywin" on that forum who in my opinion cost a lot of people, a lot of money.

On this forum there are a few who have done the same. Next time you see "spenda" pop up with a comment check his history, another champion of this share and has been buying in (apparently) at different points throughout its demise insisting it had bottomed out at 80p, 50p etc.

In fact my post on here a year ago today was in response to a thread entitled "49p Bargain". Again I advised against purchasing the share as I believed there was further to fall.

My posts contained clear reasoning for my position on this share and my motivation for being on here.

Despite this I still get 'called out' by those such as 'nocashqxl' who simply can not be arsed to read posts. At the same time they offer unintelligible idiotic, basic responses without having any understanding of the industry.

I have now shared all I can on this share over a sustained period. I have often repeated myself repeatedly, often repeating, myself ;) to try and get the point across to those who have not wanted to listen regardless of the rationale, insight and logic.

I have been met with suspicion and often hostility over the 3 years, however I could have saved a lot of people a lot of cash and hopefully I have made a few people think twice over this period.

As stated I have provided a comprehensive, detailed analysis over why and how the share was over inflated, why it had a long way to fall, as well as the future issues facing the business.

This is a simple business yet complex in the nature of revenue recognition. It is a relatively unique industry in the elongated journey time from "sale" to "revenue".

I believe this to be still fundamentally misunderstood by most investors who do not understand the complex cash flow situation now faced by the business.

Some advice....look at the history of posters before taking their guidance.

...before posting consider if your post is required or relevant. Is posting 6 words such as "it's going to be 10p soon" going to help anyone? Most people only read the last few posts so your nonsense just means intelligible posts offering insight get 'lost in the noise'.

Anyway I'm done. If you want the info read my posts, if not then don't. I hope it works out for you all.

Bensherb - Read the 3rd post then genius. I will happily forward screenshots from 3 years ago. I believe my 3rd post on here, which as you correctly stare is 1 year old, refers to the posts of 18 months prior to said post.

To nocashqxl - if you want to know, read my posts. I'm not repeating myself. I have literally not only answered the questions asked but also shown my opinion on this share and what it is based upon.

Actually it's 362 days until Christmas.

It's not like I've been 100% accurate on this share for over 3 years......oh wait

Quite amazing the posts on here based on small upward movement. As I write the share is back down to 8p!

For me this was a very small bounce back in light of the Thompson sale at beginning of November and this was always going to happen as shares were picked up by those taking a "punt" with the share at under 6p.

This in itself means absolutely nothing. Until results are released there will be no potential significant increase.

If you look through the history of the share price there are numerous minor bounce backs.

"Timetobuy" - calm down chief. You're more excited than the kids were on Xmas morning. It's tempting for people to "See what they want to" in these situations. Go through @spenda's posts on this share over the last 2 years and you'll see exactly what I mean, and how this share has fooled and disappointed many!

Dictionary
/'d?k?(?)n(?)ri/Submit
noun
a book or electronic resource that lists the words of a language (typically in alphabetical order) and gives their meaning, or gives the equivalent words in a different language, often also providing information about pronunciation, origin, and usage.
"I'll look up 'love' in the dictionary"
synonyms: lexicon, wordbook, glossary, vocabulary list, vocabulary, word list, wordfinder
"half of the words in his text were not in the dictionary"

Grammar
/'gram?/Submit
noun
1.
the whole system and structure of a language or of languages in general, usually taken as consisting of syntax and morphology (including inflections) and sometimes also phonology and semantics.
synonyms: syntax, rules of language, morphology, semantics;

Anyone on here not got a "friend" who works at Utilitywise!
These friends always simultaneously are not particularly senior in role e.g. sales team, yet somehow have knowledge of a Senior Director.

Also fellas this is an investor forum, not MSN Messenger. Without intending to be 'rude' it might be worth a few of you writing to Santa and asking for a dictionary and thesaurus. At the very least turn your spell check on.

This will not solve the entire issue as I literally am unable to follow certain posts as they are incoherent drivel.

I'm pretty sure 99% of people posting/reading are aware of the issues you've stated.

Your 'enlightening insight' has been shared 967,436 (approx) times on this and other forums, but thanks.

As I and others have stated, the issue going forward is cash flow as they are not receiving upfront payments.

I think we are all past caring what 'geoff' did or didn't know. Plausible deniability and the lack of ability to prove what you 'think' you know mean it is pointless discussing.

As for Northern Gas and Power, Utility Alliance and great annual savings etc.

A) Have a look at Northern Gas and powers accounts on companies house. They have more cash in bank the Utilitywise did at any point.

B) The owners of the above companies have learnt from Utilitywise's mistakes - as have the suppliers. There are far more internal processes put in place to reduce the upfront payment issues. A far higher % of contracts are on a consumption basis rather than upfront.

C) The spread of suppliers is far greater so if there is a claw back from one supplier it will not be so large. Of course while any issues arise they can continue to use alternatives while any potential repayment is negotiated.

D) Unlike Utilitywise the above companies have implemented clawbacks into employee contracts. These covenants also supersede the employees duration of employment, so the employee does not relinquish obligation upon leaving the company.

Again thanks a lot for taking us all back to 2015 when we found out the issues you outlined.

P.s. when I said I was not sure how UW qualified or quantified a custoner I was being facetious and answered the question within the post. E.g. after the 12 month LOA runs out UW have no rights to the customer for renewal etc.

Also the point being that their current customer numbers resembles Schrödinger's Cat Paradox in that they will have had zero contact with the majority since signing. Remember UW receive payment from supplier, supplier bills the customer.

I have a mortgage with Santander, I used a broker. I consider myself a client of Santander.

Nocashqxl - please read the post and gain an understanding before you reply.

I did not mention revenue recognition. The order book is the sales generated not cash (or claimed cash) in the bank. UW are no longer recognising this as revenue, however they are recognising as sales. if you read my posts you will understand why I believe this amount isn't wholly accurate.

As for the comment ref what constitutes a customer, you really haven't understood that point at all.

I believe we pulled apart your "friends" claim(s) recently so I think you should just leave that be!

As for your explanation of the order book dropping due to companies using less energy; 85% of UW customers are SME and do not utilise such technologies - as such this is for new sales not existing, therefore consumption is irrelevant.

They have not dealt with or negotiated bank debt.

The share price dropped a relatively small amount after the former CEO sold his holding - this has nothing to do with the ssues pertaining to the remainjng 95% since April 2014.

Kevinmac - honestly at this price it could be worth a punt. The rewards to risk ratio is decent and as you say if it increases to 30-50p it will be a sound investment.

As a caveat to that I would say cash flow is the biggest risk as they could quite simply run out of it.

There are many mouths to feed and huge day to day costs. No point having income receivable in June next year if the pot is empty now.

Think of it this way - the absolute best case scenario for a customer sale is if a customer is called today and have just taken over a business and are out of contract. It's then A 2-3 week registration process until the account is 'live' with a new supplier. UW will then get paid 45-60 days later dependent upon supplier. Therefore the absolute best case scenario is a deal completed today is paid out in 2 and a half months time.

In reality that will very rarely happen. 99% of the potential customers contacted will be contract. Whether that be 3, 6, 9 months, it means cash flow is an issue.

Sales agents could hit their target month after month and not easily generate a single £ for a considerable period of time.

Smaller consultancies can circumvent this by giving autonomy and actively targeting certain business types or new businesses. UW are unable to do this due to GDPR and the sheer volume of data required for their agents to make hundreds of calls each day.

UW were in an excellent position and have thrown it all away, while the competition has done incredibly well.

I recently had a look at Northern Gas & Power accounts on companies house and over the same period they have done incredibly well. Now opening offices in Singapore, Texas, Malta etc and sitting with £20mill + in the bank

The same can be said of others. Utility Alliance opened up additional offices in Sheffield and south Africa. They only began trading 3 years ago. This is a simple industry with huge profit margins that has

I'm not sure how they qualify or quantify a customer. They say they have 40000+ customers.

A customer does not agree a supply contract with Utilitywise but with a supplier. All Utilitywise have is a letter of authority to enter into a contract on behalf of the specified name stated. The letter of authority is only place for a period of 12 months.

The supplier contracts range from 12 months - 5 years. Over 70% are between 3-5 years.

I assume Utilitywise are still including customers they signed up 5 years ago as their customers, yet they have absolutely no claim on them. When the customer comes to renew they are free to chose whoever they wish.

There will also be a significant amount of those contracts signed 3-5 years ago that are no longer valid due to a number of factors e.g change of tenancy, business failure, sale of business, change of trading name - amongst others.

Point is they sign the customer, get paid by the supplier, not the customer and then contact them 3-5 years later to try and enter into a new agreement - I would not class that as their customer and I doubt the customer would consider themself as belonging to Utilitywise.

The local supermarket class customer numbers on a weekly/monthly basis not someone who shopped there once 5 years ago and might be dead now!

As for the order book, 16% is a big decrease. The main issue is that the sales/orders are being recognised up to 20 months in advance of revenue being received.

Suppliers will allow new contracts to be signed up to 18 months before they end. The benefit to the consumer is they fix the price at the point of contract acceptance. In previous years 80% of the total contract was received upon contract acceptance by the supplier - they now do not get a single £.

You then add a further 2 months post live date before revenue is actually received from the supplier. The order book therefore is not a barometer of cash flow or the current financial position of the company.

As I have stated on a previous post, sales people can be hitting targets but not generating any actual revenue. Of course they still have to receive their salary and the costs associated e.g. pension, HR, payroll, admin, marketing etc not to mention the additional bloated infrastructure of Utilitywise such as their "well being teams"

Until these contracts actually go 'live' there is still a risk of customers agreeing contracts elsewhere or having a change in circumstances. Business' receive hundreds of calls a year from suppliers and brokers and if they think they can get a better deal they will take it.

It simply then becomes a lottery as to which supplier registers the meter first upon the window opening. The order book is highly inflated IMO.

Kevinmac - I'll explain to you why there is "hysteria"

*4th April 2014 Share price £3.70 - 13th Dec 2018 share price £0.05

*Revolving credit/finance agreement due to be renegotiated after breaking several banking covenants.

*Removal of focus from core business and becoming "jack of all trades"

*No/little industry experience at boardroom level.

*Reducing outbound sales numbers yet keeping cost consuming back office functions - whilst also increasing inbound numbers as they have stated this a strategy they believe will add value.

*Loss of experienced sales staff due to;

A) volatility/lack of job security within a company constantly offering voluntary redundancy and/or the threat of compulsory redundancies.

B)Operating in a saturated market place in the North East of England where there are numerous competitors offering better remuneration packages and job security.

*Change in relationships and lack of trust from suppliers has significantly altered the business model and cash flow. No £££'s upfront, revenue only allocated on live deals on an upfront contract % or drip fed monthly.

*Increase in consumer awareness and website comparison tools for business' which were previously only available to the domestic market

*Terrible investor relations - no updates, no attempt to convey any element of positivity. Late returns etc

I could go on but my diner is ready.

You have provided zero facts/proof.

What is fact is that there were 60 redundancies in October https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/business/business-news/utilitywise-cuts-nearly-60-roles-15264035

There were a further 50+ redundancies last year https://www.shieldsgazette.com/news/firm-offers-hope-for-workers-fearing-redundancy-at-company-which-is-cutting-jobs-1-8776084

Competitor Northern Gas and Power approached and recruited 75 of Utilitywise's 'best' sales staff last year - https://www.warnergoodman.co.uk/news/employment-law-case-update-utilitywise-plc-v-northern-gas-and-power-ltd-ors

It is also known in the industry that Utility Alliance 'poached' the head of field sales team and most of the experienced 'closers' within that team. These 'closers' are hand picked to join this team and contact leads/clients that have been generated.

It is known that the replacement for the 'head of field sales' left to take up the same position with Great Annual Savings, and again took many of the better staff.

It is known the owners of Utility Alliance, Norther Gas and Power and Great Annual Savings all began at Utilitywise. They all cheery picked who they wanted to take with them from training staff to sales staff.

Have a look on LinkedIn at staff at the companies stared above and see just how many worked at Utilitywise.

Check the Glassdoor reviews to see just how many disgruntled staff there are/were working at Utilitywise.

Search #utilitywise on instagram/Twitter. There are no recent posts from staff with this tag (with the exception of a few around the world cup incentive). There were posts from Christmas parties from staff 3 years ago, there is a huge drop in the amount of social activity and staff posting about Utilitywise. This is a great indicator of the morale within a workplace, how happy/proud staff are to work there etc.

It is also known that the monthly target for a Full time sales agent is £10k revenue per month. As within any sales industry 20-30% exceed, 40-50% meet and 20-30% are below expectations. If your team of 23 all met their target that would be £230k per month revenue. This is incredibly unlikely/impossible. To say that your team of 23 is bringing in £1-2 million a month is ridiculous and pure fantasy.

I deal in fact my friend and I do not believe for 1 second you work for this company.

gullible
/'g?l?b(?)l/Submit
adjective
adjective: gullible
easily persuaded to believe something; credulous.
"an attempt to persuade a gullible public to spend their money"
synonyms: credulous, over-trusting, over-trustful, trustful, easily deceived/led, easily taken in, exploitable, dupable, deceivable, impressionable, unsuspecting, unsuspicious, unwary, unguarded, unsceptical, ingenuous, naive, innocent, simple, inexperienced, unworldly, green, as green as grass, childlike, ignorant; More
foolish, silly;
informalwet behind the ears, born yesterday
"the swindler preyed upon gullible old women"
antonyms: cynical, suspicious

If the market cap is so unbelievably attractive then the question is why have no competitors made a bid? If they legitimately have 33000 customers with an average revenue gen of £1500 per customer, that puts their client book value at near £50 million. If this was a true reflection of the enterprise value that would have made them an attractive proposition at 8 x the current share value. Many competitors do have that cash floating around, the vast majority of suppliers easily have the capability to put that sort of cash together, the former owners also. So again the question is why has nobody within this industry stepped forward, absorbed the client book and dissolved the infrastructure? It is obvious and apparent that the industry has turned it's back on this and sees a potential 12 x return as to risky, so why would the average punter continue to take a risk!

I think you miss the point. The cost is only £295 to enter and the nominations are self-submitted up to 12 months ago. The board of directors will have absolutely nothing to do with this. This will be part of the 'day to day' duties of the members of the "health and wellbeing team". The point is not the cost of the £295 fee but rather the salary's of a team that does not directly add revenue - one of many such teams at the company. When sales staff numbers have drastically decreased this can not be justified and is systematic of the poor management and inflated costs.

I'm assuming the link to the twitter page is in reference to the European Contact Centre Awards? So this is a self-nominated "awards" ceremony where any contact center or customer service department in Europe can pay an entry fee of £295 and attend/nominate themselves. They then submit their own 50 page document on why they should win. Much like the U9's youth football teams of today "everyone gets a trophy". It says a lot when a sales organisation "wins" an award for "best health and wellbeing program". The argument could be that this just plays into my (and a lot of people's) opinion in that there are far to many mouths to feed at Utilitywise. For a company in the situation they are in then these inflated back office costs should have been scrapped long ago.

The post at 4.30 yesterday is not 'new' they have literally just decided to stop calling it 'corporate'. The offerings have been available for some time and are all offered by other large brokerages - Utility Alliance, Northern Gas & Power, Great Annual Savings, Green Energy Consulting, to name a few. SME will still account for 80% of turnover. The point about the ousted former CEO isn't that he sold his holding, it was more a "why now?". He has not been CEO since October 2016 and stepped down as chairman nearly a year ago. The interest generated by the sale was the timing as much as anything else. The sense of promise may be true, however that really depends on your perspective. Buying @ £0.06 and thinking this might bump to £0.30 on some positive news is appealing. Of course there are those who remember 3 years ago when the share was at £3.70 and there are plenty who have invested over the last 3 years as this has steadily declined as "it must" bounce back. I suppose there is little risk now, however that is hardly the point. P.s. how long do people call things "new" these days? "New" management have been there over 2 years.

Nocashqxl - I clearly did not say you worked for the company. Please Read the post before you reply. I'm sure your 'friend' was offered x2 salary to move 10 mins up the road and make calls from a different telephone number......turned it down as had to help Apple launch a new product or some other spectacular nonsense

Nocashqxl - getting a bit tired of the 'I have a friend that works there' stories. You say your friend is "doing a LOT of deals"(sic) - if he /she is at the level of selling/doing deals then he/she really isn't going to know the state of the companies financial status and the cash in bank! I prefer to go through LinkedIn and look for employees updates etc. I noted they had a made several analysts redundant recently or asked them to apply for new positions. This is on top of the removal of a layer of management/team leaders who were made redundant on 30 days notice around 6 weeks ago. It is also publicised that Northern Gas and Power were taken to court in regards to approaching 80 of UW's 'better' remaining staff after it became known UW were in trouble, hence the £3million in legal fees. I don't know what to make of this share, it was well publicised Geoff Thompson sold his holding about 2 weeks ago on this forum and others, it's not new news, yet someone posts it every other day - this could either go bust due to cash flow/ debt or bounce back, but please stop the anecdotal stories, there's plenty factual info out there to form an opinion.