Roundtable Discussion; The Future of Mineral Sands. Watch the video here.
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2.203 to sell vs 2.244 to buy now, spreads narrowed a bit
If you are looking to take a position within the company with a view to a bid then buying now makes perfect sense. I thought we might get one or two large trades and I see we have had one for 1.5 million shares. I’m expecting a TR1 announcement soon, maybe even two.... lol
Gla
Ps anyone going to tomorrow’s AGM?
It will be suspended, but what if they secure funding once it is, it’s got the banks support just needs a few £ from II, do you think Woodford will let his 30% be worth nothing or throw a few quid at it to recover a larger part of his losses. He’s got 30% so any fire sale would need his approval.. unless he is the buyer..
That is the risk. But at around 2/3rds of 1% of its year high it’s a worthwhile punt, for me atleast.
The shares will be suspended? Whats the point in buying here?
Have a live quote to sell 500k at 2.2p, someone’s buying....
Sell Quotes have been going up all morning, I’m happy talking to myself :)
1.5m buy told there he is
I could comment on each of your points but I have seen your previous posts and don't feel it's worth the effort. It's clear you're either one of BF's sidekick's or a disgruntled ex employee but either way you're in the minority who isn't looking at the facts
A few big buy orders in background, can sell a lot at 1.9, it wasn’t evening quoting yesterday.
What if the 20% provision wasn't enough? What if the business has had to pay back commissions way in excess of that after many contracts failed to actually get live, many more suffered a change of ownership, more under consumed after being inflated by 'the guys who built the business' to earn mega commissions, let lone those refunded to avoid claims against the company. What kind of cash outflow would we be talking? Monumental.
What kind of cash outflow have we seen in dividends over the years since IPO on essentially a non profit making racket?
Wouldn't that be classed as reckless accounting and poor business practice, or just incompetence /negligence? It's one of them.
Maybe we should be looking at why the previous auditor delayed the results - what were they trying to protect?
Want a pointer to the truth? - Check the new rev rec policy of 65% and the massive reclaims by a supplier announced in 2017.
Oh, I'm afraid there are 'legacy' issues
As for the 'high margin services' I agree with peaky. They were just used to justify massive uplifts on contracts which drove failure of contracts to start, change of ownership (I bet businesses have gone out of business!) and were attractive to other brokers to exploit poor industry control, led to complaints etc.. Those services were never delivered and hence had no cost. That's the 'high margin'
Does anyone else see the self fulfilling nature of this flawed business model that was only sustained by doing more of the same? Wouldnt have been so bad if cash and rev rec were monthly as an when contracts were up an running, but then IPO would have been smaller. Much smaller
I was commenting on the original post re BF, fairly clear to see he has failed. Interesting to see how things unfold
Too many defensive points about the previous CEO’s regime. How much value was generated by the significant investment in Edd:e? How much was generated by the investment in ‘energy services’? The sales teams were dishing-out worthless energy audits in order to try to justify crazy up-lifts on Clients’ unit rates. If anyone choosesvto read the pre-IPO prospectus they’ll note the ex-CRO’s form when it comes to ripping-off Clients. Just ask the Nobles! Transparency is everything! That’s why Business Energy Claims will probably do very well!
Just basing on facts
Anyone would think YOU were the ex-CEO, Anon321! 😉
I sometimes think there are parallels between Flattery and Mourinho - this sums it up: "their real problem is that they don't have 20 years' experience but merely repeat themselves every year for 20 years." https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/47010477
Kevver - I sympathise with your loss as many have endured but to allocate blame to the ex CEO is just ridiculous. As below the revenue recognition policy previously was not aggressive and compensated for a 20% reconciliation from the order book (through COTs etc) which more than covered for the actuals. The previous CEOs departure will have nothing to do with the new accountancy policy. Your argument the stock he still held was marginal is flawed - 13m shares! The amount of nonsense posted from shareholders investing fortunes is unbelievable
Along with Boggyclouds, I have lost £300k on this donkey. On face value you would think that was part of a wealthy chap's portfolio but sadly it was the only one in my portfolio and also the bulk of my pension plan. Very foolhardy in hindsight.. ! What bothers me most, is that the ex CEO would have had full knowledge of the constructive accounting system used , along with, "the no glass ceilings" bullshit he was spouting and then selling nearly all his shares at top price. The fact that he held a small amount of shares under the new chairmanship was an insignificant amount in comparison and possibly more to do with not making it obvious that he knew the ship was about to sink. I can't believe that there isn't some sort of enquiry into the companies accounting procedures and whether Mr T. was aware of what was going on.
Agreed. He has been desperately looking for new initiatives to redeem his mistakes and has the backing of the board because he is a politician. I agree on IoT and would even say that another big mistake was dropping WiseLife which had huge potential for SMEs and had the potential for UTW to further develop their proposition rather than deviate to insurance etc. (no doubt it was because it wasn't his idea!)
Part of 'Strategy 2021' of course involved 'One Utilitywise' - the concept that the group and the locations would be unified and colleagues were integral to the business, yet a couple of months ago the corporate division was rebranded 'EIC' ... The writing was on the wall
I could've written boggyclouds' first post myself. Flattery accepted the role nearly 3 years ago (prior to announcement in April 2016 that Thompson would step down). Everything he describes as "unexpected challenges and legacy issues" should had been clear to him had he listened and understood.
The strategy announced in the RNS is nothing new, but the opportunity to implement it has gone. IoT is a difficult sell that they have repeatedly announced for years. If he gets £10m would he spend it more wisely than his other initiatives?
In any case, the bank won't refinance unless other investment is forthcoming, Existing equity holders have refused, and to issue £10m at the current share price would dilute current shareholders 10-fold.
He was appointed based on a reputation that was clearly undeserved. He, and the team he brought in, have overseen incredible value destruction. To have reached this point - literally a penny share - was not inevitable, but I see nothing in the RNS except old ideas and excuses.
Took a few at 1.7 yesterday aswell, total ~800k shares so Just over 1%, I know it’s a risk but I’m happy to scoop up the dregs and make the trade that no one else wants aslong as it’s close to the bottom price, with the hope of selling in to a rise at around double or building up a few free carry holdings.
I agree, along with putting a stop to dividends, laying off some long servicing loyal employees, the list goes on
The arrogance in him will of course blame 'legacy' or he will find another excuse but I can't see him resigning, he will be shifted on by the new buyers
I took a few at this morning and the trades are showing on NEX. Currently just over 2p to sell a tiny amout but NT on reasonable volume.
How can he possibly pay himself 400k when the market cap is only 1.5 million. It’s totally obscene and the board have a lot to answer for. How anyone is allowed to get away with this in a publicly traded company beggars belief. To add insult to injury, BF has the bare faced cheek to get the begging bowl out for even more funds.
According to today’s fundamentals sales outweigh buys by 10 to 1 and yet our SP is up almost 30%, I’m hoping there is a large order being filled, just need a white night or two to get things moving.... lol
Agreed. Tried to stamp change that was not needed and replicate the Sage model in many ways. Let's not forget his huge pay packet as well. I'm staggered he has continued to get away with it with the board and also that he continues to blame 'legacy' issues almost 2.5 years later. Accountability is the stand out word. Then the audacity to post about common failures of business leaders on social media - total arrogance.
Just to counter a couple of points made re inflated usage and aggressive accountancy - the accountancy policy was not 'aggressive', but in fact had a provision of 20% to account for underconsumption, Change of Tenancy's etc which was more than sufficient. In other words the business only recognised 80% of it's order book in revenue. It is clear BF's failure to address the issue at first was the cause.
Anyway I suspect his position will be untenable with any impending takeover
Yes, it’s been evident for a long time that BF has zero grasp of this business. Leaving aside any points regarding aggressive selling, inflated usage figures, etc., he seems to have thrown huge sums of money at various ‘initiatives” that were never going to yield meaningful returns. He had a cushy life at Sage. He inherited a hugely successful Division. All he needed to do was not f**k it up. Unfortunately he’s failed (miserably) at UTW and he should be ousted asap.