Member Info for Cousin_IT

You get 350p per share of immediate cash and then you retain a stake in the remaining assets in liquidation.

Thanks Pedro.

I think the sequence is important. The initial suspension is temporary and only results in a delisting if the liquidation vote is passed. And you can't deal in the shares once the liquidation is in place, so you don't need a listing.

Who knows with HL? Service used to be great. And now it isn't...

Hi Pedro, would you mind me asking, did you contact HL about a delisting or a members voluntary liquidation? TIA

Good spot.

The text and timetable are inconsistent.

Unfortunately I couldn't see anything that suggested the initial return of £3.50 was incorrect!

It's not that bad!

This is a delisting. This is to save costs in the final part of the wind down. The end return essentially hinges on how the glass manufacturing loan turns out.

Just one point is that if you hold in an ISA then the shares will be removed (as only listed assets are permitted) . This means any ultimate return will be taxable.

Well the helicopter has completed but no mention of a capital repayment.

'Traditionally' the asset realisation RNS which preceded a repayment had a comment that one would be announced in due course.

They might be waiting for the helicopter refinance to complete in the Cs. That was flagged as Q2 I think

It hinges on the French glass loan, which has had a host of problems.

Also, delisting imminent (I suspect after the next capital repayment) which makes it no longer ISA eligible.

What premium do people feel is in the current price for the strategic review being executed positively?

Realise the share price has strengthened a lot in the past year (how time flies!) but the performance of Wilson Sons and their outlook has improved significantly. Even the investment portfolio should be humming along nicely.

My target price here for a positive outcome was around £19 but it feels like that could be moved higher and the downside for status quo also.

Seems there was a Bloomberg article suggesting interest from PSA in Wilsons. That caused an unusual volume in the shares and a statement that OCN that there were no changes since the earlier announcements re the strategic review..

Seemed to move through £13 without much resistance

I have sold a few.

Just feels like I'm doing that in the face of greater uncertainty than is necessary, which isn't particularly ideal.

Broom - it would be nice to have some guide on wind down.

I have reservations similar to 404x. We don't get much portfolio information these days and the NAV announcements are slow to arrive. I find it odd that buybacks are permitted in these circumstances. Funds in such wind down situations normally return cash to all shareholders rather than going down the buyback route. We then get to choose where to reinvest.

It makes me think that the dice are being rolled to try and trigger the incentive plan if Morphic does deliver. That needs overall returns in excess of around £2.50. Saba clearly were uncomfortable with the terms originally and I'm starting to see why...

Just on listing costs, the other expenses were £380k last year and similar the year before. I'd expect the vast majority of those fall away with liquidation, although liquidator costs would kick in.

Hi Dret,

That's a relatively recent article. It's the first time I've seen a suggestion that it isn't nil.

The stance of HMRC has been unhelpful (ie not giving any meaningful guidance) with the implication being that as the share was suspended at the point of transfer, there wasn't a reference share price (as the transfer happened subsequently) so the value becomes that, nil.

I made sure I only held ALM in my SIPP when it delisted for that reason.

Hi both,

There are a couple of key points.

The listing costs are prohibitive with the company shrinking. That is what is driving a liquidation.

The reason that liquidation is the route is that if you hold the shares in an ISA then a company in liquidation can still be held. If it is delisted then it can't be held in an ISA and will be ejected into a taxable account. Here is the nub - HMRC doesn't recognise the cost from the ISA in this scenario so any proceeds become 100% taxable gains (and with CGT allowances now drastically cut, there's very little tax free) .

Example of a liquidation is HAST (still in my ISA).

Example of delisting RDL (which was ejected from my ISA)

I presume that liquidation in the DNE context would be that the underlying Dunedin/Realza funds would choose when to realise the underlying assets, not the liquidator. The question is also what fee billing a liquidator submits during the process.

Hi PB,

Just using the £7.8m of remaining unlisted assets - that suggests a maximum initial payment of just under 80% of the NAV. So not quite £5.

Hopefully the Board will take a balanced decision. They have decent shareholdings so there should be aligned incentives. They say very little about the portfolio companies so it isn't straightforward to take a 'view' on prospects and what that might mean for an ultimate realisation value. I figure some shareholders will want to let it all play out and not attempt to sell the remaining 'rump' assets at this point.

From what they've said, my interpretation is that they don't expect to realise any of the other investments imminently.

So the liquidation would be that the shares are suspended, the liquidator then returns the available cash in short order and the residual is returned when all the other investments have been realised (say in 3 years from now).

This is why the £9m is key. Receiving £3.50 or so now isn't very appealing. If most of the £9m can be freed up, it could be more like £4.50.

I suspect the liquidation consideration is probably from parsimony - why incur the costs of another tender if you can avoid them?

Key issue for me is the £9m of commitments. Surely these are largely theoretical than probable at this stage but the practice has been to cover these 100% with cash. I'd not be terribly keen on an immediate liquidation with £9m of cash still trapped.