Member Info for hants

"Holy grail" are the words he chose.

Hanock on LBC - The holy grail is the pregnancy style test using saliva which tell's you that you're not infectious that day. It will transform how we can act as a society.

Textbook ascending triangle breakout. There will be a lot of traders in at the moment and they will begin to sell in the high 170s. Don't get too excited.

bbtablet, yes but in Awacta time that's only a few days. Or several hours, if you prefer.

Super exciting that we have a name! AffiDX will be a household name soon with Matt Moonshot using them as part of operation handjob.

Best first post ever.

Tricky, thanks for your reply and explanation of antigen and antibody testing, very helpful....

Anyway - do you have links to any of these studies please?

There are mutated strains of sars-cov-2 (as is normal of course). What will happen if a different one because prevalent? Would you still have immunity?

It can't, but an antibody test may not be able to either. And even if the antibody test does confirm you've had it, immunity is a grey area so what are you planning to do with that information?

"It had been hoped that people who’d had COVID-19 might develop long-term immunity to further infection. However, studies looking at the levels of IgG antibodies, the type of antibodies that contribute to immunity, suggest this may not be the case.

Researchers studied 1,500 people admitted to hospitals in China with confirmed COVID-19 infection. These patients had antibody tests at least 21 days after admission. Almost 1 in 10 had no detectable IgG antibodies to the SARS-CoV-2 virus when tested. Another study of 37 people with a positive SARS-CoV-2 test but no symptoms, found that 40% had no detectable IgG antibodies two months after the infection."

And again:

"In the first longitudinal study of its kind, scientists analysed the immune response of more than 90 patients and healthcare workers at Guy’s and St Thomas’ NHS foundation trust and found levels of antibodies that can destroy the virus peaked about three weeks after the onset of symptoms then swiftly declined.

Blood tests revealed that while 60% of people marshalled a “potent” antibody response at the height of their battle with the virus, only 17% retained the same potency three months later. Antibody levels fell as much as 23-fold over the period. In some cases, they became undetectable."

And one more from the CDC

"Having antibodies to the virus that causes COVID-19 may provide protection from getting infected with the virus again. But even if it does, we do not know how much protection the antibodies may provide or how long this protection may last."

MU345, just to add - regular antigen testing is also capable of providing numbers of infections with sars-cov-2. I don't understand why people believe this can only be done with antibody testing?

Regulator UK, what's your source please as I would be interested to confirm?

"IgA is commonly seen as more immediate, and reflects antibodies along the mucosal membranes. IgA may appear after 3 days (some reports), but more likely after 10 days. Specificity of the IgA antibodies test is 87.5 – 100%"

IgM normally shows before IgG, however with sars-cov-2 the emerging evidence shows this may not be the case.

MU345 - Immunity is still a grey area and can't be relied upon. Although I agree that for stastical purposes it could be of use.

Sorry that was supposed to say
passed*
without quarantine*

What will antibody testing achieve though?

The most infectious stage is from 2 days before symtpoms show through to around 7 days afterwards. Antibody tests won't return positive until after the most infectious stage has already past.

Governments are looking for a test which will find those persons who are *most infectious.* Take note of those words as you're going to be hearing them a lot going forward IMO.

Immunity remains a grey area, but even if it's proven - special treatment can't be given. The problem being that if people with antibodies were given preferential treatment (lets say, going on holiday with quarantine), you would quickly get the adult equivilant of chicken pox parties and it sars-cov-2 would spread like wildfire. It would be a disaster.

RSPT stands for "Rapid Saliva Protein Test" and is what they're calling their antibody test which is due to go on sale soon, as per my earlier thread.

Old news, but you are correct.

"Users can input their test results into the Saturn Pass App, a digital health passport, for work, travel and leisure purposes. The intuitive app validates test results via facial recognition and identity documentation, providing a unique time-limited QR code to confirm a user’s results."

"The app asks users to scan a QR code on the RSPT to begin the process, ensuring only valid tests are used. A binding e-signature on a legal declaration cements integrity.

The app prompts users to record a video taking the test, requiring a photo of the result to validate results. Computer Vision AI is applied to support identity verification. Once the audit is fully verified, a limited life unique QR ‘COVID Pass’ is issued to the user.

This can then be presented to verify the user’s results for work, travel and leisure purposes."

Is anybody still in the running on your £3 list?

Don't get too excited PL75, but there's talk of inflection points... we know how much you like those!

infor25,

I replied to Sir Al thanking him for his response (it was quite lengthy and I was surprised he had taken so much time over it.)

I mentioned that there had been some general confusion over the term 'most infectious' and suggested this could be a good topic to cover whenever he's next being interviewed.

I agree AfamaMan. I think it's likely that we'll see this information corrected now Sir Al is aware. I hope that when the new website goes live it's very clearly marketed as an antibody test.

PART 2:

I sent an email to Avacta last night expressing my concerns at Medusa’s sales literature. To my surprise I received an email back from Sir Al himself just after 8am this morning. I’m not going to copy and paste his email onto a public BB as I don’t believe that’s a fair thing to do. Here’s a summary in MY OWN WORDS but without any of the stated information altered.
____

There are many IgM//Igm tests already on the market and these antibodies don’t appear until at least a week into the infection. In a sense, it’s true that an antibody test can detect current infection but what everybody wants is a test which can identify the infectious people.

The infectious time period is around 2 days before symptoms appear, up to approximately 7 days at which point the viral load begins to fall. Therefore, by the time antibodies are made you’re mostly through the infectious/most infectious time period.

Governments are wanting to move towards widespread weekly testing to find the people who are most infectious (remember these words from the recent RNS, I know some people picked up on it and took it as a negative). This is what Governments are asking for and this is what a lateral flow antigen test can do, unlike centralised testing such as PCR.
___

It was a really great response from Sir Al. He did not pass comment as to whether he thought Medusa’s advertising was misleading, but nor would I expect him to. My hope is that he will contact them and when the website is updated (apparently that will be this week), it won’t include claims that their anti-body test can detect current infection as that’s somewhat misleading.

With all the bad articles on Boohoo lately, if there was an outbreak in a workplace after testing with their products had been completed and returned negative because they were the wrong type of test… can you imagine the newspaper stories! It would not be good.

PART1:

Medusa are now taking pre-orders for their own branded antibody test. It's made by Agile Life Sciences and CE marked for professional use only with FDA approval pending.

I made some enquiries with them about placing an order for my business. I was told the minimum order was 50 units at £40+VAT each, delivery is expected within 4 weeks. I was also sent some photographs (the kit includes the LFA, two buffers, small pot and a pippet) and also a sales brochure.

To my concern, the sales brochure includes the following:
"The RSPT detects an immune response to the virus, indicating whether users have an active or recent infection, helping to guide decisions around the need to self-isolate, or the ability to travel and safely get back to work."

Whilst I didn’t believe it to be true, the claim of detecting active infection was a big worry. After some discussion with PL75 who did some research to confirm, I was confident it’s definitely an antibody test and this incorrect.

I raised a query with Medusa about the difference between the Avacta and Medusa tests and they simply told me that the Avacta test is aimed at consumers who can buy one at a time. Absolutely no other differentiation was given. Again, very worrying.

The new Medusa website is apparently going live later this week complete with online shop. If Medusa start advertising a lateral flow assay which can detect current infection it’s going to cause panic. To less knowledgeable investors, it could appear that we’ve been beaten to market… and by own our distributor!

Of course, we all know that Medusa are prohibited from selling a competing antigen test – but it could appear to some that a loophole had been found, or they were just doing it anyway. The last thing we want as investors is a panic sell off until clarification is given.