Member Info for BobsSocks

I should suggest that, for the avoidance of doubt, I am just expressing an opinion based on,

"According to the accounting definition provided by Device Authority in their most recent accounts their patents are worthless after 10 years and According to my definition in which a Patents life begins at the time it is filed."

If you look harder, at the top of the global dossier links, the grant dates are later than the initial application/notification dates by a number of years.

However it would seem that many of these applications have been snaffled from elsewhere and may have previous history. It is the general case that publication occurs 18 month after the original filing so they may have that much grace which does not appear to me to make much difference to their accounting statement and the lack of revenue indicated in their paid for analysis of the realisable value.

These should be The Bankers!

US Exclusively Licensed Patents

8213907 – SYSTEM AND METHOD FOR SECURED MOBILE COMMUNICATION
8316421 – SYSTEM AND METHOD FOR DEVICE AUTHENTICATION WITH BUILT-IN TOLERANCE

https://worldwide.espacenet.com/searchResults?submitted=true&locale=en_EP&DB=EPODOC&ST=singleline&query=2012101559&Submit=Search

Once again we are getting referred back to previous applications filed at the USPTO

https://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/biblio?DB=EPODOC&II=0&ND=3&adjacent=true&locale=en_EP&FT=D&date=20140213&CC=US&NR=2014047238A1&KC=A1#

https://register.epo.org/ipfwretrieve?apn=US.201313922605.A&lng=en

Once again this may be a repetition of a previous post... or maybe not.

This time at the top of the page there is a notification of,

"26.07.2016 Abandonment"

Grumble.

I did suggest I might fail.

Let's try,

https://worldwide.espacenet.com/patent/search/family/047190207/publication/US2014047238A1?q=AU2012101559

Leads us back to the abandonment.

Being vicious I will suggest that whilst Device Authority make a claim on an Australian Patent numbered 2012101559 they do not actually have one. Of course if they manage to properly reference the granted and in force patent I won't have to take a guess that they are being economical with the truth.

Otherwise I'll add that one to the Worthless List.

https://worldwide.espacenet.com/searchResults?submitted=true&locale=en_EP&DB=EPODOC&ST=singleline&query=2011101295&Submit=Search

Follows through to a previous US application which I may have previously listed,

https://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/biblio?DB=EPODOC&II=1&ND=3&adjacent=true&locale=en_EP&FT=D&date=20121213&CC=US&NR=2012317622A1&KC=A1#

I suppose the key word in the above link might be Adjacent.

It is not uncommon to file a patent in one particular jurisdiction and carry it over to another and get it through 'on the nod'.

I think I may have already posted this link but,

https://register.epo.org/ipfwretrieve?apn=US.201213517584.A&lng=en

Move to the bottom of the page and the first entries occur on 13/06/2012

According to the accounting definition provided by Device Authority in their most recent accounts their patents are worthless after 10 years and According to my definition in which a Patents life begins at the time it is filed.

This Patent is Worthless.

https://worldwide.espacenet.com/searchResults?submitted=true&locale=en_EP&DB=EPODOC&ST=singleline&query=8726407&Submit=Search

https://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/biblio?DB=EPODOC&II=0&ND=3&adjacent=true&locale=en_EP&FT=D&date=20110421&CC=US&NR=2011093703A1&KC=A1#

https://register.epo.org/ipfwretrieve?apn=US.90394610.A&lng=en

Move to the bottom of the page and the first entries occur on 13/10/2010

According to the accounting definition provided by Device Authority in their most recent accounts their patents are worthless after 10 years and According to my definition in which a Patents life begins at the time it is filed.

This Patent is Worthless.

https://worldwide.espacenet.com/searchResults?submitted=true&locale=en_EP&DB=EPODOC&ST=singleline&query=8755386&Submit=Search

https://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/biblio?DB=EPODOC&II=0&ND=3&adjacent=true&locale=en_EP&FT=D&date=20130912&CC=US&NR=2013235873A1&KC=A1#

https://register.epo.org/ipfwretrieve?apn=US.201313871784.A&lng=en

Move to the bottom of the page and the first entries occur on 26.04.2013

According to the accounting definition provided by Device Authority in their most recent accounts their patents are worthless after 10 years and According to my definition in which a Patents life begins at the time it is filed.

This Patent has Eight Months left to generate a share of $9 Million.

Just in case I should mention that searches under @Espace will identify differently referenced base documents within the system.

In this first example,

https://worldwide.espacenet.com/searchResults?submitted=true&locale=en_EP&DB=EPODOC&ST=singleline&query=8898450

We are led to,

https://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/biblio?DB=EPODOC&II=0&ND=3&adjacent=true&locale=en_EP&FT=D&date=20121213&CC=US&NR=2012317622A1&KC=A1#

Referring tho the link to the Global Dossier,

https://register.epo.org/ipfwretrieve?apn=US.201213517584.A&lng=en

Move to the bottom of the page and the first entries occur on 13/06/2012.

According to the accounting definition provided by Device Authority in their most recent accounts their patents are worthless after 10 years and According to my definition in which a Patents life begins at the time it is filed.

This Patent is Worthless.

https://www.deviceauthority.com/patents/

The first fail by them is the claim that the patents are Worldwide.

Whatever.

The criteria is the 10 year Time To Zero Value based on Device Authorities stated accounting practices.

Here is a copy of the list.

KeyScaler™: Protected by the following Worldwide Patents:

US Patents

8898450 – HARDWARE IDENTITY IN MULTI-FACTOR AUTHENTICATION AT THE APPLICATION LAYER
8087092 – METHOD AND APPARATUS FOR DETECTION OF TAMPERING ATTACKS
8464059 – SYSTEM AND METHOD FOR DEVICE-BOUND PUBLIC KEY INFRASTRUCTURE
8446834 – TRACEBACK TRANSPORT PROTOCOL
8755386 – TRACEBACK TRANSPORT PROTOCOL
8726407 – AUTHENTICATION OF COMPUTING AND COMMUNICATIONS HARDWARE
8438394 – DEVICE-BOUND CERTIFICATE AUTHENTICATION
9047458 – NETWORK ACCESS PROTECTION
9047450 – IDENTIFICATION OF EMBEDDED SYSTEM DEVICES

EU Patents

EP2268071 – SYSTEM AND METHOD FOR SECURED COMMUNICATIONS BY EMBEDDED PLATFORMS

AU Patents

2011100349 – TRACEBACK PACKET TRANSPORT PROTOCOL
2011101295 – HARDWARE IDENTITY IN MULTI-FACTOR AUTHENTICATION LAYER
2012101559 – DEVICE IDENTIFICATION USING SYNTHETIC DEVICE KEYS
2012101558 – ADAPTIVE DEVICE AUTHENTICATION

US Exclusively Licensed Patents

8213907 – SYSTEM AND METHOD FOR SECURED MOBILE COMMUNICATION
8316421 – SYSTEM AND METHOD FOR DEVICE AUTHENTICATION WITH BUILT-IN TOLERANCE

That one prods the spongy parts of my brain.

In this case it is likely a bridge too far but I had wondered in the past, prompted by the EP2268071 patent, how it would stand up against the technology implemented by Microsoft that disabled access to their software because you installed a new graphics card.

This is exactly the sort of hardware profiling that is claimed in EP2268071 and presumably in the, failed, US prior application.

Fortunately for Device Authority is is extremely costly to litigate against granted patents. Also fortunately for Device Authority no-one is likely to litigate against their worthless patents because they, Device Authority, cannot afford it.

Unfortunately, for the ADVFN clan, who live and breath the value of Device Authorities worthless patents Device Authority appear to have admitted at least half of them are, at this time, in reality worthless.

Then you might have to wonder what happened to the,

"IpCG estimates the risk-adjusted Net Present Value of the subset portfolio to be approximately $9 million over a five-year period beginning in 2018, and $18 million over the life of the portfolio (with an average expiration year of 2030)."

$9 Million they have made since 2018 given it does not appear in the present accounts and once again come to the conclusion that the patents are in fact worthless.

Perhaps the person who fixes Rhodi's printer can explain this one to people who are hard of thinking such as myself before Mr Spock beams into my bedroom at some unearthly hour in the morning and corrects my logic.

Thanks for the extremely relevant quote from the Horses mouth. I knew it was available from somewhere.

The 2030, average, date assumes the normal 20 year lifetime of a patent. Device Authority state in their accounts that they amortise to being worthless after 10 years.

On that basis, and being cruel, the £6,386,629 is at this time a big fat zero.

To be kinder someone would have to look at the dates associated with the list provided by DA themselves at,

https://www.deviceauthority.com/patents/

and identify the dates for each one to determine whether of not they fall outside of that 10 year time window. The average suggests that it is likely that many of them already do.

If I were to perform such a task I would advise myself not to be kind and use priority/initial application dates as the time to snuff.

If I were to report on my concerns I might also advise myself to question the mentality/methodology of "ipCG". Smells a bit like paid for research.

Feel free to ignore me. I'm just making stuff up to close my non-existent short and avoiding burning in hell or bankruptcy.

So there is no visibility of any value because there is no value?

I'm not sure that would lie well with the rampers. Tern state year on year growth, meaningless as a percentage without prior or base numbers to extrapolate from, so given this year on year growth is not visible in the Ltd Co which just appears to be running up more liabilities it must be elsewhere.

As an aside given my interest lies with the patents I notice that the 2020 accounts specifically stated them as being a fixed investment, on Page 9) item 5) but the 2021 accounts do not refer to them in such a manner but rather maintains them as being an investment of the same value of £6,386,629.

Given the time limited nature of patents and the manner in which their value may or may not be realised over that time especially in the case the associated technology be superceded I would be of a mind to question the manner in which DA has chosen to classify them. In particular being fixed rather than intangible and subject to adjustment.

Just because you bought a LADA off Rhodi in 2010 for £6 million does not mean you can sell it to a Skoda aficionado in 2021 for the same price.

Fortunately I'm not sufficiently drunk at the moment to ask Companies House for clarification of what might be bad accounting practice. Unfortunately the idea has been planted in the OCD part of mind that has, at yet, not been affected by alcohol and may dribble out at a later date.

Gosh!

Reading further in the accounts for 2021, published today, they specifically state that Intangible Assets are subject to Amortisation and estimates the useful lifetime of Intellectual Property as being 10 years, Page 5). As a result under their own terms, subject to other interpretation, some of their claimed IP should actually be written down as being worthless rather than being an Investment.

I feel the need to ask Companies House a question.

Would it be reasonable to assume that the value in Device Authority Ltd in the UK actually resides in Device Authority Inc in the US and as a result there is no real visibility of any value?

I kind of get your point but, in my personal view, sausage sandwiches do not work unless they are toasted and involve partially melted butter. Others may also wish to discuss the merits of tomato ketchup, brown sauce or mayonnaise and the plethora of brands available from vendors other than DA. I also see no reason to buy legacy sausages with or without protection because my local shop can sell me fresh ones.

Kkrr11ss2 moans about the link provided by Stentorian so Andrbea provides a substitute link from their favourite URL shortening service that expands via a third party service to exactly the same link along with the same tracking information that was in the original link provided by Stentorian.

As an aside I do apologise for misspelling todger.

It's rather like thinking that hosting your ***** in a prostitute makes them your customer.

I do make an effort to be coherent with my negativity but sometimes I miss stuff.

I think you will find that DA is a customer of Azure and AWS and whilst such an opinion might not fit within your particular reality distortion bubble along with its favoured occupants you might be addressing yourself to a different version of the Universe.

It is likely that Stentorian is not only evidence of the existence of parallel Universes but evidence that intelligent life has worked out how to travel between those places. The obvious clue comes from leaving tracking information in a link.

Other theories may be available.

In particular Rhodi appears to subscribe to the Green Boxes and Printer Repair Pub Mates theory whereby your printer only gets fixed if you visit the pub but you can't look in the pub for fear of being by yourself nursing a half pint.

Meanwhile over on ADVFN the excrement descends on the fly.

Stent giving an unsanitised link to a TechCrunch article comes up with,

"Even the mighty Google can't deal with the complexity and scale of IoT devices...so Google Cloud announced this week that it’s shutting down its IoT Core service, giving customers a year to move to a partner to manage their IoT devices. More business for Microsoft Azure, AWS and DA. The former are both DA customers."

Nom Nom Nom.

Kkrr11ss2 has a moan about the link,

"Stent Hard to get your head round that link ...... why not just buy DA Keyscaler"

Bear in mind that these are part of the LTH brigade who are so technically competent and hot to trot on security, whatever that is, that they publish advertising campaign links to their mates who click on them and wonder why the intertubes starts recommending Buttplugz with a side order of Lanacane at them.

At your own peril because whilst this is a, sanitised, link to a TechCrunch article. TechCrunch is part of the Yahoo family who should or will give you the option to try to refuse 468 tracking cookies so they can advertise Buttplugz with a side order of Lanacane at you,

https://techcrunch.com/2022/08/17/google-cloud-will-shutter-its-iot-core-service-next-year/

Still Waiting. Pipes up to maintain the illusion that Google might still buy DA,

"Maybe they will , might make Azure think twice.. The market ain’t going away."

The kite being a possible bidding war the problem with its failed flight being that Google are exiting the market and although there may be deeper underlying reasons the second thought from Azure, or AWS, might be to question their own operations in the market.

"Yo! Leyland. Sell me a Princess!"
"Mate we are no longer in business."
"Right! I'll wait for Microsoft to buy you out."
"Uhm. Tata ended up with most of it."
"Stop Trolling Me!"

Of course wiser people will recognise that Google, Azure and AWS make their own IoT offerings totally separate from anything else DA and others choose to host on their cloud services. They also may choose to dial down their support and exposure and rely on third parties to continue to use their services for their offerings.

There is a certain level of hate directed towards Google on the link to HackerNews,

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32475298

but if you read the words you might get the impression that the people actually involved in the IoT business are rolling their own solutions on cloud instances. At most DA might be one part of a overall strategy for them but it is not the only part and it is not the only solution to that part.

And... Last but not least Andrbea pops up to tell us,

"Good post that, 318596 It also said: [Paraphrase] The whole market is worth $Beeeeeellions!1!"

You can almost smell Duxy, no offence for illustrative purposes only, appearing on Dragons Den making the same argument.

https://www.theregister.com/2022/08/19/google_iot_core_axed/

One less in the competition to buy up Device Authority. Who will pounce first. AWS or Azure?

Oh, I've come all over Still Waiting. Damn my subliminal mind.

"You trolls really are going to be wiped out."

I look forward to seeing you in court.

However before making the threat public it is common practice to deliver the threat as a letter before action.

Oh,

"When you combine with other I.p that is going through the process it becomes quite unique."

I sincerely hope that you have an NDA in place with WYLD in respect of your claim to access to that information and the offer to share it because if you do not then should it exist you just burned it.

Why not go back to ADVFN and be stupid there.

Sounds good.

Care to post some links to your dick cheese on the board?

No, did not think so.