Roundtable Discussion; The Future of Mineral Sands. Watch the video here.
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Be nice if they could say what it means in reduction in AISC moving forward...
https://twitter.com/centaminplc/status/1641334212673302528?s=12
European stock exchanges were higher in the premarket hours on Thursday, with the investors anticipating the March inflation reading in Germany. The European Central Bank will later publish its Economic Bulletin, followed by the release of consumer confidence data in the region.
The concerns regarding the banking sector appeared to have eased, further boosting the positive mood with UBS tapping its former chief executive Sergio Ermotti to lead the Group following the Credit Suisse aquistion.
Frankfurt's DAX gained 0.31%. The Stoxx 50 increased 0.66%. London's FTSE 100 added 0.13%. The CAC 40 grew 0.47%.
The euro was flat against the dollar to sell at $1.08412 at 7:59 am CET. The British pound rose 0.08% versus the dollar, going at $1.23227.
Baha Breaking News (BBN) / AB
So would I Mike, any of the BOD who where part of the previous management should have their ar(ses kicked down the yellow brick road!
If Sami was so good then why didn't he realise what a pile of crap was being created by the rest of his family at Sukari and if he did then why did he sit on his hands?
why did Ross Jerrard who is chief finance officer with 23 years mining experience and all the the other Jersey wastrels either condone or ignore what a pile of crap was being created at Sukari!
Some people need to admit to themselves that this was pyramid scheme and those running it had our leg up!
At least Martin Horgan is trying to put things right, but its the other parasitic BOD buggers that need clearing out!
Spoonington, You haven't as yet come up with any viable alternative to the methods that Martin Horgan is employing to clear up the mess created by Sami and his team at Sukari
You may recall that Sami often claimed that they had the best people running the Sukari operation, sadly subsequent events since 2015 events have proven that wasn't the case.
Incidently EMRA must accept some responsibility for the state and the cost of clearing Sukari because as part of the T&C of the original concession contract EMRA was required to have an on site presence in a supervisory capacity since the onset of Sukari operations, so then it must be assumed that they either condoned, chose to ignore, or failed to recognise the inappropriate mining methods being employed by Andrew Pardey and the previous management.
Without external shareholders investment then Samii and EMRA wouldn't have been able to developer the mine in any reasonable timescale, if at all!
The previous managements irresponsible mining methods at Sukari is directly responsible for creating the huge pile of uncleared waste that Martin Horgan and his team are now clearing away in order to make it possible to mine Sukari safely and cost effectively.
In two separate articles of 2015 & 2018 mining analyst Kees Dekker flagged up cancers about the inappropriate mining methods being used at Sukari to gloss over the poor open pit grades by high grading and also the importance of the underground operations to support the commercial viability of the Sukari operation.
Subsequently and unfortunately for share holders the Kees Dekker concerns of 2015 & 2018 raised have been proven to be very valid!
However it should come as some considerable reassurance to share holders that Kees Dekker is now of the opinion that the methods being practised by Martin Horgan are the best and fastest way to turn Sukari around for the future!
Despite being asked several times and considering your claimed superior mining practice knowledge you haven't as yet offered any alternative or more cost effective methods to those already being employed by Martin Horgan's team at Sukari, possibly this explains your reluctance to write or contact him?
Well the past MGMT of CEY has been poor including the board of trustees (and probably still is) and the divi's have either been very good or at least okay of late. I have averaged down with the SP which I hope is a good opportunity and not catching a falling knive.
I think in parts we should be giving the new MGMT team a break ( 2 plus years new management now old!! it takes a long time to turn around a poor ship, get good people in, new systems and I think relatively speaking Horgan has delivered. Yes, I would have liked more and quicker but their are politics involved not just with EMRA/the board. 2023/24 will be very telling
Ultimately, I would like to see a clear out of the board and please god the share price gets up to £2 plus early 2024 as even I think 3 year should result in good progress.
Anyway wishing all the best
Oh come on Mr T, I know you have an inexplicable desire to unfairly deride previous management but this one is drawing a pretty long bow even for you.
If we examine the situation with a less biased attitude, you have 2 parties which share in the profits of an enterprise however one party unilaterally controls the expenditures, it is only fair & reasonable that the “silent” party be protected from the controlling party making inappropriate expenditures. Rather than it being a desperate attempt to secure the concession, which did result in Sami transforming a piece of desert into a multi-billion dollar producing gold mine thus enriching many long term shareholders including myself, the ability of EMRA to question expenditures is a clause that would naturally be included in any agreement where one party gets to control expenses.
The only time EMRA’s use of this power would become an issue is if Centamin management has engaged in wasteful, inefficient or inappropriate expenditure programs without proper planning & due diligence, the responsibility for this occurrence would lie solely with the current management & even you would be hard pushed to find an excuse to blame the El Raghy family.
I am not particularly concerned as waste movement is part & parcel of gold mining & even if it is done on an unplanned & inefficient basis, i doubt it would be in EMRA’s interest to make a major issue of it. One would hope that they will have received a more detailed explanation of the stripping program than us poor mug shareholders anyway & as such, if they had a problem with it, it should have already come to light (one never can be sure however).
As for contacting Centamin management directly, I consider this to be a waste of time. If they are not prepared to make detailed public disclosures about material operational changes (which in my opinion they are obligated to do so) they are not going to provide me with any meaningful information in private correspondence (legally it would be naughty to do so).
A free piece of advice, if you are truly interested in the long term value of your Centamin investment, you would be better served concentrating on the actions of current management rather than venting your spleen on previous management. No matter how many arrows you sling you will not change what has already occurred :)
What I was showing was how gold and crypto have moved up in tandem- debunking the old myth that people pile out crypto and into gold and vice versa … completely different investment profile in most cases
No- as i’ve said many times on this portfolio- I like to maintain balance and my crypto portfolio remains my smallest level of investment as the highest risk, next highest risk is miners (cey i trade). Will just keep the crypto as it could go to zip, but it could also go very high… my investments move from here to more stable, lower risks stocks, then property in my view the lowest.
well worth a watch Mr Gnome!
Then you have done well Steve, possibly you should have dumped Centamin and put the proceeds into Crypto?
Spoonington,
It was very good of Cowinchan to expose this unfairness or weakness n the original Sukari concession agreement which appears to give EMRA an unfair financial advantage over other shareholders .
As we are all aware the original concession agreement was negotiated by the original management including Sami El Raghy and family who were either well aware of this inbuilt advantage to EMRA or ignorant of it in their desperation to get a concession!
Knowing what we do now it it is very hard to believe that the El Raghy family were guilty of the latter and so the the previous management appear to have chosen to hide this potentially expensive inherent disadvantage of the original concession agreement by applying an irresponsible work around of high grading, this deceived the market and shareholders by amplify the guidance and profits for as long as possible,or until the inevitable near disaster, that being the crack in the open pit wall forced cessation of this irresponsible mining practice!
I am sure that most shareholders are as surprised as you at this exposure of such unfairness which does appear to give great power and advantage to EMRA!
However to be fair and face the reality of a very bad situation, the open pit had become too unstable and dangerous to work and the amount of uncleared waste made access and egress to the underground workings very difficult or hazardous.
So it seems the choices were either declare the Sukari operation no longer safe or commercially viable, or admit the errors of the past management and set about clearing the waste.
As I previously suggested why give not put your concerns in writing to Martin Horgan?
thers has nbeen some unfair critisism of Cowichan reagrding his challenging of the manement but in my view he is to be applauded, its a pity more other share holders don't follow his example, the manegment shold welcome the interest from their share holders!
My crypto portfolio is up just over 50% since the lows of Aug2022... main one before XRP for obvious reasons, but others not far behind. Interesting times... what interesting is that Gold was @about 1695USD at the time so an approx 270USD increase during the same timeframe...
Will anyone be surprised when the liquidity crunch kicks in?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O_Idoye10To
Lots of fun to come, some very predicatble, and good for gold ...
best
the gnome
Major stock exchanges in Europe traded mostly higher in the premarket on Wednesday as investors anticipated the latest economic data releases. On the agenda, today, are German consumer confidence and Swiss business expectations, alongside the United Kingdom mortgage approvals. Meanwhile, the week will also be marked by preliminary CPI readings for the euro area and Germany.
The DAX gained 0.35% at 6:46 am CET, while the CAC 40 rose 0.36% and the FTSE 100 was flat at the same time. The Euro Stoxx 50 increased 0.41% simultaneously.
The euro was flat against the dollar at 6:49 am CET, selling for 1.08394. The pound fell 0.09% against the greenback and went for 1.23310 concurrently.
Baha Breaking News (BBN) / AY
Happy hump y’al
I hope Horgan has shared the benefits of his waste stripping extravaganza with EMRA even if he considers shareholders generally too insignificant to keep informed.
The retail shareholder can do little to change his poor attitude, I did not realise just how big a stick EMRA has the potential to wield. On one side I would like them to use it to force some disclosure/accountability on the other the cost to CEY holders may be prohibitive.
Thanks for the info :)
RazorsEdge ,just depends on the Asians.
They are canny,and love the US trading it lower.
Then buy when it hits its bottom.
But there is no doubt that is where a vast quantity of physical ends up,a culture .
Seems to me a good culture.
In the UK ,buying legal coinage in gold is vat free and
Capital Gains Tax exempt.
Havea pleasent evening you and all.
Currently $1994 at the minute
Gold on a high again, may help the opening in Europe in the morning.
Currently +0.92% 1974.53 — days high $1975.17
Hi Bushy,
Unfortunately things rarely go that simply with Centamin!
Hi Cowichan,
Thank you for your efforts on making us aware of in the absence of some convincing explanation to to the contrary by the company regarding the possible ramifications of the announced change to the existing terms and conditions of the concession agreement that have the potential to put considerable additional costs onto shareholders for the future.
If this is the case then the management haven't explained the full consequences of the changes to the "Life of Mine" plan as clearly or openly as they could have.
I hope others will join me in writing to the company for full explanation.
Looking good for a rerate back to 130. Nice bit of divergence building.
paulmetcalfe,
I agree - but we've been waiting for Egypt to get the ball rolling for years and years
So far the only progress I've seen made as far as new gold production is the gov't owned Shalateen mine pouring it's first ounces a few weeks ago - maybe the preferred way forward is to make a greater share of the production themselves ?
What I've learned being invested in Egypt for well over a decade - talk of reforming the economy to be more global & open market friendly has been just that - talk
I suppose that shareholders have to hope this doesnt happen then.
IF Egypt want other miners to invest and start mining in Egypt then "Killing the goose that is laying the golden eggs" would not be a very good move would it?
Taking smaller percentages from more companies would be better for Egypt than trying to wring everything out of one.
Surley Egypt/Erma want the companies who bid on the parcels of land to start producing gold and profit/ profit share.
Spoonington,
yes , the EMRA can dispute anything and everything, most importantly for Centamin shareholders would be any erroneously made deductions to THEIR share of the profit - so if the capital project (in this case stripping excess waste - over and above the historical mine plan) gets clawed back it could take years of installments to pay back. Where does that pay back $$ come from? The BEST scenario would be that it came from excess free cash flow i.e. dividends - otherwise $$ we don't have, bank debt.
some excerpts from Centamin's full year 2022 results - page 44,45 :
Any variation between payments made during the year (which are based on the Company’s estimates) and the SGM audited financial statements, may result in a balance due and payable to EMRA or advances to be offset against future distributions.
This will be reflected as an amount attributable to the non-controlling interest in SGM on the statement of financial position and statement of changes in equity.
EMRA and PGM benefit from advance distributions of profit share which are made on a weekly or fortnightly basis and proportionately in accordance with the terms of the CA.
Future distributions will consider ongoing cash flows, historical costs that are still to be recovered and any future capital expenditure. All profit share payments will be reconciled against SGM’s audited June financial statements for current and future periods.
Legal title of all operating assets of PGM will pass to EMRA when cost recovery is completed. The right of use of all fixed and movable assets remains with PGM and SGM.
page 56
Included within non-current other creditors and current other creditors and accruals is $7.3m (2021: $9.8m) and $4.9m (2021: $2.4m) respectively in relation to the remaining instalments of a $17.6m settlement agreement signed with EMRA in 2021.
By its nature, elements of the cost recovery mechanism within the Concession Agreement are subject to interpretation and ongoing audits by EMRA. It is possible that future settlement agreements may be agreed with EMRA in relation to historic items.