Member Info for Hexam

Oops - apologies Tegop, I have a habit of doing that. Yes it’s $100m not $100k and as I mentioned box office was lower in January and February than December so the losses are likely to be even higher (just not quite as high as they may have expected given their comments on admissions).

Tegop - yes those sites are loss making so the revenues they generate are less than the costs they incur including the lease payments.

So BOTH revenue and costs have to be allowed for to arrive at the net savings which will be less than $73m.

Those $100m losses every month include the months when Black Panther and Avatar 2 were released and the losses each month are bigger than a whole year’s saving from theatre closings.

I cannot agree that over $100m loss every month is not a high cause to worry.

Yes Tegop, it’s in the monthly financials, losses are over $100k per month.

That’s profit, cash has been a bit better but that’s because they’ve delayed making payments etc.

If they successfully close all the sites they proposed closing then that saves $73m a year (but they also lose any revenue from thosr sites).

There's a lot of chat about improved performance and how it seems odd that the lenders appear keen to pull the plug now but weren't when things were a lot worse. The recovery though is much too little, too late. They have said January and February are ahead of expectations but that doesn't mean they are making money - far from it, the losses are still mounting up each month (December had much higher box office and that showed a large loss).

I think lenders have finally run out pf patience with the recovery being much weaker and slower than they or CINE had hoped whilst they tried to keep things afloat.

There is nothing in today's RNS that to me is positive and the message seems loud and clear - there is no realistic prospect of a return for shareholders whichever route they take. BUT despite this the shares are still trading and the sp has 'only' fallen to around 3p. So maybe there is a glimmer of hope, perhaps through what happens with the mystery that is RoW or perhaps through some other Machiavellian maneuverings - (after all why was the RNS released at all?)

However, I'm finding it harder to see that glimmer and if nothing else am convinced that we've gone well beyond the point of any short term box office performance influencing the prospects one way or the other.

I sold some this morning as with that RNS I felt 3p was generous and with what's I've kept it's just hope over expectation now. I know others have bailed completely whilst many are still sticking it out, and all have own their reasons - just good luck with whichever you did and/or whatever you do decide.

No thanks dagenham, one t-shirt is more than enough for me. Life’s too short to waste time on people like him - far too many of his kind on these boards sadly. So he can make up what he likes about me, his own trades or whatever else and as for the abuse that’s easy to shake off. I’m sure others can make their own minds up - after all, it is all in the posting history :)

Would rather talk about ARB but all quiet on that front at the moment though not long before Feb update which hopefully they’ll get out a bit quicker now they’ve dropped the financials. And maybe some news on intel, strategy, PPA, leasing arrangement - or anything really…

All I mean Stanley is that assuming CINE do come out of Ch11 it will include a sale of assets or D4E (or both) and that’s the pain for shareholders.

By pain I don’t mean we’ll necessarily end up of worse off than we are now - hopefully it’ll be a lot better. It just won’t just be a case of jiggle about with the debt and leave the company and the shares as they are.

Hi Tegop, clearly if wipeout was a certainty we wouldn't be sitting at an sp of 4p now.

Some of what he says makes sense but ultimately it was never likely a cash bid would come in over $6bn so not too much has changed because of the recent hearing except that D4E has come back to the fore.

If it is a D4E then it doesn't automatically mean total wipeout in fact, as others have said, it is common to smooth the path for shareholders to get a token percentage stake (and that will probably be enough for us to be better off than we are now).

Also it is still unclear exactly how RoW fits into all this given that it sits outside Chapter 11 but is still likely to be impacted in some way. If we did somehow just get left with RoW that would be in a win my view but I don't know how likely, or even possible, this is.

This is a very complex and unusual Chapter 11 as:

1) The underlying business is a profitable one but just isn't at the moment because of the Covid hangover
2) The company has a complex structure with many subsidiaries (and with ROW sitting outside Chapter 11)
3) There are dozens of DIP lenders and many more creditors on top of that all with a stake
4) Then there's Cineplex

So I think it is very complicated situation with twists and turns still to come and anybody who is 'certain' we will come out with nothing is an idiot, as is anybody who is 'certain' we will come out with something. Nobody knows. We can only base what we do on our best guess - and hope.

Larry - Yes we have $189m in the bank now but the increase (from $4m) isn't due to trading performance it's because the debtors put in an additional $1.9bn of which around $650m went to supporting working capital. Most of this $650m has now been spent as the company is still losing money each month despite the recovery and as yet is in no position to even think about starting to pay off any debts.

Box Office was running behind expectations up to the end of last year but they are saying January and February are both ahead of expectations which is good news but it needs to keep improving for CINE to turn profitable. In the meantime though I agree with Bonkers that CINE are in a weak position and the lenders simply will look for the best option for getting as much of their money back as quickly as possible - and we'll soon find out what that means for us.

Nobody knows what the exact outcome will be but it will involve pain for shareholders. In particular anybody thinking CINE will just be allowed to come out of Chapter 11 with a revised loan repayment schedule but with no sale of assets or dilution is going to be very disappointed I'm afraid.

Agree Dagenham - it's not worth it. He keeps saying it's all in his post history but he just hopes that nobody actually reads it. So these days I just leave him to his nonsense but couldn't resist this one given the bragging over his 'success' (yet again).

PS - It's not even a very nice t-shirt :(

"All in my post history. Unlike you cult boys, I announce before I buy"

Yes, like when ARB went below 3p and you were saying you were all in on ARB and had no spare cash to take advantage and even went as far as hoping others wouldn't buy so it that would stay that low until after Christmas as you'd have some more money by then.

It didn't stay low though and hasn't visited 3p since but you claimed more recently that you'd averaged down aggressively including lots below 3p.

Other examples are available.

For someone who 'loves maths' so much I would have thought you'd get your stories to add up better :)

HC - I half agree with you even though a year or two ago most miners were actually making profits. Lots has changed since then though with difficulty rising, BTC falling, costs increasing, HODLs disappearing, interest rates soaring etc. However, if BTC does rise enough then I think many will, at least for a while, make some hay whilst the sun shines. Where I agree with you though is that it is very difficult to see this being sustainable as the headwinds are so strong and competition intensifies so much more when BTC is higher. My focus on fundamentals was as much about picking out the ones that will at least survive rather than necessarily thrive.

Still, there is plenty of trading to be had in the meantime as you suggest!

And here’s ProfitJock doing his Sharebel impression or is it Sharebel doing his ProfitJock impression?

Bonkers you were right, it definitely is one of those days again.

Agree Shazabo, some might be swayed by their games and delusions but as we can see the sp is holding up pretty well which highlights what is probably the most pitiful thing about them i.e. that they are arrogant (or stupid) enough to believe their desperate sounding utterings have any influence on the sp.

@shazabo - just try to ignore and ChaChing and Sharebel, they are both cut from the same cloth (and sadly there are many other examples on these boards). They deal only in extremes, either ramping a stock to the moon by grossly exaggerating the positive or simply making things up - or they go full-on troll by grossly exaggerating the negative or simply making things up. Often on the same share!!

It's funny really if you think about it so just sit back and have a chuckle at their expense, especially when they get spiked as often seems to be the case.

I agree Dagenham - it's all about sentiment (and BTC price) at the moment and very little to do with fundamentals - but that wasn't the question asked. If looking for a long-term investment though then fundamentals are key - though even then short-term sentiment should mean plenty of opportunities to get a decent entry price on whatever company does take your fancy.

Just initial, non-binding bids I think.

I didn't see the presentation but does anybody know if it is still only an asset (rather than share) sell that they are considering?

Wolf - yes, but it was reiterated on Aug 11 so was still what they thought at that time (though obviously irrelevant now).

Sorry - you are being very misleading suggesting those ratings are current predictions. They were both set on August 11th and simply haven’t been updated since as no broker in their right mind would give a price prediction for CINE in their current position - and none have.

“Do these miners not publish P/E ratios? Which other parameters should one take into consideration when assessing businesses in this sector?”

None of the miners are making profits at the moment i.e. earnings are negative - so P/E ratios are not applicable.

The one thing this industry is not short on though is other parameters that can be useful such as hashrate, coins mined per EH, mining costs per BTC mined, total costs per BTC mined, HODL and many others.

Some of these are published regularly, other you have to work out.

Perhaps one of the key things though is the capacity to grow and the best indicators of this are probably the strength of their balance sheet and access to further funds.

“theres two reputable analysts predicting 40 p this year”

Those targets were set before the company went into chapter 11 so are basically irrelevant.