Member Info for ToffAppleton1

Barclays business model is very different to NatWest and Lloyds, which are both domestically centred retail bankers. Barclays makes most of its revenue overseas too, making it an ideal for for a US market listing.

Barclays is first and foremost an investment bank with a retail arm attached. Unlike credit Suisse and Deutsche bank, which are the nearest comparable banking models, Barclays has been able to compete with the American giants. Their Lehman's acquisition really bolstered their presence and operations in America.

But, as we’ve seen, no matter how successful the results, no matter how high the profits, if you hitch your wagon to the ftse 100 cesspit, your share performance will stagnate, or plunge into decline.

If their results smash expectations the shareprice might rise a penny. If they come in a fraction short market makers will mark them down ten percent.

Two factors that amaze me.

1. Given Barclays track record of delivering in all departments, why haven’t JPM or GS made a takeover bid. The bank is the cheapest stock in the bombed out Permabear 100. It trades for chump change. At an eye watering discount to its American peers. I suggest the reason may be political. Slimy politicians have politicized the banking sector since the financial crisis. Meddling politicians are the albatross around Barclays neck. With Barclays shareprice in the doldrums, a £3 a share bid should be enough for a successful bid, whereas if it were fairly priced it would need £5.50 bid. Any bank that bought it would make about £14 billion instantly, even with the buyout premium factored in.

2. I hold some, but would not trade Barclays because the shareprice is painted into a corner, and has been for a very long time. If I were on the board, I would cancel all dividends and use the billions for a massive share buyback program. I know they’ve been buying a lot of shares back, but when the market has priced them at less than half their real value, they should be bought back en masse.

“I have switched bank accounts several times in the past few years but never even considered Barclays”

But did Barclays consider you?

Sid,

“Barclays among major banks reportedly sitting out latest wave of buyouts”

I used to work for Barclays as a forex trader when they were domiciled in Lombard Street, before they upped sticks to Canary Wharf. Used to chat to the derivative guys in the pubs at lunchtime.

Believe me, their investment bank is rich in expertise. Unlike DB & CS(R.I.P)

The difference in making billions and losing billions is in the personnel.

Bhavik

That’s a hell of a lot of words for someone with absolutely nothing to say.

Qantas

It might be an idea to research the difference between Barclays and Barclays the surname:-))

Opened a trade at 354 yesterday.

Very few U.K. stocks give short term traders opportunity to make relatively quick money.

Darktrace is one of them.

I’d imagine it’s popular amongst short term traders like myself.

Nat Rothchilds

Volex!

In my mind it’s not a good day to buy shares (not because it’s the 13th)

A pivotal point has been reached in the Middle East.

It could blow up over the weekend.

Oil stocks have soared signalling rising oil prices.

The despicable treatment of the Palestinians by the Israelis could well result in OPEC countries depriving oil to the west. That’s my prediction.

Remember the oil shock in the 70s?

Nor do I. But the current crisis looks like the sequel.

Not the time to buy anything now apart from oil

And cyber security - Darktrace.

quantas

if only barclays were priced on a us bank metric

it would be north of three pound now.

but this is the country that voted for brex****.

a country with a huge intelligence deficit v

Sunshine

Add to that losses on…

Barclays 4200 shares - 181p

PHP 1500 shares - 125p

JMAT 300 shares - 1900p

That should make you happy. But for genuine traders losses are a reality.

I’m happy to say my winning trades dwarf my losing ones by a country mile.

Dialogue over sunshine. My time is far too precious to get involved in infantile spats with failed traders who are getting trashed by the market.

Feel yourself privileged to get a reply.

Reducer

“You are sitting on a big loss on Phoenix holdings.”

Hardly a big loss. I bought in at 623 and have received three hefty dividends. 950 shares - about 3.5 percent of my portfolio.

The only difference between Phoenix and Barclays (which I am also down on) is that I don’t regret buying Barclays.

I average about thirty trades a month. I’d imagine that’s about 29 more than you.

Moneyshark

A couple of things to bear in mind when trading.

1. Shares can stay undervalued for a very long time (as we’re seeing with Barclays now) and cheap can always get cheaper. Barclays looked cheap @£2 and now it’s close to 150. Averaging down on a losing position isn’t advisable in a share that’s in a long term depression.

2. Going in overweight. Plowing too much money into a single share can tie your money up if the trade goes against you, however cheap a share appears I’d advise against going in too heavy. Otherwise you won’t have enough capital to buy when you do see a good opportunity. A lot of novices get caught in the ‘all in’ trap from repeatedly averaging down in one share.

2. Diversification, and not going overweight in any one share increases your chances of making money and reduces risk.

Good thing about Barclays is that anyone buying now is buying in at a huge discount to intrinsic value. What Buffett calls margin of safety. We all know the sum of Barclays parts are worth double its current value.

Reducer

A common mistake in novice traders like yourself is the expectation that the shareprice will soar when you buy into a stock.

You bought into Barclays because it looked cheap (which it was) expecting it to rise and reward you with a fast profit.

But it didn’t, it continued to fall (much to your surprise) and now you’re left with a long term hold and a paper loss.

So you are using this board as a purgative to release your anger, because your trade didn’t turn out as expected.

If you’re ever going to succeed at this game you’re going to have to change your attitude and accept when trades go against you.

Maybe read a few trading books. Change the way you trade. Learn market psychology.

I’m not being critical of you personally because your behaviour is vtypical of novice traders, but I’m advising you to learn from your mistakes. It was your decision to buy Barclays not anyone else’s. So it’s your responsibility to live with that decision.

Reducer

Does the shareprice reflect the company’s performance and profits over that period?

No. Record breaking profits have been rewarded by a decline in shareprice.

Is that Barclays fault?

No, the blame lies with an obtuse market that is incapable of valuing shares fairly.

My advice. If you’re panicking over your losses sell up and buy something else.

Or do what I’m doing. Hold for the dividends and wait (it could be a long time) for the market to recover its sanity, in the knowledge Barclays is the most undervalued share on the U.K.

Reducer

Why haven’t they?

Because the banking sector has been politicised to an extraordinary extent since the financial crisis. Bank bashing has become a national sport amongst slimy politicians seeking popular support from the philistines.

I suspect any takeover approach would be blocked by those same politicians. It’s okay to trash the banking sector but they would soil their pants at the thought of losing the billions banks pay the treasury in tax revenues.

Barclays is not a good trade because it’s mired in a regressive market, but that doesn’t mean it’s not a good company.

Barclays is a world beater.

Reducer

That’s a pile of waffle. The investment bank and Lehman’s acquisition has been the making of the bank into a world beater. The investment bank division has been the main driver for earnings revenue over the years. Barclays profits have been astronomical over the last few years but the obtuse U.K. market hasn’t priced those profits in.

Barclays SP trades for chump change because UK markets don’t have a clue how to value equities. That’s why no decent company wants to list here.

Barclays doesn’t belong in the U.K. it belongs in the US where it makes most of its money. If they were to relist there the SP would double overnight.

Good move by the CEO to talk banking results down.

That bit of generic chat will save Barclays millions.

The cheaper the SP the more shares you can buy back with the allocated money.

In my view Barclays should abolish dividends altogether and appropriate all the money to share buybacks, while the bank trades for chump change.

They could buy the entire company on a few years.

It’s beyond me why JPS or GS haven’t made a takeover bid yet. The shareprice would more than double in value if it traded on US bank metrics.

Is it any wonder why any company worth its salt wants to list on the Permabear 100.

I think it’s more a case of when not if. Darktrace will fall prey to an American outfit sooner rather than later. . Post Brexit Britain is incapable of keeping its most prosperous and dynamic tech companies.

Meconopsis

Hey that was a good post. I don’t agree with everything you say but I recognise the quality in your post.

As you know there’re fundamental traders and technical traders. I lean to technical trading because the rewards are much better.

As I stated before. I don’t pretend to know everything that’s going on at phoenix but I do rely on share price action to guide me. And a multi year low is not a good sign.

Managing losing positions is challenging. I offloaded a third of my Phoenix holding at break even and am down on the remainder. I cut exposure if I lose faith but as a last resort I will s**t-can the lot. Hasn’t reached that point with phoenix yet.

950 shares is only a small position so it’s easily manageable and dwarfed by my winning trades.

Plus - business models like phoenix are extremely difficult to value because no one is sure what’s on the balance sheet.

ATB

Toff Appleton.

Toad

“He doesn't deal in facts. Nothing he's said is a fact”

The predicted share price fall was a fact.

The 12 percent dividend is a giant red flag - fact

IIs have been dumping their entire holdings in this dog - fact

There’re clues in the share price - fact

All facts I have posted previously. And far more valuable than the emotional drivel posted by those in denial. Surely they should be able to identify a share that’s in meltdown. The signals are obvious - as exemplified by Phoenix.