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Sorry Tibbs got called to sort something out I will continue . I agree completely about the underground being not treated as seriously as the open pit back then but it was the major cut back not the LHDR that caused the shortage of ounces and the more I think about it the more it makes sense that they were following the grade and jumped on the issue on hand at the time rather than the larger picture. Namely blame the contractor and the LHDR not that we have backed ourselves into a corner and need to clear some waste to mine some ore.
I remember reading that the blame was Capital they couldn't even get the contractor right and I suppose because it was a rig they immediately thought it was something to do with a drilling contract.
Too much fake news back in history and as I say can't do anything about history have to focus on the here and now and hopefully this will shape the future for all of us.
halfpenny I hope I am wrong about the first quarter numbers that we will shortly be receiving but it will take a very strong wind and a tap into a bonanza grade to show a profit, unfortunately the strip ratio waste to ore and to ounces don't compute.
Pardey wasn't walking about on site he was sitting in Jersey and because of a shortage of any underground mining experience in Egypt is the reason why the contract was contracted out in the first place.
Hopefully the situation has changed and there is now plenty of inhouse expertise otherwise its here we go again the blind leading the blind.
As halfpenny says be confident and retain the faith and the new management and the team at the face.

Tibbs LHDR was seriously bad luck and only glad that it wasn't one of the large loaders in the open pit because that was where the real work was going on. I don't get and never did get why the LHDR was the cause of the crisis at the time. Unfortunately all mechanical things break and I have said so many times you can't have two of everything on site. It doesn't make financial sense.

halfpenny agreed that the second half of the year should be good but in the meantime the numbers I don't think are going to help maintain the SP and all I was saying is that the sellers could get the opportunity to jump back in.

halfpenny the year end report and the retail presentation tells us that production levels for first half year will be 45% of annual target with second half 55%. The impact of the cost of the waste removal contract plus other fixed costs will therefore be more expensive in comparative terms.

Sotolo yes I do see a rosy future but I will add caveats that there are numerous risks or impacts that can turn my optimism and these are all dependant on management taking the right decisions.
IMO it is imperative that additional mines come on stream over the next 18 months, coupled with ending the necessary but expensive muck shifting contract ( wouldn't it be excellent if they find something interesting in close proximity that could allow utilising the already available in country fleet of equipment, sorry getting a bit too optimistic). The move to underground owner mining has to be a success quickly and I mean over the coming few months so not throwing a curve ball that could set us back.
Like you I like the idea of introducing solar power and this will help considerably in powering static plant and mine site facilities.
We also need to see something of a return when offloading Batie West and timing is crucial.
My reason for optimism is Horgan's team but they are still in the talk the talk stage and we are still a way off the achievement bonus level.

Tibbs I think we need to wait to see if Cleopatra is part of the major waste cut back to be incorporated into the larger pit and as I read it the bonanza grades are also if not mainly open pit related.
You call them pull backs I call them unplanned necessary realignment strategies but of all of the decisions made in recent months the one that worries me is moving to owner mining the underground resources. I don't like taking on a used fleet of equipment and this "don't like" can be multiplied 4 times for underground machines that have thousands of hours on the clock.
Time will tell and as I have said previously I can't allow myself to dwell on what has happened in the past and I am sure there are many share holders who benefitted when the SP broke the £2 mark. I for one missed out as my sell instruction was a few pence higher than the peak.
Underground contribution is relatively small at the moment so they have time to grow into the job but on the other hand this change is being used as the reason why the first half will be down on ounces??

halfpenny as someone who is holding I hope you are right but I think we need to hold our breath as can't see that there will be much if any good news over the coming few weeks as if production is down which is predicted you can guarantee costs will be high and we will be seeing a financial loss. Will gold price help to offset the not so good news I doubt it but at the same time I am hoping the impact on the SP will be marginal and short lived.
We all know that production will be down and we are looking at a slow first half and stronger second half but this doesn't normally prevent a fall.
So the sellers may well be in with a good chance of the 80's.

Tibbs I wasn't actually querying the figures I just wanted to know where to find the numbers and Cowichan has explained so now all understood. Is $100 million a squandering of funds? At the moment I am not sure as the company I would think still owns the equipment purchased to do the work to ascertain that Batie indeed maybe Burkina is non core.
Without doing the work and therefore buying the machines they wouldn't have found out that the ore body or bodies in Burkina were marginal or likely to be unviable.
If they had employed consultants/contractors to do the work they wouldn't have spent money on equipment but then again they have equipment to use south of the border in Ivory Coast and didn't waste money using contractors.
Sort of a catch 22 and is $100 million too much money to get 2 new resources to the feasibility stage and prevent throwing money away in Burkina?
Will they get a good price for Batie I wish I knew and they would answer our questions?

Tibbs I wouldn't say don't invest in Nigeria because done right Nigeria is a very large and interesting market and was actually the company I worked for largest market for many years. Our company having been established over 70 years ago "knows how it works" so whilst extremely challenging can also be very rewarding if managed properly.
Unfortunately I think Centamin would as a new investor struggle to cope with such challenges whereas Ghana and Ivory Coast are better structured and investment follows quite clear procedures similar now in Egypt since the new investment structure.
Experience is crucial when venturing into developing counties and in Ghana and Ivory Coast there are people and organisations who understand the procedures, have worked in the structures and know how to reduce risks and make things happen.
Just a quick note if you go onto the Centamin web site and look at Batie West it clearly states that the exploitation license expired last November so they aren't hiding the fact but unfortunately not answering questions on the impact of the value of the resource, or indeed whether they still have ownership of the resource.

Contrary to what I hear from other people who contribute to this chat I don't see any issue with developing a couple of mines in West Africa. I would prefer they were in Ghana but Ivory Coast would be my second choice over BF and Mali for example.
I like the fact that Ivory Coast isn't land locked and mining companies, contractors and service organisations are experienced in "how it works".
If we were talking Nigeria then I would be one of the contributors saying No to a West African venture but thankfully this isn't the case.
I haven't made a film in either West Africa or Egypt like Sotolo but I have lived and travelled both markets and would be happy to see Centamin develop Doropo and ABC. I also see no problem Centamin funding these projects using Banks, Export Credit Insurance organisations etc like most other companies looking at growth to develop these resources as this will strengthen their credit rating and hopefully their SP.

Tibbs the reason I asked about the expenditure of $100 million is that I understand that there has been a considerable amount of money spent in West Africa but I think it was quite early on that the geologists and their mining consultants determined that Batie West in particular was a complicated ore body. Whilst the mining of refractory ore isn't unusual it does involve complicated processing albeit not unusual. There is an extra risk and if Lycopodium saw it to be complicated and marginal then best out and concentrate on other resources in the initial portfolio namely Doropo where the ore bodies seem on the face of it to be far less risky.

Sorry $100 million.

Tibbs where do you get the £100million spend on/at Batie West?

daren love your confidence but I am not too sure we are going to see any profits for a while yet there is just too much waste still to shift and going owner miner underground will mean reduced ounces while they get up to speed. So costs out stripping ounces so unfortunately I see first qtr results in my opinion being disappointing. I do hope I am wrong.

Cowichan it was a question that I asked but didn't get answered an exploitation licence at Batie expired last November and I asked what will be the impact on the value of the resource and also does this mean that the resource reverts back to the Government. As I say no response so I do reckon it is a piece of bad news waiting in the wings.

Tibbs what is more worrying is that I think the BOD at that time believed what Pardey was saying and Youssef was just a political mouth piece he wasn't a qualified mining anything so just read from a script.
Even more worrying is Pardey believed what people on the ground were telling him because that was what he wanted to hear and he knew no better.
I will never forget Pardey's embarrassing presentation in Denver when he was saying something that was already known to be incorrect and Youssef repeated the nonsense a week or so later.
As far as I am concerned it all started to unravel after Trevor Schultz decided to retire, a man highly regarded by me and more importantly the mining community at large. This I think also coincided although earlier with the much too early passing of Harry Michaels who whilst he and I had our differences he was also well respected and a steady guy to have at the helm of the mine.
Listening to Martin Horgan I feel confident in what he says and what he says makes me feel he really does know what is going on at the mine face and also understands what needs to be done to bring success. There is no doubt in my mind that he is the driving force and that he has a team he trusts around him but I am under no illusions that we will see some hurt before the company gets back on track. There will be some in my opinion long overdue borrowing/gearing as the cash gets spent to right the ship and grow the business.

Tibbs unfortunately the 560/600,000 ounces are the reason for where we are today following the higher grades regardless of the repercussions and impact on the plan. It is worth going back to the early years forecasts and if I remember correctly projections were for a high of 500,000 oz's per annum. The resource can only be mined once and this is why I hated the over estimated forecasts because if you take 10% extra out you need to find 20% extra next year just to stay at the same level. Sorry doesn't work. Far rather have a smoothing out with the occasional bonanza than highs followed by crashes and the inevitable lack of trust.

Tibbs thanks the strip ratio question was answered very well I thought but the Batie West question didn't get an answer. Guess Burkina and in particular Batie is a bit of a problem that Martin could have done without.
I have as you may have gathered been able to listen to the presentation with the help of Emilie Hodson of Corporate Management also the lengthy Q&A and found the event enlightening and encouraging, only hope when we get the bad news about BF it is out weighed by good news from elsewhere.
I think Cowichan's question about the seismic study was also answered and justified, a few small curve balls but to be expected for an open forum.

Cowichan glad at least you had replies to a couple of your questions it does at least prove that we can access the board.
Unfortunately I had an appointment at 2pm yesterday so very disappointed that there is no transcript of the Q&A's so no idea whether my questions were asked and answered.
I have registered my disappointment to Centamin so hopefully in the future they will record the presentation.
If you or anyone else did listen in my questions were as follows do you know if they were asked and answered : -

"Since the issue relating to the instability of the west wall we as investors have seen the value of our investment more than halved.

“Exactly” when are we to see a strip ratio in the open pit at Sukari that resembles what is acceptable for a profitable mine?

The resource at Batie West in Burkina Faso said to be non core had an exploitation license valid until November 2021 so does this impact on the value and if so by how much and when are you going to realise a value for this resource? Are you under pressure from the BF Government to develop the resource or pass it back to them for development by another mining company?"

Tibbs I trust you are well and unfortunately I agree that it is still too early for there to be any positive revelations BUT it won't stop me asking a couple of questions.