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If EUA run out of cash, or there is even that prospect, then that is bad for everyone who is long regardless of any other opinions
It seems to me that it's in everyone's interest to vote Yes (unless you really want the share price to drop!)
btw there is no evidence that I know of that DLA Piper are or would act for free - so if they are billing time that is not cheap...
Robinson
Are DLA working on a success fee?
Shez,
the myths are now:
"MMs holding this back"
"MMs walking the price down"
"MMs getting mates' rates"
They're not even involved in a lot of trades - seems to be a lot of OTC at the moment
cwebb is spot on, and if they did keep the price artifically low when there is buying pressure, they'd just run out of shares wouldn't they?
I suspect the sellers are the guys who did the placing at 22.5p - they put a time value on cash tied up here, and want to free it up for other opportunities
Judge,
:-) great metaphor!!!!!
Avi,
"don't think this is the MM's. I have believed for some time now it is one or more of the ii's.
They are selling to make the price drop, causing PI's to sell (hopefully), and then buying back what they have sold plus, what the PI's have sold. Just hold."
An interesting theory, bit risky wouldn't you think
I am more intrigued that nine ppl ticked it up on a board where I thought everyone thought MMs were responsible for all bad things, sp, covid etc
There's hope yet...
Onassis,
Plenty of ppl bashed Sound and Hurricane :-)
Judge,
I checked with my broker (A. J. Bell) and they state they do not loan stock at all
Makes you wonder why clients buy stock to be held by Blackrock knowing it may be loaned and shorted to lower the SP
Shez,
We can't say for sure what happened to your limit orders, because your Broker is pretty free how they could deal with them.
Here are some possibilities - I have no knowledge of the inner workings of Brokers - and they probably wouldn't want to share this sort of stuff so difficult to know for sure:
1. It added the limit order to its internal order book but didn't send it anywhere else, waiting for the general market ask (the lowest published sell price) to drop to your limit buy price. In the meantime another of its customers requested a quote to sell, they checked the best available bid (the highest published buy price) and found your limit buy price was higher. Happy days, they offer the seller the best bid (not your price) and if they accept, you buy from the broker at your limit price, and the seller sells to the broker at the bid price. The broker pockets the difference, no MMs are involved. This probably gets reported as two separate off-exchange trades and could be much later
2. It added the limit order to its internal order book but didn't send it anywhere else, waiting for the general market ask (the lowest published sell price) to drop to your limit buy price - same as above. The ask did drop and it raised a market order to buy and if the price was below your price, they pocket the difference. Note that one leg of the trade will be at the Exchange and one would be off-exchange and may get reported much later
3. They placed a limit buy on the exchange at a price below yours, the difference roughly the spread. Their limit order would fill roughly when the ask goes below your limit, that is the bid went below their limit, they buy, fill your order and pocket the spread. The seller on the exchange is probably a trader or on an investor (MMs don't generally aggress limit orders). Again one leg is on the Exchange one off and could be reproted much later
Any of these would be more complex if your order was matched with multiple other orders, or vice versa
Whether any of these happened or not the big takeaways are:
1. You can't assume a market maker is the counterparty for all trades, or even a major proportion
2. The way the trades are reported (including buy/sell) may be quite different to what you expected
3. The most important aspect of a broker is how they handle all this, not the size of buttons on the app or the latency of price reporting
The first two obviously mean any analysis of buy and sells to work out "missing trades" and "accumulation" is amusing but pointless...
Shezer,
Good experiment!
So
Are you placing a buy or sell order? (Sell by the sound of it)
Limit or Market? (Limit by the sound of it)
Judge
remember the little boy in The Matrix with the spoon?
Do not try and look for the 6 million shares, that's impossible. Instead, only try to realize the truth...there is no 6 million shares. Then you'll see that it is not the 6 milluion shares that are missing, it is only yourself
91jonmo, laurenlouise
You are in my opinion correct how the market works
There is (obviously) an equilibrium between buyers and sellers which ultimately sets the SP
MMs and proprietary traders can disturb that equilibrium in the short term by various techniques, but they cannot disturb it long term (by which I mean more than a few hours) for the reasons you have correctly explained
Unfortunately many many amateur PIs pick up terms and phrases they don't understand and repeat them and blame MMs for the market price not moving the way they would like
You (and I) aren't going to change that! Just leave them to it
Ama
come on, every PI knows MMs do this
They sell bucket loads of shares at below market price so they can then sell even more shares cheaply to their "mates"
Oh, hang on they'd lose shedloads of money doing that wouldn't they?
Ian!
That was rather rude!!!!!!
I understand the sentiment - but let's try and keep ourselves above the riff raff
MM
Makes perfect sense and I would probably do the same as you in the same circumstance (and to some extent already have - it was very tempting to sell out in the low teens after suspension lift) - but I needed more - and was (imo) lucky
Montmuzard
"Because the 2-10 bag is a surer thing than just about anything else in the markets right now"
That's a good answer and I've ticked it up
You are one of the smarter guys on this board (sorry it's not really much of a compliment), I do wonder about the others though
At the other extreme I almost see this that someone has won the lottery and immediately spent the entire winnings on more lottery tickets...
On balance I see at least a 50% chance of at least doubling your money with more upside possible, so it does seem a good investment at this price
My reason for selling most of my holding (and keeping 250K) was that I now have enough in cash to comfortably retire - I didn't before. I don't want to risk that cash
Investor
This share does remind me of Sound when it was at the heady days of 80p and everyone saying it was going to £5+
Funnily enough quite a few rampers here refer to EUA shares as golden tickets!!!
Takes you back heh!
Those that shorted at 40pish still well in the money - but probably closing out - those that held at 40p are 25% down, that includes those originally bought in at 0.2p or whatever
It does surprise me why anyone who bought at 0.2p, who has already 150-bagged, are risking ALLtheir gains on potentially another 2-10 bag?
Fred,
"I agree , but for you to state that this resource is not huge is disingenuous in the extreme"
I don't think I did state that....
I might even say that it probably is huge
But nothing is definite (well except the obvious)
"It's huge TheBeastofBodmin, that's a definite"
No it's not!!!!!!!!!!
some might think it is very likely, some might not
I still have skin in the game and would be delighted if it sold for more than one pound per share, but making statements like this is iresponsible - especially as if this does go down the drain, everyone making this sort of statement will say "well it was their choice for buying, we just stated facts, we didn't encourage anyone to buy" as they did when the price had a minor wobble recently
I know it would be foolish for anyone to buy or hold based on statements made on this board - but then why keep making them?
mjs
"who in their right mind is wanting their trade executed at such a price"
Well, good question! It's not a trade as such, but an auction between market makers who post bids and offers to flatten their positions at the end of the day. So it does seem each day, that MMs who finish short at the end of the day are paying a premium to buy back those share sin the auction. Basically they sold too cheaply
You'd think they'd wait until the next day to close the short position, but just maybe they don't want to take the risk of an out of hours RNS that'll punish that short position.....
mjs
"I assume by marking up the UT falsely everyday"
The UT is the result of the closing auction held by the Exchange itself!
It CAN'T be marked falsely.....