Member Info for machin

Hello SailPlane,

Circa March/April 2022.

Best, 🐸

Hello Trek,

I do not buy (forgive the pun) the ROI argument in respect of buy- backs.

The idea behind such a manoeuvre is to have a material impact on the SP. Yet, in view of the decline in the SP here and with little effect elsewhere, if none at all, there is hardly any evidence over this.

There is always something else that would depress the SP or trigger a rise; this being the very nature of the Market.

When I started investing here the SP was at 1.04 in old money, £20.08 in new, and here we are some 51% down, despite all the continuing BBs.

Also, in relation to ROI, as the dividend per share has remained the same for the past 5 quarters, BBs had no impact on it either.

Of course, this is entirely my own view.

Best, 🐸

Thanks for this Tier, and for your superb contribution too.

Very best, 🐸

Komakino - "No one can foresee how things will always turn out but coming back to gloat is never a good move."

Yep, not very astute, indeed, but with age...😉

Thank you Komakino and zengas too, and TrustILie and RockyRide, amongst others, for your superb contribution to this BB. You make this long wait bearable.

RockyRide reminds me very much of agadem, who I hope is doing well health-wise 😉

Very best to you all, 🐸

Hello all,

Am I missing something?

Is it not DEC’s policy to keep the dividend as same level and eventually increase it?

A cynic might look at that “dividend” BB as an exercise to prevent lowering it in the future by keeping it at the same level per share but distributed to fewer, after BB, hence a lower distributable dividend pot. Hey presto!

However, in a nutshell, BODs are in place to run companies as competently as possible by (for a better term) juggling between capex, management of debt – lowering/increasing leverage and return to stakeholders, while being very mindful of day-to-day operating costs, current and future liabilities and ROCE.

In my view, return to stakeholders should be the lesser priority for the simple reason that a more successful company would by default afford to take better care of its investors.

If capital is spent in BBs, from the market or “dividend”, while dividends are kept at same level. the available capital would be further depleted of monies that could go towards repayment of debt and/or capex.

I would repeat my mantra, reduce debt as much as possible. This would not impede capex as it could be increased from a lower level when opportunities arise.

You will all decide what to do as you see fit but I, as a non-team player, 😉LOTM, will not participate in the offer.

Absent any force majeure, I will part with my holding at a time and/or price of my choosing, if indeed it is what I want to do.

My final point is this. I let the SP follow its course as I have nil control over it. I just seize the opportunity to accrue holding when depressed, funds permitting, which I did by reaching my intended goal and increasing it by 50%, showing my faith in DEC.

GLA 🐸

Hello LOTM

Special dividends are not a form of capital return, they are just that, a dividend - treated as income for tax purpose.

Capital returns are treated as capital gain, which are taxed separably from income at 20% (28% for real estate) with a current additional exemption of £6,000 (on top of the £12,570 for income) as opposed to potential much higher rates of 40 or 45% for income over £37,700.

I am not a tax advisor but it is how I understand it.

Best, 🐸

Hello TerryM1,

A passing remark, a script dividend would achieve the opposite aim, i.e. reducing number of shares via BB, as it would require the issuing of new shares, none are in treasury – all BB shares are cancelled.

Best, 🐸

Hello jun_man,

You have got a “recommended” from me.

In addition of previously said, I perceive BBs justifications as mere shady manipulations.

If there are monies considered/available towards BBs, firstly, they could be utilised towards debt repayment and/or expansion. Secondly, a return of capital could be implemented – allowing shareholders to increase their holding, if they so wish.

Best, 🐸

Hello damofarl,

My comments are in general terms, with some slipups as pointed out by Pete640 😉

I agree with your last point hence my “Growth is good too”

Leverage has been the bane of numerous companies and led many to their demise.

BBs, in my view, can only be beneficial to whom remuneration/bonus is based on EPS.

Shares consolidation is another obscure concept to me as I seldom see a betterment of SP due solely to it. Of course, as before, it would be of great value towards any EPS consideration(s).

Regarding DEC, I am quite happy with it to the point that I have lately increased my intended holding by 50%.

Best, 🐸

Hi Pete640,

I see your point as DEC has kept the same distribution p/share for the past 5 quarters! Hence a saving in real term as payment(s) goes/went out to less shares.

My bad!

Still I do not like BBs and prefer less debt as much as possible.

Best,🐸

I am with the “without idea” hghotshot.

I am against BBs under any shape or forms for the simple reason that they have no incidence on the SP.

Some companies spend in the billions doing so, to little effect. Only the MARKET decides the fate of the SP depending on black swan event(s), optimism, speculation, sentiment or mood. Stocks are consistently under or overvalued compare to their respective NAVs.

While it is correct that DEC will save money by not paying dividends on the BBs during any specific Q, it will do so only once after the dividend had previously been declared and the monies set aside - In any circumstances such savings would have to be offset by the acquisition costs of BBs in the first place.

The next time around the dividend pot will be simply divided by the actual number of outstanding rights.

Savings could be made by simply lowering the dividend pot and repay the debt ASAP.

In my view, leverage has a greater influence over the SP, and more so when sentiments turn.

Growth is good too!😉

GLA 🐸

Sorry pickedpeck, but your information is not entirely factual

“WHT is 30% outside either ISA or Sipp”

With a W8BEN form in place, the WHT is also 15% OUTSIDE an ISA, i.e, normal share dealing account. I know as a fact as my DEC holding is in such account.

However, not all brokers apply the 15% WHT, depending on their administrative set up(s). xo (Jarvis) applies it but with Lloyds Group (Lloyds, Halifax and iWEB) it is 30%.

Last year I transferred my shares from iWEB to xo and have traded that stock since with the latter. It was free of charge and avoided selling the stock from one account to re-purchase it onto the other, thus eliminating the risk of SP fluctuation(s) and dealing costs.

---------------

In a slight digressing topic, this is a quite friendly BB and it would be nice if it were to remain so.

In another digressing point, I will not subscribe to the offer as I look forward to receiving my 2K+ dividend.

GLA 🐸

Agreed, Davidspellacy,

Last year's June dividend (30th) was declared on 21 March.

GLA 🐸

But "you" know that. Sorry

Hello lordloadsoflolly,

"Lost quite enough on IMM already thanks"

Loss on paper becomes real loss only if one sells, but know that.

On paper, I am seriously under water -73% (now 700K at 6.22 avg.) and this SP downward trend is quite unnerving with no concrete news forthcoming. However, I take a gamble in the sense that I believe that IMM has still some merit, hence my continuing averaging down, ironically aided in my view by the very same lack of news we all eagerly await.

As for the two Tim, McC & F, I feel that for the time being we have little choice but to suffer them for a while longer.

ATB 🐸

Hello CauldStream7,

I am with you, it is so painfully slow but I keep a glimmer of hope, hence my continuing adding to my holding.

I appreciate the concern but I do not invest money that I am not prepared to lose. Since my chunky losses with Carillion and Interserve I am rather relaxed about such eventuality. My big gains with HUR and INDV and to a lesser extent GLEN (still holding the last two) made up for them and would easily cover this one too if it came to that. If not here It is bound to happen again, win some-lose some, eh!

Dallo,

Glad to hear I am not the only crazy one. Good luck with your holding.

lordloadsoflolly,

Care to join Dallo and I? the more the merrier!

GLA 🐸

Just added 230K at 1.6981 😉

Am I crazy?

GLA 🐸

My yesterday 09:55 70K buy at 1.7189p does not even show here.

Generally, I do not know what to make of the expected trial saga.

I am no longer reassured by Avion continued involvement as, in my view, they could simply walk away at any time. They are financially strong enough to just write off their financial input.

Although I am still investing to average down as much as possible, I now consider this as pure gamble.

GLA 🐸

Hello Dallo.

Wanted 500K but would not let me.

Tried 400K, got a quote at 1.82 and same for 300K.

At 200K got 1.7265 and I went for it.

Your 100K trade shows as a sell!

Been in this since end 2017 and I am still seriously under water - 400K at 9.60 average (ISA 200K at 8.04).

Will aim for 1M more in stages at 1.50/1.75, if I am lucky.

ISA is maxed out so will have to wait until next April and see at where SP will be. Last April did not want to go at 2. Instead went all in GEM for div.

Best and good luck for your next 400K, 🐸

It's me, it's me...😉

GLA 🐸