Roundtable Discussion; The Future of Mineral Sands. Watch the video here.
Newt.....The only clown around here is the one who insists, in spite of all of the evidence, that this is anything other than a cynical money engine being operated for the benefit of others, rather than in the best interests of the shareholders.
Funny how you get all uppity and aggressive when I post something that you aren't able to counter with you usual ambiguous double speak....again, give evidence of anything that is factually incorrect......
I await your next volley of insults....oh, I forgot, it's a friday afternoon, and you're probably busy having a cosy "tutorial" with some "newt studies" student somewhere......
Still sitting on the fence then newt wrangler......unable to put a valid response to the points posed, so just get all supercilious....show me where I am factually incorrect in the points raised.....you won't be able to and that's what really grieves you, hence your childish need to resort to insults, which are water off a duck's back.....Oh, nice red day again, things going well in AFC deluded land then......
Klunk
Well, that's B3 sorted... your turn.
Putting a Ferrari badge on a Fiat Panda means that you just look like a newt wrangler, because everyone can see that underneath, it's a Fiat Panda. If you have a big grey box, which has a Fiat Panda engine in it, but put a Ferrari badge on it, there is nothing that the average man on the street can use to identify the fact that the gubbins inside aren't Ferrari, but Fiat. This is precisely what AFC has done, which is misleading and immoral.
By definition, if the energy generated by the solar array is subject to two separate inefficiencies, then by definition, it would be more efficient to cut out the middle man, and go straight to battery. If your comment about the size of solar array is correct, then that means that the whole project is very reliant on imported energy, which really casts doubt on the validity of the whole thing. Basically, whatever contribution the chocolate teapot had in energy delivery, derived from the solar array, more energy could have been supplied to the battery array directly, if the teapot was simply by passed.....
B3
You seem to be deliberately missing the point, as per usual. The picture shown on the website clearly shows a box marked "Electrolyser" with AFC written on it. To the average man in the street (one of which you, of course aren't because of your superior intellect) implies that its is actually AFC's electrolyser. You have confirmed your understanding that it isn't AFC's electrolyser, so do you, or do you not agree that to place the words AFC on a box of tricks that isn't theirs is misleading.
How about, just for once, you stop acting as the arch apologist for the company, get off the fence, and answer the following in simple agree / disagree form, and if "disagree" provide a valid alternative fact.
1. Does AFC have an in house developed electrolyser
2. Did AFC show a box marked "electrolyser" in a document produced by them, with AFC clearly shown on the box
3. Is this, or is this not misleading
4. In Extreme E, the AFC unit was not capable of providing the necessry charge density, and therefore the unit was reliant on a significant batter buffer
5. The AFC unit could effectively only trickle charge the battery array.
6. The solar array created electricity. This was then used to create hydrogen using an electroyser (thereby suffering efficiency losses)
7. The H2 was put into a fuel cell, which trickle charged the battery array, thereby generating further efficiency losses.
8. The battery array was used to charge the cars.
9. The energy produced by the solar array which was used to generate the hydrogen could quite easily have been used to trickle charge the battery array without the intermediate steps of electrolysis or conversion back into hydrogen by the fuel cell.
10. There would be more energy available to charge the battery array if the trickle charge was direct from the solar array, as opposed to going through two intermediry steps.
You call me a buffoon if you like. Fine, no problem with that, but I'm the "buffoon" who has maintained for years that the tech doesn't work as promoted, and that sales are a long way off, with the company entering into many MOU's JV's sales agreements which have all come to nought. Where are we now by comparison to 4 years ago.....still in the doldrums and no commercially viable product, but what do I know, I'm only a simple buffoon who saw the light and sold out the majority of my very significant holdings when I twigged what was going on....better be a buffoon than a deluded pretend academic who no doubt teaches something like "newt studies" or the like, all the while thinking that this pile of junk will come good....trust me, it won't.
losses.
Klunk
But it wasn't an AFC eletrolyser though, was it? Please explain your comment about the solar array needing to be the size of a football field, because it just makes no sense.
Solar array > electrolyser > fuel cell > battery means far more inefficiency than solar array > battery,.
By definition, if you are cutting out the middle man, you will get more energy into the battery per hours production by the solar by direct charge than by the convoluted electrolyser / chocolate teapot route, ergo, you should in fact need a SMALLER array, rather than a bigger one.....try applying a bit of logic, old boy!
With all due respect, who are you to tell me what I do, and do not know about this company. I do know that there is no AFC electrolyser, and I do know that the Extreme E system failed to perform as per specification, hence the need for the huge battery buffer and the ultimate removal of AFC from the enterprise.
B3. Actually, just to put the record straight, they used a solar array to generate electricity. It was then put through SOMEONE ELSE'S ELECTOLYSER to produce the hydrogen, which was then put through the AFC fuel cell, which trickle charged the batteries that were needed to provide the required charge, because the fuel cell itself couldn't deliver it on an instantaneous basis.
Which begs the question, why go to all of the trouble of having an electrolyrser and a fuel cell, when you could simply cut out the middle man and trickle charge the battery array from the solar array directly.
I challenge you to put a valid counter argument to this last point....
B3. So sorry I couldn't be bothered to go to the AGM, along with all of the other gullible sheep.....I guess if I had, i'd have seen the poster....Sorry to burst your bubble, but THERE IS NO ELETROLYSER! A picture on a wishful thinking poster isn't a product. Please show me actual evidence of there being an eletrolyser in the armory of AFC's cutting edge products and I'll shut up, but until then, I'll maintain my position that it's just another example of borderline fraudulent spin.
If there were such a product, why have we never heard of it, surely it would have been newsworthy, especially on the basis that the company issues RNS's on the most pathetic non events imaginable....
B3.....Melt! If the company had such a thing an electrolyser, then why has there never been any mention of said product anywhere in the company's product offering page. There has never been any form of acknowledgement on this, or any other board that the company had / has electrolyser capability, and I challenge you to find one....(oh, of course, I've probably trawled through and had them all deleted, as per your usual response when you're proved wrong.....). I put it to you, sir, that if the company did indeed have said piece of equipment, then it would be trumpeting it from on high, as opposed to pretending to be developing a cracker which takes H2 from a carrier source which is far less energy efficient.....Just accept that the company has yet again been more than economical with the truth.
Just had a quick look at the old AFC website to see if there's anything new sculling about, and I happened upon a piece of blurb relating to the now defunct Extreme E thing. Apparently, the H2 used in the Extreme E thing was green H2 produced by an EFC badged electrolyser. It must be true, because its shown in the blurb.....Wow! I simply didn't know that we were working on electrolysers as well as crackers....how did we all miss this?
https://www.afcenergy.com/media/qebl15lm/how-green-hydrogen-is-made.pdf
McHaggis
You are a complete and utter joke who should be banned from posting on any form of social media, as all you do is peddle untruths to vulnerable fools who believe that this lame duck might actually achieve something.
Yet again, you use the word "Pipeline" ref ABB, when in fact all it was in effect was a discount offer given by AFC SHOULD ABB DECIDE TO BUY UNITS possible given under duress as a result of the 100KW unit possibly not delivering as per contractual requirements (along side the share giveaway)
From the RNS
"Speedy will in turn, under a separate agreement, provide marketing, accounting and logistical support to SHS and its own customers."
so no doubt this will be along the same lines as those testing the kettle boilers paying for them by way of payment "in kind" so I'm guessing that no actual money will change hands, and Speedy will charge an equal and opposite amount for the above mentioned services, so that it's a non cost deal for them. Or alternatively they may get a discount by way of share issue, just like ABB did.....watch this space and see how this pans out....it aint gonna end well.....
Mc Stock…..there you go again, issuing absolutely incorrect statements. There is NO pipeline with ABB. AFC gave them a DISCOUNT on the first 10 units sold; there is NO OBLIGATION OR TIE IN on ABB’s part, so there is no way that this can correctly be called a pipeline, it’s probably even not appropriate to call it a qualified enquiry, and we know how successful they turned out to be……absolute joke and you should hang your head in shame for continuing to peddle these falsehoods…do you get some kind of buzz out of setting people up for a financial fall? Because that’s precisely what you do with your dangerous ramping drivel.
B3. Reinventing history to justify the current woeful position. So we’ve gone from having a saleable product that all of the testers would be queueing up for, to simply piquing their interest in the forlorn hope that they might lease some from a joint venture that we don’t know the exact terms of.
The simple fact is that AB pretends that there’s a product when in fact there isn’t, and come judgement day, there’s some diversionary tactic to keep the feeble minded happy in their deluded state. Shame on anyone who persists in supporting this charade ….
Yeah, way to go admin, of course, that will fix everything, make the product commercially viable and people want to buy them on genuine commercial terms….
That’s a bit like getting someone else to sing “la la la” so that you can’t hear the truth…..which is a bit odd when the site is continually deafened by the idiotic ramping white noise of McStock…..
Nice one Haggis......
The only people that are not positive about the latest CEO interview are the trolls, shorters, and crooks.
£2m sales to Speedy, FACT
ON WHAT TERMS? YOU DON'T KNOW, LOOK AT THE NOTES REF THE JV.....ITS ANOTHER CASE OF AFC PUTTING THE UNITS IN AND THE OTHER PARTY CONTRIBUTING "SOMETHING" OF A SIMILAR VALUE.....AND WHAT WAS THE "PAYMENT IN KIND" PAID BY ALL OF THOSE LOVELY CONSTRUCTION INDUSTRY TESTERS THEN?
News on TAMGO, the agreement is in place, so there's nothing else to 'news' about with them other than an order, likely a BIG order IMVHO as it will be for multiple 50kVa and 200kW systems.
I BOUGHT A LOTTERY TICKET THE OTHER DAY...NO NEWS TO REPORT UNTIL I WIN THEN.....AND WIN BIG! SAME LEVEL OF WISHFUL THINKING
"Market interest FANTASTIC"
DON'T YOU MEAN FANTASTICAL
Factory Acceptance Testing of the 30kW for Speedy almost finished, "hopefully we'll be updating the market VERY SHORTLY on that"
SO NOT ACTUALLY A PRODUCT YET, THEN?
First third party contract manufactured stacks, so we already have outsourced the stack manufacturing!! Outsourcing mass assembly next then, in Germany.
SO WHAT ARE ALL THE BODS IN DUNSFOLD DOING THEN?
I did say last week that there would be a load of good news before the results
BUT NON OF THIS IS NEWS, ITS ALL WISHFUL THINKING WITH ABSOILUTELY NO BASIS IN FACT, JUST LIKE ALL OF YOUR OTHER IRRELEVANT ROSE TINTED DRIVEL POSTS.