Member Info for KevRow

“ https://www.fool.co.uk/2024/04/08/back-below-70p-can-the-vodafone-share-price-clear-1/”

These articles are just click bait. It’d be great if it gets back to £1 but the article just jumps around all over the place and, on balance, sounds more negative than positive in my opinion. You’d be no worse getting ChatGPT to pull something together.

“ I last purchased at 64p and will happily purchase more, but I await full year results, which also may give a clearer date for the start of the investment in Vodafone shares.”

If you believe it should and will be worth the full book value of 63 billion, why wait and risk missing out? It’d be a shame if you didn’t benefit from your own wisdom.

“It already has 10 Billion + in cash and is selling assets for a further 12 Billion in cash”

Isn’t this 10 billion their current liquidity rather than unallocated cash?

Never mind, your prediction (fact?) that it’ll soon be worth much closer to the book value, means this will all pale into insignificance. The addition of the share price nearly 9 years ago makes your view (statement of fact) particularly compelling.

"Also sold at 255p on 26/05/2015 - maybe that gives food for thought/hope for those investors keeping for the longer term."

Yes, the share price going from 255p to it's current price is certainly reason to be optimistic about long term prospects and a close to 9 year old share price is a fantastic way to determine future share performance.

I'm talking about the market cap, not the book value. If you think they will end up equal, fair enough but I can't see anyone, anywhere who seems to be of the opinion (and that's all these valuations and conjectures are) that this is going to get anywhere near figures like 63 billion.

"The current market cap of 22 Billion is not split £12 Billion for loss making assets and

10 Billion for the assets that create ALL the profits."

If the assets are sold and there is 12 billion in cash (cash, not loss making assets at this point) and the market cap is still 22 billion, how would you break down the cash/remaining assets to reflect the market cap of 22 billion? The only alternative seems to be that you would discount the cash?

"You should have remained silent as per the first 9 years "

"I suggest you give up you are making yourself ever more pathetic "

The fact that you go through post histories, throw around insults etc. in an attempt to play the man rather than the ball only makes yourself look pathetic. It's an anonymous share chat, so none of it really matters, but it's sad that someone would choose to behave like a nasty piece of work rather than say what they have to say and try and remain civil. It's not that difficult is it?

I'm not sure why you are so keen for everything to be repeated multiple times.

If the business has 12 billion in cash and is valued at 22 billion, what value do you believe that the market is placing on the business minus the cash?

Nothing in your largely copy/pasted posts is factual. It’s just what you think or hope will happen.

The world according to you. Nothing more, nothing less.

I’m not digging any hole, there are literally no stakes to an online share chat.

You never seem to explain (because you can’t) how this cash can be spent with no impact to the market cap which is why you no doubt believe there is only upside.

I’ve not put any figure on what the market values the wider business other than cash tends to be valued more of less at the full amount and when it’s gone and spent on cancelled shares, it doesn’t add any value at the point of cancellation. It’s a zero sum conversation of cash to share cancellation at that point in time. The market then decides what happens next.

Words may fail you but the copy/paste function doesn’t seem to. Just repeating the same opinion presented as fact, like a broken record.

I’m saying they would be worth less once they were 4 billion, 12 billion or any amount of cash lighter if it’s only being used to reduce the number of shares in issue. For some reason, you seem to act as if cash is valued at zero and it can be spent with no consequences.

Sadly, the world doesn’t work that way and you haven’t stumbled upon a fool proof method of boosting the share price with no downside.

They would be a business with 12 billion less cash than before, so unless the market values the 12 billion cash at a lower figure, they would be worth 12 billion less (or whatever the market values 12 billion in cash at) when the cash is gone.

“ Profitability will not be be diminished from the sales and yet Dan/KR

you both think that Vodafone would have a market cap of under 10 Billion Euro if all the proceeds were invested in Vodafone shares.

Words fail me”

If they invested in shares and kept them it wouldn’t , if they cancelled them it would. Either option is just moving money around in one form or another.

I’m not even sure the Vodafone Spain/Italy money is pure profit as presumably they carried a level of debt that Vodafone has retained but that doesn’t change the cash into cancelled shares neither creating or destroying value on its own.

If using cash to cancel out shares wasn’t zero sum, everyone would be doing it. It only makes sense when you believe your shares are undervalued and it’s the correction in that valuation that needs to happen. If the correction in valuation doesn’t happen, you’ve basically gained nothing by spending your cash to have less shares in issue.

“ If vod buys back 12 billion euro's of shares & cancel them, the market cap will reduce by 12 billion euro's. The 12 billion euro's comes out of the market cap

That would give the rest of Vodafone a market cap of less than 10 Billion”

If Vodafone had 12 billion cash and a market cap of 22 billion, then the market has already valued the remaining business at 10 billion. The buybacks would then just be turning cash into cancelled shares which is zero sum. It neither creates nor destroys value on its own.

“ ''But the reduction in shares means the price stays the same''

The market values Vodafone (market cap) on a daily basis, which means the share price will change.”

Yes, the market will reduce the market cap/share price to reflect the billions being spent which is mitigated by the cancelled shares. In of itself, zero sum. Simple really.

“You are very confused - you want to top up at the same time as saying that the market cap will reduce to under 18 Billion Euro . Have you come to the conclusion yet that you have been talking nonsense.“

But the reduction in shares means the price stays the same, which doesn’t suit your narrative, so you’ll ignore that part again and round and round we go.

“ Enjoy your weekend everyone, next week it’s 120p”

That would be awful! pLeAsE tHiNk Of ThE bUy BaCkS!

“ I give up - you, B and KR are lost causes - not worth wasting any more of my time on”

No one is falling for your sleight of hand attempts at making shares disappear at zero cost and no amount of copying/pasting the same old rubbish where your options are masquerading as facts or you just ignore anything that doesn’t suit you is going to change that.