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Iknownuffin, what’s your source for the numbers you’re mentioning?
I suggest you troll through the literature , FCA changed sorts of criteria all of a sudden in 2017 , so yes it is very much correct .
Cyberbub, the annual report said they served 220k people over the last year. You might be thinking of the number of people who have deferred repayment of their loan due to COVID.
Jimmy I don’t doubt you at all , but 40-50 k of loans currently on book , furthermore the amount of claims if all paid would not debt amigo at all . Going with the fact all these claims have a cut off point which will not be too far around the corner and I’m certain in the next couple of weeks they will have FCA approval to lend again mitigating further cases which in truth you will always have a few going through the net
Iknownuffin - two year deadline? That’s just simply not true. Where did you get that from?
FOS can look at complaints back to 2007. Lots of their recent decisions involve loans pre-2017.
Actually we do DYOR
Jimmyg how can they have served 220k people in the last year when they only have 40k-odd loans on the books from what I understand?
Iknownuffin, I posted FOS stats a while back. They don’t tell us what’s going in at Amigo’s front door. But they do show a very sharp increase in volumes.
Cyber , like I said no matter the figures for Q3 they won’t be substantial in any quantity to worry anyone, this has been made clear with funds provision from amigo set out in a few rns ago
Jimmy I should point out there is only a 2 year window claim 2017-19 not from the conception of company in 2005
Cyberbub, that’s my worry. And, whilst I hope Mark is right, I think yesterday’s VREQ may suggest the FCA thinks the existing provision isn’t enough.
Yes I saw that it was low figures but that was only for Q2. We need to see the Q3 figures, there may be a risk that they have jumped.
I will find the information later when have time but you can see the amount of complaints and the ones upheld as it was published a few weeks back by someone and they are both very low .
Roharps, Amigo has served 220,000 customers in the last year. It’s probably served closer to half a million people since it was set up. Given each borrower has a guarantor, that’s a million people who could complain about Amigo.
With an average £5,000 per successful claim and a FOS uphold rate of more than 80%, I think a provision that only budgets for 40,000 complaints and a 40% uphold rate may need to be increased.
I don’t like the idea that customers who have inaccurate information should win their claim. But it looks like a fact of life. The High Court has recently issued findings which are quite forgiving of this:
“I was satisfied that most of these Claimants were doing their best to give honest answers most of the time, even if they turned out not to be accurate, sometimes by significant amounts. That sort of conduct is not mendacious”
Kerrigan v Elevate judgment, paragraph 206.
Therein lies the problem Jimmyg I suppose. We don't know how many complaints have been received and how many are still likely to come in. We don't know the uphold rate or the average payout so far. Why can't the company just give a quarterly update - or would it look too bad?
Youneverknow - I don’t think A or B applies. In both scenarios, you said Amigo know the value of claims. They don’t. They’ve made certain assumptions about which inform their provision. But they don’t know that those assumptions will come to pass.
By my maths, these are roughly Amigo’s assumptions:
Total complaints that will be received - 40,000
Uphold rate - 40%
Total number of upheld complaints - 16,000
Average redress per uphold - £5,000
Other costs (recruit / train / pay complaint handlers, FOS fees etc) - £40million
The provision was announced in July, we don’t know whether recent complaints trends are in line with these assumptions. BOD very tight lipped about what’s going on. But we saw FOS figures showing very very steep rise in complaints numbers.
Roharps ------ The claims do not go back to the companies inception in 2005, this has been covered at length on this board back June / July time ( i do not have the time to go back looking for exact dates ), they are there if you need to put your mind at rest.
It makes me laugh with opinions being thrown around here which is good no complaints but , few new positions last couple of weeks , turnaround specialist in place , money in the bank , payments have been steady , claims are low ( please go and find the table with amount of claims in at present to banks etc and it will show amigo ) , redress coming with FCA , yesterday’s rns was categorically good not some hidden agenda from FCA or amigo , recession is looming when these companies come into their own so please any chance of going bust is absolutely zero especially with poster by some of the best analysts a rating of 175p share observed within the next 12 months so digest all of the above :)
Amigo have put aside 115 million to pay for misold loans. Claims companies have seen that there is a 94% uphold rate by fos and an average 4500 a claim being paid to people who claimed miselling and thought... That is big enough to make money from a cut.
They know that 220000 different individuals took out loans since 2005 at 3 quarters of a billion quid and that is alot of people they can get fees out of. They have put adverts advertising basically saying ... An opportunity has arisen to complain and get loads of money. They are happy to write the letter in exactly the way to get compensation.
Here is the thing. People are getting paid out when they lied on their application becuase amigo 'should have. Picked this up'
Claims companies are putting ideas into people's minds that people underestimated expenditure due to guesswork. Maybe true sometimes but more often then not probably lies which they say afterwards was accidental.
I am very concerned that Amigo is getting attacked sometimes fraudulently by claims and I hope the regulator see this side of things. As a shareholder I want those genuinely misold to be redressed but I do not want these opportunists unjustifiably running this business into the ground.
If amigo survive all this. They will come back much stronger I'm sure with a much better process of lending.
I'm with mark. Today was misunderstood. The new vreq is going to allow fca sanctioned lending to recommence and a big reassurance to them that we wont be utilising any of the questionable restructuring ideas that have been mooted recently. This is a step towards opening up for business. I was fortunate enough to get some at 8.3 today, and I'm sure many of the filtered usernames did also.
Ynk, hd...who knows who he/she is? Dont really care. Shove him in the bin along with all the others. Cuts down the reading to several posts a day rather than 500+ and you can get on with enjoying life whilst we wait for lending to recommence which shouldn't be long now.
BTW, apart from being a petulant individual, who annoys the hell out of me, who is Hounddog?
Brilliant, thank you.
The claims vreq then, is for Amigo to be dealing with all client claims, within 8 weeks, and they should be doing this by 30.10.2020. In which case they WILL meet this deadline (if they don't, they may as well leave the building), but it will get extended, for the future claims coming in. All future claims accounted for in the provision. First job done.
Not sure whether Mark is absolutely spot on, but he is on the right lines. Amigo don't need fca agreement to relend. However, its imperative BOD keep fca updated with plans, to demonstrate compliance. Offering up/agreement to the restriction on assets is a no brainer. Headlines about fca's concern about amigo conduct, is not about how amigo is being run now, but the historical lending, for which amigo are addressing by paying out on claims. FCA just want to make sure that provision is ring fenced/untouchable, which as far as the current bod it is anyway. Only if an erratic new company owner/bod were to take control, would the provision be at risk, which has now been addressed. No big deal. Phew.
A. -more or less.
All claims fos or otherwise dealt with within 8 weeks of origination.
The know the value of existing Worse case for claims and added a provision for what they expect to cover the remaining future claims.
can someone do me a favour please, and confirm whether its a or b below, that applies to amigo's claims?
a) amigo know the value of the claims more or less (covered by provision), and its up to the client to make a complaint, and if they do, amigo have 8 weeks to deal with it, ie onus is on client.
or
b) amigo know the value of the claims more or less, and its down to AMIGO to pay all claims by by 30.10.2020.
I was under impression it was a, in which case, the vreq deadline, was to ensure that Amigo were now dealing with them, as and when they come in, within 8 weeks.