Gordon Stein, CFO of CleanTech Lithium, explains why CTL acquired the 23 Laguna Verde licenses. Watch the video here.
London South East prides itself on its community spirit, and in order to keep the chat section problem free, we ask all members to follow these simple rules. In these rules, we refer to ourselves as "we", "us", "our". The user of the website is referred to as "you" and "your".
By posting on our share chat boards you are agreeing to the following:
The IP address of all posts is recorded to aid in enforcing these conditions. As a user you agree to any information you have entered being stored in a database. You agree that we have the right to remove, edit, move or close any topic or board at any time should we see fit. You agree that we have the right to remove any post without notice. You agree that we have the right to suspend your account without notice.
Please note some users may not behave properly and may post content that is misleading, untrue or offensive.
It is not possible for us to fully monitor all content all of the time but where we have actually received notice of any content that is potentially misleading, untrue, offensive, unlawful, infringes third party rights or is potentially in breach of these terms and conditions, then we will review such content, decide whether to remove it from this website and act accordingly.
Premium Members are members that have a premium subscription with London South East. You can subscribe here.
London South East does not endorse such members, and posts should not be construed as advice and represent the opinions of the authors, not those of London South East Ltd, or its affiliates.
I expect most people on here are thinking the same thing Dan
Mikey. I have just read your post, bought at 90p How many more more did you buy? one? Only joking mate, good luck. You don't have to mad to buy vod' shares, but if you are, it helps!
So Mary as a F.T. F.C.A. is it compulsory to talk in riddles as many accountants do? As opposed to just saying what you mean in the first place?
' I could see them taking legal action if a merger was waived through'
I think they take legal action as a matter of course and to get a remedy. All those high street zombie shop fronts need consolidating and rebranding now you can buy online. I cant remember the last time I went into a phone shop. When I think 3, I think 5...their job as a 'new entrant' disruptor is done and we now have the consumer mobile internet. Next phase could be eg making Hutch ports Smarter and need VOD UK. That would be a big account and attract FDI. Win Win for UK PLC imo
"I will continue to add if it goes sub 90p"
Well done for achieving your 90p buy yesterday, I was dubious it would dip that far. I suspect the broker/dealers had a lot of 90p buy orders and helped the stock dip to meet the orders, so they could benefit from the dealing charges, but that's just my suspicious nature lol.
Historically this is a crazy price for VOD - the share was trading at 136p when covid was announced and we had no vaccine and no prospect of a vaccine - that is around 30pct higher than the share price today, admittedly since then we have had Brexit and the war in Ukraine which has taken its toll on economic growth but one has to be realistic here - is it really worse for VOD than it was then? - I will continue to add if it goes sub 90p
gla dyor etc
One thing I forgot to say about 3 is that they are heavily in sectors that VOD dont bother with such as area mobile data for smartmeters, smart bus stops, wireless telemetry for all sorts of wierd remote apps, in-car wireless data etc etc. This is a growing market and 3 are possibly one of the leaders in the UK
"Knowing telecoms and both 3 and VOD I think this analysis is very valid. A merger of these 2 is a mutually brilliant idea. 3 struggles to scale and control its back office cost base, while VOD could use the extra market share and sector share."
I can see the advantages for Vodafone and 3 merging, but the regulatory hurdles for such a merger will be massive. 3 and Vodafone are both mobile providers, so both providing the same service in competition with each other. BT's takeover of EE and the VM merger with O2 were both tie ups between fixed line and mobile companies, so different from a Vodafone/3 merger. Unless it suits BT and VMO2 to narrow the field, I could see them taking legal action if a merger was waived through, and there's a good possibility others may take legal action even if the big two don't. Weighing up the probabilities, there's more chance a Vodafone/3 merger will be blocked, rather than allowed to happen.
"Despite the good news of OPERATING Cashflow (not to be confused with FCF (Free Cashflow) being more than sufficient to meet debt repayments for both VOD AND BT - Both have terrible liquidity ratios. Terrible!
Now that does confuse the hell out of me! Tsk! How can that be?
Must be Schrodinger's Cat syndrome and all that :)"
Telecom companies are currently directing huge amounts of capex into FTTP and 5G. These are likely to be the last major Telecom infrastructure upgrades for generations. Once the current round of Capex is completed, the operating costs should be considerably lower, particularly in BT's case. I'm heavily invested in both BT and Vodafone, but I can see BT's path to growing the bottom line much more clearly, probably because BT is easier to understand, and I don't buy into the Altnet threat narrative. Although I'm confident in my Vodafone investment, I was unsure about Vodafone's takeover of Unitymedia, due to the network being Docsis based and likely requiring conversion to FTTP at some point in the future, as is the case with VMO2 in the UK .
Mary the accountant , welcome aboard ....what are the numbers saying at Vod .. atb
Love the way anyone can pretend to be whatever they want behind a keyboard lol..
anyone who bought ion the Ex date, missed the dividend.
O Danny boy...
full time (FT) Fellow member of Chartered Accountants (FCA)... Happy/ Here/ Hope To Help (HTH)
PPS, To the below post.
- Despite the good news of OPERATING Cashflow (not to be confused with FCF (Free Cashflow) being more than sufficient to meet debt repayments for both VOD AND BT - Both have terrible liquidity ratios. Terrible!
Now that does confuse the hell out of me! Tsk! How can that be?
Must be Schrodinger's Cat syndrome and all that :)
- F'king financial accountants and their above-the-line and below-the-line stuff
Hi Mulder,
Yes, hadn’t compared to others so until you pointed it out, I didn’t realise VOD had the more manageable “NET” Debt ratio; so thanks for highlighting that fact.
However . . .
- must take issue with the wildly incorrect (IMO) BT ratio; so have to ask what data supplier are you using for your debt metrics?
Or is it I, that has it all incorrect?
Is it the Morning Star website you use or somesuch (as you include a couple of US stocks for comparison?)
I used another data supplier besides my expensive subscription package data supplier and both have nowhere near the poor result you lay at BT’s door.
In fact I see quite a difference to VOD’s that you show, but your overall assertion seems to hold that VOD is the best debtor ratio of a bad bunch of debtors, so to speak. : )
Didn’t bother with the US stocks after finding BT wildly inaccurate (so inaccurate I expect you’ll be hearing from Fleccy :)
Firstly, you have to compare like with like.
And Net debt to equity can only be reasonably accepted if the very latest trading results are used. I very much doubt they all have the same H1 dates although BT’s dates are pretty close to VOD’s.
Secondly, which debt metrics did you use because they all differ vastly.
1) Did you use Long Term Debt?
- or did you include Capital Lease Obligations which can massively increase the amount to give the -
2) TOTAL Long Term Debt?
- Or more confusingly the
3) Total Debt which is higher than any of the above? ( €70B for last full year! )
[One more post coming on the weekend on that amount).
When in my view, the more pertinent debt is –
4) The NET Debt?
I see VOD as 109.44% ie., 1.09
Which is a much better performance than your 1.7
BT which you show as a terrible 3.3 I have as 130.31% ie., 1.30
So yes, VOD is still the better net debt to equity participant– but both stocks are much higher than the generally accepted 50% debt leverage point, beyond which red flags are raised on both stocks.
So both draw criticisms but BT’s red line crosses is deemed the more guilty player.
The main take-away is that despite VOD’s large net debt it is still well covered by Operating Cash Flow.
Please don’t think I know more than this post suggests. I don’t.
(I have access to data subscription packages that give me a helping hand).
PS.
Like VOD, BT’s Operating Cashflow also easily covers debt repayments.
-------------
BUT I would still like to know how you arrive at such an horrendous Net Debt to equity ratio for BT, as it’s only a little worse than VOD’s ratio.
Hello Rob, I was going to say we should agree to disagree about Nick Read, but you beat me to it. Glad you got in at 91p but I thought you would have waited until later for the ex divi day fall you predicted? Obviously the sp doesn't always fall more than the divi on ex divi day as many have suggested, (up a net 1.8p today). It often has in the past, but it's the future that's counts. Talking of Mikey, last thing I heard he was in an Ex vodafone employee downhill ski race with Narcus. I think Mikey should win easily, as he is an expert on the subject!? Cheers rob, have a good weekend.
Thank you Mary for your explanation. "Not a day trader as a FC FTA. I am HTH" What the **** is that supposed to mean? Try speaking in plain English Please? You make absolutely no sense at all. But good luck trying, you may get there one day?
Knowing telecoms and both 3 and VOD I think this analysis is very valid. A merger of these 2 is a mutually brilliant idea. 3 struggles to scale and control its back office cost base, while VOD could use the extra market share and sector share.
Mulder, thanks for that analysis.
Looking at historic OECD data, Asia pac countries leverage mobile revenues off low debt to high income ratios while the Americas have low income to high debt ratios. UK is in the middle and slightly better than EU. It makes sense that Asia pac markets are generally less developed and less competitive than western markets so investment in infrastructure is lower.
10 years or so ago, the UK had the highest mobile revenue to debt ratio in the OECD and gave some of it up in an accelerated reduction in mobile termination rates in which 3 was the 'new entrant' agitator, drawing a line under long run incremental costs across EU and a tipping point to data economics and data network architectures....
In the end to end process we saw EE restructuring and many other examples of multi lateral reciprocation such as VOD increasing network investments in Germany. All of this was due to Globalisation (WTO, GATTS rules etc) and European alignment of policy interests giving us in the UK the local flavour of competition between firms ie the number of licensed mobile operators and consumer choice....
So in the current round of trade agreements, if our policy makers are any good, they will be callibrating for the comparative debt leverage ratios and, fingers crossed, allowing the market to consolidate.
For example, if Sunak and Hunt have their fingers on the pulse, they wont be throwing the baby out with the bathwater, and they will encourage the VOD 3UK consolidation as a catalyst for the next stage of regulated telecoms in the UK, Europe and Globally (eg China opening up again and India in particular because of its size) as part of coordinated trade policy agreements.
Vodafone wont be thrown to the wolves imo. In fact, with Reid promoting the principles of access to mobile internet as a human right, probably (as who else cares?) underpin the principles of free trade/ trade agreements and probably a return to WTO/OECD regulation using debt ratios relative to GDP for all the countries that VOD operates in.
So I still like the word 'resilient' in the face of the negotiations ahead. The current SP is a once in a lifetime bargain imo
Hi Dan, not sure we will ever agree on that point i made, but it doesn't matter, let's hope they can pull something out of the bag then and turn this around, doubled my number of shares here today at 91p which is almost half what i paid 6 years ago, more fool me perhaps, let's hope things will be looking better here in 2023 and at least we have Mikey on board wishing it up
best of luck
My brother is starting on here in a minute. Calls himself ToeRag. In olden days the very poor had to wrap their feet in rags. Hence Toe rag.
Where i live in Stroud the poor used to take buckets of urine to the cloth mill because they needed ammonia. Hence 'taking the p***' came about.
Anyone that bought yesterday for the dividend and held on today is approximately 1.5 p/share up in real terms. Not bad. Wish i bought some now.
Evanescent
In the North and can see S&G from back of house and Belfast Castle from the front. Used to have beautiful views of Belfast Lough before they were reclaimed, but at least the waft of the landfill gases has long since gone :)
Mulder - This is pretty interesting I would never have believed it especially BT ! Before I retired I was a telecoms infrastructure sales Director and we saw Vodafone as an eldorado customer along with BT also. Trouble was to do business with either hammered our margins !!
Trump45 - I agree with what you say but to drag the narrative back to AIM stocks it is very rare to be able to actually do a valid financial analysis so belief is actually all you do have, trouble is many people turn this 'belief' into confirmation bias or if they dont they fool others into their belief being fact for their own self interest !