Rainbow Rare Earths Phalaborwa project shaping up to be one of the lowest cost producers globally. Watch the video here.
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Started: Leyland, 1 Aug 2018 13:47
Last post: Leyland, 1 Aug 2018 13:47
I wish I had seen your advice earlier Hounddog10 as I am now in limbo. I have been told by interactive investor that I have to wait to see if they reopen the offer or they is a compulsory acquisition. At least I only have a small amount involved but it is still off putting. Did you get your money out Luke?
Started: lukegrunger, 29 May 2018 14:50
Last post: Hounddog10, 31 May 2018 16:12
Luke. If you are reading this you need to do something to get paid out. At the date of the first closing of the offer they had 86% acceptances. If they had got to 90% or above they would, as they are entitled to, have compulsorily purchased the remaining 10%. The date of the second closing of the offer was 29th May. It is not known what % they have got but it cannot be at 90% or above because they have now extended the offer to 3 June. As a general point it is not automatic that you will be bought out. If an acquirer does not get to 90% generally it cannot do it. You may wish to keep holding but you will be a minority shareholder in an unlisted company with no trading facility. Minority rights are very limited for Guernsey companies - for example no need to file accounts. I have learnt my own lesson on this - which is that I was quite content to wait for the second closing date only to find my PEP provider did not support sending in acceptances for that date (only the first one). Bizarrely they now support giving acceptances on the extension.
I see they have de-listed and my portfolio listing is now '�0'. When should we expect to receive the payout and how?
Started: lukegrunger, 7 May 2018 20:34
Last post: lukegrunger, 7 May 2018 20:34
Ok, but is there not a form we have to fill in/sign so that the deal goes through? Or is the letter informing us of the share trade rather than asking for actions?
Started: D0berman, 4 May 2018 17:48
Last post: D0berman, 4 May 2018 17:48
As you can see my shares are in my pension with HL - Based on your current holding of 3,628 Shares you have been offered �1,632.60. As Monkf6 said on 25th April: No need to execute a trade - it'll all go through automatically, Luke. You'll log in to your account in a few weeks and the cash will be there instead of the shares. I presume that this means I can and have to use the cash to purchase more stock or funds within the pension fund!!
Started: lukegrunger, 2 May 2018 23:26
Last post: lukegrunger, 2 May 2018 23:26
But we do have an offer to accept/reject? I have been away so have not seen the letter. I assume the majority will accept giving the short term price increase? Any logic in refusing - if that is an option?
Started: lukegrunger, 23 Apr 2018 17:39
Last post: Monkf6, 25 Apr 2018 16:20
No need to execute a trade - it'll all go through automatically, Luke. You'll log in to your account in a few weeks and the cash will be there instead of the shares. It hasn't happened to me very often: the first time was WaterLogic. Surprisingly, the MYT letter didn't give a date when responses were needed by or a date for when it will happen!? Just soon, I guess, and as Hounddog says, before the end of year results are required to be released.
Hi, this has never happened to me before. Do we still have to execute a share deal to cash in on the shares? Or is it a case of waiting until the firm goes private in a couple of months - how does it work exactly?
Started: perkylad, 4 Apr 2018 12:52
Last post: Hounddog10, 12 Apr 2018 10:57
They will take it off the market before the full year results need to be released (end June). Deliberate timing.
Yep - and we'd probably do the same in this situation. Bittersweet for what MYT is really worth. 50% on a 3 month average seems reasonable - just very cheap. Some updates about progress through the year would have helped the share price. I held MYT for 5 years (fortunately averaged down). I hope MYT continue to do well and will keep an eye out for the no-doubt excellent full year results.
..for a decent profit, although I would have preferred to have not been bought out now and had the chance to stay in for more.
This is better than an IPO for-show, in my opinion. Interesting - as always - that selling part of the company will raise $500m while we have a current market cap of �50m. Maybe the deal will be structured in a similar way to the GE deal a couple of years ago? Or, for the first time, it could be dilutive? Either way, a re-reating is long overdue. It shouldn't be long until the end of year results are out now. As an aside: I'm surprised MYT haven't (yet) made an opportunistic approach to buy General Electric's 5% share of Tungabhadra as GE are "divesting" all sorts of assets at the moment to raise cash. Unless I'm wrong, that was $23m for 5% of just one wind project (200 MW). I know we've been there before with valuation so I won't use that as a reliable guide to estimate the company's present value!
Looks like it's 1600 MW operational right now with 400 MW completing over next 4 months. MYT will sell part of the company to raise $500m for 3000 MW and beyond: http://www.livemint.com/Industry/2jeeU8uhPTbqwLfPiWB3DN/Mytrah-to-raise-500-million-through-equity-stake-sale.html Thoughts?
Many thanks Monkf6. I see it is also on YouTube. If they are at 2GW I wish they would RNS it.
My thoughts exactly. They said it'd be March, which seemed overly optimistic to me. It could be that Vikram was caught off guard by the interviewer and just called what's in development (he does seem to hesitate). But the question is asking what the current installed capacity is now. Here's the link: https://www.bloombergquint.com/in-the-news/2018/02/26/2019-to-be-a-dull-year-for-wind-energy-says-mytrah-energy If the link's been removed / doesn't work, you can find it as the most recent post (yesterday) on their Twitter feed. Outstanding achievement if they've achieved the milestone already. You'd think they'd issue a press release!?
Thanks Monkf6. Could you let us know where to find this video. Surely they cannot be at 2GW already.
Thanks Monkf6. Could you let us know where to find this video. Surely they cannot be at 2GW already.
Vikram on video today confirming MYT now at 2GW wind and solar and will add another 1GW in the year.
Last post: skid35, 27 Jan 2018 15:03
The risk here is We are minority shareholders with koalas running the show seemingly not understanding corporate governance standards A sector subject to significant government Interferance An overall economy where foreignshareholders controlling companies are not really welcomed Having said that massively undervalued if they start paying divs
People seem not to like to invest in far away countries. so a gradual rise in the price will have to be what we must endure, then maybe as they increase profit, people will look at it, or it gets taken over.
Started: Mayflower, 11 Jan 2018 15:22
Last post: eddie1981, 16 Jan 2018 12:58
Surprised there has not been more comments on here. Its not just the gradual price rise, it is the volume which seems to have really picked (for this share!) in the last few weeks, Every day continual blocks of 10k until it pushes the price up a pence or 2.
this one is now moving in the direction I expected 6 months ago, glad i ignored the drop
Started: Hounddog10, 27 Nov 2017 10:12
Last post: skid35, 6 Dec 2017 22:03
Well said, absolute sham.
Completely agree, Hounddog. Overall, I'm just pleased no other skeletons were found, which I almost expected. This is assuming the lawyers and auditors did their job properly, of course ;)
A whitewash. Only addresses procedures and fails to answer why such a large loan is deemed legitimate at all. Anyway I think it is best for the company that Kailas stays.
Started: Monkf6, 1 Nov 2017 10:30
Last post: Hounddog10, 9 Nov 2017 12:08
Eddie - on GEC yes I was. I stand to be corrected but I think they are in at quite a low level and not at the Indian sub level which may be listed. I wonder what their intended exit route might be and why they went into it. It may be that they wanted a toehold in what is going on in Indian renewables. I agree the problem for everyone is at topco level. Of course Kailas could just keep his stake unlisted (if he delists) but it is not very attractive for him to do so when it looks as though the company is just about at a tipping point. I think like others the threat to delist may be associated with the loan investigation ie if you take tough action against me I will delist the company. However, as discussed he needs to take Caparo with him on that and from the outside I cannot see what is in it for them. The Mauritius intermediate company is there to ensure that the U.K. listing did not result in additional tax. It is a fairly well trodden path for Indian companies, albeit there probably is not great shareholder protection at that level. The share price is creeping up albeit in tiny volume.
Hounddog - are you referrig to GEC and lower down meaning their investment is in one of the trading subs - if so, it is one of these which is talked about being listed in India. So that would be good outcome for them. The issue for the UK investor in the topco, is that if the sub is listed, whilst this topco may seemingly have a valuable investment in holding a large percentage of the listed India sub, it will be very hard to extract value from it as a shareholder, as the UK topco is unlisted and thus difficult to trade the shares. Some murky offhshore company between the India trading entities and the UK topco too.
Kailas may care more about not falling out with the London financial community. He is involved with some big names. It is not a show stopper reason but it may make him more cautious. He may need them in the future. I wonder also how GEC see their exit route for their equity injection as they are in much lower down.
What difference does kalas being in London make, already installed his 31 year old son as CEO and stolen from the company. Look as the fusion ex delist. Shareholders screwed and could do nothing about it.
I went back to the Admission Document and they say they are subject to the Code plus the articles have been written to give the protection of a Rule 9 offer (unfortunately given the state of the share price this may be just in the 20ps). I am not overly optimistic but the more I think about it the more I think it is not going to be that easy for them to delist and screw minority shareholders. However, I would not hang too many hopes on them worrying about reputation. As a general rule Chinese and Indian companies see Western investors as sheep to be fleeced. The difference here being Kailas is London based.
Last post: eddie1981, 26 Oct 2017 19:16
Eddie - I am not as convinced as yourself that Kailas and Esrano are aligned. Obviously MYT was originally called Caparo Energy and a few years ago it changed its name and Paul came off the Board as Chairman. I made the assumption (purely on the public information) there was a falling out but it would be interesting if you have better information. Maybe they have made up.
Esrano is connected to the former Chairman - Hon Anged Paul. See the 2011 annual report (pasted below). 72.6% is not in public hands. Their interests are aligned. Thus there is only 27.4% of share in circulation who have the potential to influence (prevent) the those controlling shareholders undertaking what is in their best interests. From the 2011 report - Note 20, related party transactions. The Directors of the Company who are also considered to be the key management personnel are: 1 Hon Angad Paul � Chairman 2 Mr Ravi Kailas � CEO and Managing Director 3 Mr Vikram Kailas � Chief Financial Officer 4 Mr Rohit Phansalkar � Non-Executive Director 5 Mr Alastair Cade � Executive Director 6 Mr Charles Edmund Wilkinson � Non-Executive Director 7 Mr Philip Swatman � Non-Executive Director The entities where certain key management personnel have significant influence are: 1 Caparo Engineering (India) Limited � Hon Angad Paul 2 Zip Reality Private Limited � Mr Ravi Kailas 3 Bindu Urja Holding Inc � Mr Ravi Kailas 4 Bindu Urja Investments Inc � Mr Ravi Kailas 5 Bindu Urja Inc � Mr Ravi Kailas 6 Esrano Overseas Limited � Hon Angad Paul 7 RKP Capital Inc � Mr Rohit Phansalkar 8 Chakas Investments UK Limited � Mr Alastair Cade 9 Sila Energy Inc � Mr Ravi Kailas
Eddie. I think you are talking about the non-free float not what Kailas owns. I regret I have forgotten the AiM free float rules. I researched Esrano a while ago and I am sure it is Camparo who originally backed the company but I got a sense there was a falling out with. Even though a Jersey company I think it is still subject to the Code (not checked the admission document) which I think could offer some protection in a delisted situation. It helps that at the moment Kailas is UK based. I stand to be corrected.
Oh and another nugget to suggest the press speculation about delisting isn't due to the BOD reacting negatively to the corporate governance scrutiny... they spent best part of $250k on auditors last year and have often highlighted every year how important this is to them. It's funny though how with very little communication, it doesn't take much to start seeing things very differently. I still can't decide if I'm being wet behind the ears and falling victim to confirmation bias OR if I'm actually being measured and balanced. I just can't see Ravi trading in his reputation for a few more million when he stands to make a fortune in any scenario. Maybe I need a towel.
Eddie - Esrano might not be controlled by Kailas. Hounddog knew a little about this (see an earlier post a few months ago). It was the investment vehicle for Angad Paul who committed suicide last year in London when the family steel business collapsed. We're not sure what relationship (if any) there is between the families or if there was a fall out years before when the company changed its name to Mytrah and Angad left the Board. If anyone knows more, please do share. After your post, I went to MYT website to have a look too and we finally now know who the big seller has been over the past several months: Henderson Global Investors. They owned approx. 20% of the publicly traded shares but appear to have sold all 8.5m between May and Sep. I'm not sure what impact the share options granted could / would have in any desire to delist. It appears Ravi transferred 11.5m options to his Trust last year. It also looks like there were 300,000 employee (not directors) share options granted in the Indian company. This is all new territory for me and my only experience is in small Ltd companies. There's one class of ordinary share, each holding one vote so wouldn't Ravi stand to lose the most if the holding company's shares became worthless? Go easy.
Started: hereandnow, 26 Oct 2017 10:52
Last post: hereandnow, 26 Oct 2017 10:52
come very close to investing in this company several times. A bad experience with another Indian based company listed on AIM made me hold back. Share holders have been wiped out on that one (DQE). Paul Scott refuses to invest in any Chinese/Indian companies that list on AIM because of the large number that have gone belly up.
Last post: Hounddog10, 21 Oct 2017 05:45
Yes that was the point I was making. If it was a loan for a property purchase one would expect it to be in one go.
Maybe, or just didn't have a clue what he stole
Oddly it looks like the loan was in tranches.
Begs the question if he can pay back quickly why didn't he use the other source of finance in the first place. Need the full report to understand what went on, how was it contracted plus any other dodgy stuff.
Loan re-payed with interest is at least promptly done....
Started: 4kandles, 10 Oct 2017 10:19
Last post: perkylad, 16 Oct 2017 12:23
I agree with the negative sentiment here regarding the 'loan', but unless anyone is a mind reader, we will never know whether it was intensional theft or not. The market sentiment, as reflected by the share price, is surprisingly indifferent and would suggest that either shareholders believe it was a loan or don't care it was theft. Either reaction is surprising to me.
Few points 1. The CFO needs to go, if he cannot say no to the CEO in these circumstances he is weak and lacks integrity 2. Would expect expenses to have been abused, not just by the CEO but by the whole management team 3. Anyone potentially lender providing loans will have upped their rates with a massive risk premium 4. These type of people just need to go to jail, using a company as a personal piggy bank 5. Amazing reading the chairmans statement and corporates govn in the investor segment of their website. Unfortunately have a few quid in here for my SIPP.
Agreed - surprised the SP has held up, but these shares were already trading at bargain basement levels. An 'unauthorised loan' is theft by another name. Will struggle to raise new money or rollover existing loans with a crook at the helm. Trouble is that he is the main driver of the Company. Need to find a new heavyweight CEO if the Company is to survive.
I agree with your posts 4kandles. The worrying point is not so much the loan itself, which is being dealt with, but is there anything else. I had long suspected he ruled the company with an iron rod and this confirms it. I had always drawn comfort that, as the largest shareholder his interests were aligned with the other shareholders. The problem is he is the company. The non execs have done a good job - so often toothless.
...and if the company pays this guy off in any way you will know that the problem has not been dealt with. Mark my words.
Started: Kiwi69, 10 Oct 2017 10:20
Last post: Kiwi69, 10 Oct 2017 10:20
Hopefully this blows over quickly. Will be looking to enter once it bottoms out. Nothing wrong with the fundamentals of the business.
Started: Hounddog10, 10 Oct 2017 08:16
Last post: Hounddog10, 10 Oct 2017 08:16
Not so good but I guess shows the non-execs doing their job.
Started: Hounddog10, 29 Sep 2017 09:52
Last post: ZENGAS, 29 Sep 2017 13:48
The spend has to come before actual revenue generation so loss making expected imo given the heavy roll out. Construction recently and of now is progressing at its fastest rate. The generating revenue today for the period relates to a maximum 1075 MW of capacity. Trading update 24/7/17 = 1,119 MW in production with 624 MW under construction. In the space of 10 weeks a further 61 MW has entered production to a total 1,180 MW with a further 563 MW to come on stream (I presume staggered) by mid 2018 ie next 9 months and a total 1743 MW. From 10 weeks ago, that will be a further rise of 56% production capacity revenue to kick in and an overall 62% for this reporting period. While revenue might be pressured due to pricing, I expect economies of scale to kick in sooner or later and be able to pay down the most expensive debt packages sooner. Also with a Government transformer failure (now fixed) resulting in a lost 6% of revenue generation in the half, that might have covered the actual small loss.
Thanks 4kandles. My reading of the cashflow is that the outlook on being able to pay their interest is positive. There is now a comfortable margin of operating cashlow ($83m) being above interest paid ($67m). Operating cash flow very close to EBITDA. I can see them being self financing by end next year at which point interest costs should start to drop. One odd point in the accounts is that the recent refinancing is sort of explained at the end of the results and it seems to involve taking on/replacing about $250m of debt at c15%. In part this replaces debt of 12%. I wonder why they have not explained this better. I had expected the refinancing to be at much lower rates. I may be reading the note wrongly - it is a bit mangled. Generally, their explanation of their borrowings is poor. I think most of their borrowings are at floating rates but it is not absolutely clear.
...I refer to operating profit versus finance costs of course
I fear you are correct Hounddog, There was no bone thrown to shareholders in there in terms of a positive outlook. Without this, and as long as the debt payments are bigger than operating income then we should not be surprised to see selling pressure.
OK although I had expected a small profit rather than a small loss. Pity no mention of second half trend or exactly what the latest refinancing meant. I fear the share price will drift until year end results.
Started: Kiwi69, 27 Sep 2017 15:19
Last post: 4kandles, 28 Sep 2017 12:22
Thanks for your thoughts and comments, guys. It seems to me that things could go spectacularly in either direction but I'm happy to keep money on the table here
I agree with you, Kiwi. There's always a few negative media reports of tariffs falling, costs going up, GST, delayed payments, etc. and yet MYT seem confident in what they're doing to keep raising money and constructing more wind / solar farms while the opportunity is there. I just wonder if MYT are blind to / unprepared for the unforeseen but I'm happy that that's easily priced in at a �50m market cap.
From what I can tell from the financials they're comfortably on top of their debt. With refinancing on maturing assets, repayments will continue to come down substantially. They're essentially borrowing and constructing as much as possible whilst Modi/ the Indian govt. aggressively supports renewables. I suspect when things change, they will consolidate into a business model like that of UKW. Seems like a fantastic business that's only going one direction in the short - medium - long term.
Started: 4kandles, 14 Sep 2017 13:14
Last post: skid35, 19 Sep 2017 23:11
They appear to be able to refinance at lower rates so lenders clearly believe so, and they have better access to the numbers than we do. It's not really a headwind, it is basically the business model when you have an asset heavy business with secure medium / long term revenues.
With around a billion dollars of debt, the big question is can Mytrah overcome the headwind of its interest obligations and pay down the debt? How they can do this has to be the big question here. What do folks think?
held these a while ago as I needed the cash , but just got me 30k ish . had to buy in 2 lumps stock hard to buy?
Started: ZENGAS, 7 Sep 2017 16:34
Last post: ZENGAS, 7 Sep 2017 16:34
Much improved by the looks of things. http://www.mytrah.com/index.php
Started: Hounddog10, 27 Aug 2017 11:03
Last post: Hounddog10, 27 Aug 2017 11:03
My apologies Monkf6. I dropped away from this board for a month for specific reasons. Thank you for your 14 July post which was very informative. My two main concerns are that they will take on uneconomic projects in the rush to grow and they may run into a problem with debt. However, they have a large corpus of projects where the tariff was fixed prior to a more competitive environment and the debt looks entirely manageable. Indeed it looks as though they should be able to refinance some very expensive 12% debt next year. Nearly all their debt is floating I think (accounts not very informative on this) and Indian rates are declining and forecast to decline further. The DISCOMs are an issue which I watch quite carefully - but they seem to be paying and as MYT point out they are diversified by State. The mystery remains the share price and someone willing to sell which I think makes everyone think they are missing something. I think there is a variety of issues here. India being one. Another is track record; 2015 was a bad wind year so loss, 2016 they refinanced which led to a small loss and it was ramp up year which was not in time to catch the wind season and new accounting. All this has made the results very difficult to follow. However, these issues are falling away. The benefit of the refinancing and lower rates will start coming through, last year's ramp up will be fully in this year's results, solar will balance wind seasonality and importantly gearing should start to fall as profits are made albeit reinvested. I expect the half year results to show a modest profit (say $5m) although it may be more with the new accounting which seem to recognise construction profit on projects being built.