Member Info for Poleaxe

Ignoring the "ex-dividend" faux pas I'd go with IG's information. Logically I can't see how you can have different cutoff dates according the broker you use. That would result in chaos on trace & trace proportions!

soul, I see IG say "Ex-Dividend". "Dividend"? Strewth!

Thank you TradingPlaces69. I'm sorry if I was a rather curt with you. I've been banging on about this for several days and when another person comes along saying the same thing about last day to buy etc I'm inclined to think it's deliberate misinformation. I’m sure there is some of that going on.

I think the problem stems from the standard wording on rights issues which talks about the record date and very much makes it sound as if this is crucial date to qualify for the rights entitlement. It's not. The crucial date for entitlement is the ex-entitlement date (in this case from open on 28th). As I understand it, the record date is the point at which the shareholder register is read for the purpose of mailing out the provisional allotment notification letters to certificate holders. For most people, using a nominee broker account, they never get to see a share certificate and this is pretty archaic.

I think the reason why the record date is a few days before the ex-date is to ensure that certificate holders receive their provisional allotment letters in time for commencement of trading of the nil paid rights shares (in this case on 28th). However, this does mean if they've sold the shares prior to 28th they need to forward the letter to the buyer of the shares (normally through their broker) because it's the buyer of the shares who is entitled to the rights. This is stated on the front of the prospectus.

It would be a lot easier to administer if the record date were the day after the ex date (as is normally the case with dividends) because on T+2 settlement it would mean those on the register on the record date would all be entitled to the rights and they’d be no requirement to forward allotment letters. However, for the reasons above, the record date is earlier.

It's possible there are other reasons why the record date is so early. If someone knows, please say.

I'm talking about if it trades near 80p on Monday or Tuesday, not after it trades ex-rights.

It's a liquid FTSE 100. No problem getting shorts on as far as I'm aware.

Brokers preventing you putting on shorts because they think the share price may go down. That's as devious as not accepting longs if they think the share price may go up? If you're any good at it, they hedge your trades to market, like IG with DMA CFDs.

I don't disagree the price was managed by the underwriters and their risk appetite. The point I wanted to make was from the viewpoint of the ordinary investors. I think you agree, for the ordinary PI, the rights price is purely psychological. Utimately investors are just being tapped for more money. With a stronger balance sheet, it may trun out to be a good investment. I don't think most of us can know with much certainty.

If they are remotely near 80p I'll be punting the farm on them (unless the fall is news related). So will other traders and investors. Which is why it won't happen.

Yes, the company could just as well have done 1 for 2 at 213.3333 and it would made no difference to the shareholders taking up their rights. Doing it at 32p makes the rights look so much more attractive. I'm sorry to be so blunt, they get away with it because too many PIs are a little bit dim!

I didn't intend posting any more on this subject but for those who believe this is the last day to buy RR. shares and be entitled to the 10 for 3 rights at 32p...what price do you suppose it will trade at on Monday and Tuesday next week? Surely no-one would be foolish enough to buy the shares for much more than 80p next week if they don't come with the rights entitlement?

Let's see, shall we!

For the last time, for shareholders who hold in certificated form, the record date is used to determine who gets posted the provisional allotment notices. For those who can't be arsed to read page one of the prospectus:-

"If you sell or transfer, or have sold or otherwise transferred, all of your Existing Ordinary Shares (other than ex-rights) held in certificated form before 8:00 a.m. on 28 October 2020 (being the “Ex-Rights Date”), please send this document, together with the Provisional Allotment Letter (if
applicable and when received), as soon as possible to the purchaser or transferee, or to the bank, stockbroker or other agent through whom the sale or transfer will be or was effected for onward delivery to the transferee.."

For nominee account holders you don't get involved with this. This back office procedure is handled by your broker.

I think I'll give up now. I've given done my bit to give you a sporting chance, which is more than the other trader leaches have done. Bon voyage!

Sorry, but she was wrong, or perhaps she misunderstood your question.

If you'd asked her what does it mean by

"Existing Ordinary Shares marked “ex-rights” by the London Stock Exchange 8:00 a.m. on 28 October 2020"

You might have got a different answer.

I don't doubt it Rupertsmum. It only goes to show how many people get confused by record dates.

TBH, the prospectus is the Bible, not someone in the investor relations dept.

Instead of "accoring to the internet" why not just read page 1 of the prospectus/

The record date only really bothers PIs' if they hold RR. in certificated form. Setting the record date a few days before the ex-date means they should receive their provisional allotment letters in time for the trading of the nil paid rights shares on 28th.

However, if they've sold those shares before the ex-date of 28th they are not entitled to the rights and need to forward the provisional allotment letter to the buyer.

If you buy shares on Monday you may well be able to buy cheaper than today, because some people will be undoubtedly thinking they are ex-entitlement. They won't be. Any shares in RR. purchased before 28th will be entitlemed to the rights issue.

It's not really in my self-interest to be telling you all this and I dare say some of my trader mates will be giving me some grief for it. Perhaps ask yourself why the quality of information posted on bulletin boards like this is so appallingly bad!

I been posted explanations of the record date and settlement times several times over the past few days. I really can't be arsed to go through it all again. Suffice to say they're irrelevant to your entitlement date. All that matters is the ex-date.

Some of the people telling you otherwise are probably playing games because they think they can somehow profit from it.

Peteevans: "But you have to have bought by end of today to qualify"

How do you work that out? The shares don't trade ex-rights until 28th. Before then they'll trade cum rights, which means they any shares bought or sold come with the benefit of the rights entitlement. They're either "ex rights" or "cum rights". There's no tertiary state of "possibly rights".

Please don't mention the 'record date' or I'll S C R E A M!

Yes, I think biding you time and buying ex-rights, either RR. or possibly RRN, could work out cheaper than buying RR. now and taking up the rights.

Or just have a bit of patience and wait until mid Nov.

No-one knows for sure.

The rights is not a golden ticket, because 32p is only about 40% of what it costs you to exercise the rights. The other 60% is the cash you forgo by not selling the rights.

Neither is it the last chance. The last chance is the closing auction on 27th Oct.

Quite honestly I wouldn't bother trying to shift rights out of an ISA if you don't have sufficient cash in the account to take them all up. I'd consider tail swalling in the ISA (selling you existing RR. shares in preference to the nil paids if the relative price is better). If you really want to maintain your exposure, simply buy the shares ex-rights in your non ISA account.

All you're really saving by moving the rights over is the stamp duty and dealing cost, but these are drowned out by the daily price volatility.

Given how many PI's don't seem to understand rights issues I seriously wonder if the FCA will eventually step in and ban them for retail investors. There are good grounds to argue that a significant number of PI's don't fully understand the implications of buying and selling their shares around rights issues, or in exercising their rights.

Brokers need to up their game to ensure clients truly understand what they are doing. Otherwise perhaps in future we're going to be plagued with TV adverts along the lines of, "Were you mis-sold a rights issue?"