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Started: GetItRight, 27 Nov 2023 12:48
Last post: GetItRight, 27 Nov 2023 12:48
Hi, could someone provide a link to the forum set up after Blueshare please? I'm a member, but accidentally deleted it.
Started: Timelard, 29 Jan 2023 15:21
Last post: StrollerB, 16 Feb 2023 17:46
Case completed. No judgement till after Easter
Started: GetItRight, 29 Dec 2022 17:25
Last post: GetItRight, 29 Dec 2022 17:25
Hi, if anyone is in contact with the administrator of the other WTG forum, could they please let them know it's down? Cheers.
Started: BigEvi, 14 Nov 2022 14:37
Last post: mrcautious, 17 Nov 2022 09:03
Thanks...
Allegedly, during the negotiations to sell a chunk of the company to Slater Gordon one of PWCs executives leaked some information which enabled them to get it cheap. Watchstone are suing PWC for £63M
Scuse my ignorance but refresh my memory what is the PWC case about ?
Thanks for this. That works out at around 9 pence per share. I wonder if they'll distribute that to us shareholders. Not too long to wait until 30th January when the PWC case is to be heard.
Watchstone Group PLC
Settlement with KPMG LLP
RNS Number : 3297G
Watchstone Group PLC
14 November 2022
THIS ANNOUNCEMENT CONTAINS INSIDE INFORMATION FOR THE PURPOSES OF THE MARKET ABUSE REGULATION (EU) NO. 596/2014 ("MAR")
Watchstone Group plc
("Watchstone" or the "Company")
Settlement with KPMG LLP
Further to its announcement on 30 November 2021, Watchstone Group plc (LON:WTG) announces that it has agreed terms for the settlement of its claim against KPMG LLP (Claim number CL-2021-000673) ("KPMG") (the "Settlement").
Under the Settlement, which is made without admission of liability by KPMG, KPMG will pay Watchstone a sum of £4.95m in full and final settlement of the claim.
Started: Timelard, 27 May 2022 20:55
Last post: Magpies1862, 30 May 2022 16:16
Watchstone Group plc
... Group cash at 31 December 2021 of £13.0m (31 December 2020: £16.7m)
So with a cash burn of over £3m a year lets hope the board can get things sorted out,
re: litigation, before the end of 2025 !!!
;-)
GLA
Update on outstanding legacy matters
Our claim against PwC proceeds in the High Court with the trial expected to begin in January 2023. The claim against PwC is for damages or equitable compensation of £63m plus interest and costs. Our claim against our former auditor, KPMG, in respect of its audit of the Group's accounts for the year ended 31 December 2013 has been filed and KPMG's defence recently received. This matter is not expected to go to trial before 2024.
Our appeal for the recovery of historic VAT paid in the ingenie business was heard by the First Tier VAT Tribunal in December 2021 and we were notified in April 2022 of the Tribunal's judgement in favour of HMRC. This was, of course, disappointing but having taken advice, we are now appealing that decision to the Upper Tribunal. Finally, our Canadian subsidiary's claim against Aviva Canada is ongoing and is expected to go to trial in H2 2023.
2022 outlook
We will look to prosecute our remaining litigation assets for the optimal return for shareholders. Central costs will continue to be carefully managed at reduced levels consistent with the needs of the organisation.
Once again, we would like to thank our shareholders for their continuing patience whilst we work to realise optimal value from our remaining assets.
Started: Timelard, 27 May 2022 20:54
Last post: Timelard, 27 May 2022 20:54
I found this while poking around yesterday
Chairman and CEO's Report
During the year the Group has significantly progressed the realisation of its litigation assets including the formal filing of its claim against its former auditors, KPMG LLP ("KPMG"). This is in addition to continued work in respect of the claim filed during 2020 against PricewaterhouseCoopers LLP ("PwC") and older claims against Aviva Canada Inc. ("Aviva Canada") and HMRC.
Now all trading businesses have been disposed our plan remains optimum resolution of legacy matters and then to return cash to shareholders.
The ongoing impact of COVID-19 in the UK during 2021 resulted in the target revenues of the disposed ingenie business falling short of the required target for additional consideration. However, the timing of the sales proved fortuitous, and the Group was spared the financing requirement which would likely have been associated with ownership of this business through this difficult period.
On 30 April 2021, we listed on the Aquis Stock Exchange to continue to provide a trading facility on a regulated market. We subsequently delisted from AIM as required by the AIM Rules.
Notification from the Serious Fraud Office ("SFO") of their decision to cease its remaining investigation means we can confidently now draw a line under this part of the Company's history with no material outstanding litigation against the Group. We move forward in a strong position to realise maximum shareholder value from the four contingent assets we are pursuing.
During 2021, we were the target of a mandatory offer from one of the Company's major shareholders. The offer was not hostile but the board recommended the rejection of the offer and counteroffer, and this was overwhelmingly supported by our shareholders. We would like to thank our shareholders for their support and this endorsement of our approach to obtaining value from our remaining assets. We plan to make further returns to shareholders as, and when, the outcome to our litigation becomes clearer and final resolution more imminent.
Started: TeelaBrown, 19 Jan 2022 07:48
Last post: TheRedDot, 10 May 2022 21:39
Tiger global losses $17bn this year. MF ers
Thanks for the figures, I believe the VAT claim is in the region of £2 million. I am also sitting tight in the hope of a windfall to a greater or lesser degree.
Keep up to date with events @ BlueShare.
Keep the faith.
GLA
I should look at this more frequently. I've failed to notice the filing of the case against KPMG at the end of November.
To summarise:
It is claimed that audit work carried out by KPMG for 2013 was flawed.
KPMG has been fined by the FRC in regards to this.
Watchstone claim that the dividend for 2013 wouldn't have been paid if the audit was done correctly. The dividend amounted to £6.18 million.
Watchstone paid £2.089 million for the flawed audit, £5.032 million for PwC to redo it, £0.433 million for consultancy.
In total the claim against KPMG is £13.73 million, equivalent to, 29.8p per share.
My fag packet valuation of cash and claims is now:
Cash £14.1 million
Escrow £1.8 million
PwC claim £63 million
KPMG claim £13.73 million
VAT claim re ingenie £unknown
Aviva Canada claim £unknown
Total £92.63 million.
If everything goes in our favour then we could be looking at payments of £2.01 per share. If it all goes belly up then there's next to nothing.
My own view is that the two cases relating to PwC and KPMG have considerable merit and I intend to continue holding until these are resolved.
As ever, patience will be required.
Started: seanhunter, 1 Dec 2021 20:47
Last post: Wilfred1, 27 Dec 2021 14:30
This has got to be one to hold for the patient investor, so I`ll wish all investors a happy new year, and lets hope we see some progress next year
Occasionally people post on ADVFN. Just sit tight and wait. Something good may happen. Or not... I'm hoping for the former but who knows.
Is there another live thread for WTG or is all live discussion on here ?
Quindell (QPP) should never have been allowed to survive in any form, much less this zombie for QPP die hards to cling on to as it pulled them into this gruesome financial grave. What a monstrous, bloody AIM tale from the crypt. Someone should write a book about it one day - though preferably not the insufferable Tom Winnifrith.
Started: Manxtaff, 15 Sep 2021 16:42
Last post: Manxtaff, 29 Nov 2021 13:16
No need to apologise dude. Its all good. A friendly Magpie helped me. You have a good time? And.. Yes, I am a surfer. I love it. I could of trawled through several months worth of news etc however thought I would ask a simple, quick, question to get a simple, quick answer. I was not looking for someone to do any research for me. More than capable of doing that myself.. well now I am, as I am in a place with decent broadband speeds!! Your poor dogs... dry toast. I had a great weekend. Warm and sunny this time of year even at 6-45pm! ! Back for Christmas though... hopefully. Hope you have a great rest of the week.
Manx...I have been away so apologies for the delay in replying. I don't understand your vernacular. 'Chill dude'. What are you, a surfer? If I understand you correctly and you're not suggesting I am a rookie on a horse ranch who has got too warm, I couldn't be more relaxed. I am retired at 50 something and comfortable. As annoyed seems too passionate for you I will use less inflammatory language. What frustrates me is you seem to expect someone to explain what's been going on rather than doing your own research (by all means take other peoples advice). FYI I don't use butter or spread but if I do drop the toast the Labrador will get it before it hits the floor and if she misses the Spaniel will not. Have a nice weekend.
Manx..... now a delisted cash-shell but with several litigation claim assets !!
(You can find Wtg on the Aquis exchange)
You could recoup your RENE losses here but it might take another couple of years to sort it all out.
If you need a shorter timescale then you need to look elsewhere!
By the way, most Wtg LTH are a pretty chilled bunch, we have to be, after what we have been through ;-)
Good Luck.
Chill dude. If you are getting annoyed over that I would hate to see you when your toast drops buttered side down. Thanks for replying though. I appreciate it.
You drop ins annoy me. Read back over the RNSs since you last looked in and you'll know what we know.
Started: Wilfred1, 14 Sep 2021 22:34
Last post: Wilfred1, 14 Sep 2021 22:34
Hopefully something more sensible will materialise..
Started: Wilfred1, 2 Sep 2021 13:12
Last post: Wilfred1, 12 Sep 2021 22:24
I read somewhere in the Telegraph that this was what is fueling the takeover stocks.. ie, the sharks are out looking for bargains.. Isn`t this what has DRIVEN SAINSBURY`S.
However, we`ll need to keep tabs on the latest tax options the tories are planning. That could put a damper on economic growth. but I have to agree that such social benefits cannot come free They do need to be careful regarding the pension crowd.. they are living on a knife edge and look to be easy targets
Yes, please enlighten us.
Wilfred.... what chatter about 'cash shells' are you referring to ??
Anything in particular?
Wtg is worth so much more than just cash in the bank !!
GLA
I see the BOD have poured `cold water` on the latest offer from Polygon.. and with much chatter in the market just now regarding the value of these `so called` cash shells it might be interesting to see what else comes out of the woodwork. Time for investors to keep the powder dry on this one I think.
Polygon`s latest offer...a very look warm pittance. I`m presuming the board will be holding firm on this?
So i ill be interesting to see what comes of the court case.. should it ever get that far.
I1`d expect a settlement out of court, which might lead to a return to shareholders of say circa £1 a share. thats just my guess.. anyone got other views on the progression of this matter
Started: TeelaBrown, 24 Aug 2021 08:52
Last post: Wilfred1, 24 Aug 2021 12:29
Absolutely. this bunch of asset strippers are having a laugh. Our board have been very clear in there efforts so far to maximise returns from this business. And yes. patience is required, but so far ther track record looks very good I`d say. And I understand that Polygon actually were running a short position against WTG.. and yet here they are trying to buy up the remaining stakes... no deal is my responce to that `offer`..
Well said, nor me. Their offer has gone down like a lead balloon, now they are sounding a bit peeved.
Polygon have extended their 34p offer until 31st August.
The RNS they have published strikes me as odd.
They point out that the realisation of contingent assets (the various litigation proceedings) may take some time to resolve; may not pay out as much as anticipated; may not go in the company's favour.
They also point out the continuing cash expenditure as the claims are pursued.
And, the odd bit: Polygon would be unlikely to accept an offer for their shares should such an offer be made.
In effect Polygon are saying Watchstone shares value is decaying but they're happy to hold on. In fact, despite what they see as uncertain assets, they want to increase their stake in the company from the current 30%.
It's evident that they see further value in the Group. So do I. I'll not be selling my shares at 34p.
Started: Wilfred1, 2 Aug 2021 19:12
Last post: Wilfred1, 14 Aug 2021 14:07
Please ignore the link mentioned below.. anyone heard back from the Polygon crew yet ?
https://www.lse.co.uk/ShareChat=WTG.PL&share.asp?ShareTicker=Watchstone-Group-Plc&thread=2FF0CE30-10AA-42B7-A20B-26161CA8D524
My view is that we should hold for a better offer...
Just as a further point here.. you will know that the first closing date was 6th Aug.. have they decided to extend the dead line? Hopefully they have taken the hint from investors and decided either to significantly up the offer, or to withdraw and let the courts decide, or go for a signifantly improved offer to settle out of court...
Have you had as call from some group representing Polygon, asking qns like .... Are you a shareholder for Watchstone grp.?
and `have you had the paperork for the offer? then the crunch qn..
how are you intending to vote??
I`m wondeing if this was some kind of hoax..
Or is it getting to close to call??
Hopefully they will be booted out with there offer...
Started: Timelard, 27 Jul 2021 12:18
Last post: Wilfred1, 27 Jul 2021 15:23
And thanks to the CEO, Mr Stefan Borson , for clarifying the company`s position regarding the offer , which they feel significantly undervalues the business. I`d like to wish Mr Borson and his team all the best in there pursuit of fair value from this episode
Started: Timelard, 22 Jul 2021 18:53
Last post: Timelard, 23 Jul 2021 15:20
You are right, of course it does. I just hope the other PIs don't bow to the pressure to sell.
Lardy.....""Polygon seem to be a bunch of chancers.""
Not really.. just business men...out to make a profit...
If you could buy something for 34p that's actually worth over a £1 makes sense, right??
So to take an optimistic view.....
Polygon obviously bought those 500 shares to deliberately trigger a MANDATORY offer by crossing the 30% mark, right? Timed so they could get away with offering a paltry 34p !
So they know that their offer will be voted down !!
That will then leave them free to go on a buying 'spree' afterwards, hoovering up as many cheap Wtg shares as they can get their hands on, without having to offer another takeover bid ??
They will benefit from all the extra value that WTG's litigation/claims assets will provide.
Hopefully, as claims progress, that will push up the sp a fair bit for the rest of us as well!!
Anyone who has been in Watchstone for a while knows that their WTG shares are worth much more than just the company's cash balance!!
GLA
Well said that man... I suspect that most investors will be well satisfied with the retuns so far obtained, and would be willing to wait a bit longer to see the final outcome of this debacle.
Certainly, a figure that returns to the shareholders a figue that clears the £1.00p would be appreciated
Polygon seem to be a bunch of chancers. Trying to buy all the shares for 34p each is good business but if successful the PWC case could net 110p per share and the Aviva Canada thing could be worth a few pence as well but if we sell we see none of the proceeds and they get it all. They can buy my shares when all this litigation is over. I won't be agreeing to the offer at this time.
Started: Magpies1862, 23 Jul 2021 14:53
Last post: Magpies1862, 23 Jul 2021 14:53
Watchstone Group plc – Cash Offer
It has come to our attention that our previous correspondence contained another error. This Cash Offer has not been unanimously recommended to Shareholders by the Independent Directors of Watchstone Group plc. The Board have stated that they will be obtaining independent advice in respect of the Offer and will make this known to shareholders in due course. We will write to you again once the Board have made a comment. We apologise again for any inconvenience caused by our error as it does not reflect the usual high standards of service that we aim to provide. If you have already submitted an instruction and wish to amend this, please contact us to do so. Please find a corrected version of the message below.
Started: GrumpyScouser, 21 Jul 2021 00:26
Last post: GrumpyScouser, 22 Jul 2021 16:54
All well here. I've had the same from HL and ots also in the Offer document.
HOWEVER Watchstone Group has yet to issue and RNS.
Stefan Borson is a STICKLER for rules and protocol.
Michael Howard is QC.
Let's just see what happens, eh?
Hi scouser, trust you are well ?
Answering messages over on the other wtg board at the moment
https://www.lse.co.uk/ShareTrades.asp?shareprice=WTG.PL&share=Watchstone-Group-Plc
where someone is implying the company has stated acceptance (not that i know of btw) via their HL account.
I WONT be accepting the offer for sure and can't believe the nonsense that's being stated here and there regarding this.
Atb and to all invested here. Ktc
I've posted my opinion on the blueshare board for LTHs.
New faces with FUD just won't work here.
34p just means they don't really want the company.
Sleep tight....
Started: Tipsterchep, 20 Jul 2021 20:47
Last post: Tipsterchep, 20 Jul 2021 20:47
And the demise is complete, writing was on the wall ages ago. Many undervalued firms are going to be snapped up for a song , post Covid.
Started: Wilfred1, 20 Jul 2021 15:16
Last post: GetItRight, 20 Jul 2021 17:20
Er, you seem to be overlooking the small matter of the 34p Polygon offer.
Everything else is moot until this has been decided one way or another.
So, how much is this cash cow worth?
I`d say it must be worth a fair bit more than is being offered sofar...
The word is that there are groups out there just looking for good value cash cows/shells to reverse into!!So, having wairted this long, I am willing to wait just a bit longer to see fair value for this asset..
Somewhere in the 80 - 120p per share ramge would do ok..
Anyone got any other ideas on this..?
PWC will not want to fight a battle with these boys.. and I suspect our big chiefs probably would like a quicker exit strategy than the courts have available. So , an out of court settlement would seem the best solution, unless our chief can see a nailed on result from the courts to, give something better... with a no blame clause added of coarse to avoid any egg on red faces.
Started: GetItRight, 20 Jul 2021 12:50
Last post: Magpies1862, 20 Jul 2021 14:16
Yeah, agree, .... Silence is not always Golden !!!!!
I am getting a horrible feeling that the BOD's lack of communication on the Polygon offer is a bad sign and that they are going to settle. If they were going to advise against acceptance, surely they would have done so by now?
Started: seanhunter, 20 Jul 2021 12:13
Last post: Magpies1862, 20 Jul 2021 14:10
Does this ring a bell?? ....... DYOR
Wow, there's far too much to update you on. I;ll leave it to someone with more time and patience than me.
Can someone kindly fill me in as to what happened with this "company"?
My take is this: out of the ruins that was QPP (Quindell - of which I was one of the main suckers on here) came a "company"... what was it's purpose? What did it make? What happened to the money left over from QPP?
Started: Pandy2, 6 Jul 2021 14:52
Last post: MissGolightly, 7 Jul 2021 21:02
Yes. You should also not be charged by your existing platform …because it’s their problem that they are not providing you with the ability to transact on Aquis.
So if I ring Hargreaves with my letter in hand they should know what to do? Thanks.
Hi - Just call HL - they have to initiate the transfer from your current platform. Be prepared though - it took nearly 8 weeks for flippin Halifax to do my transfer .
FYI .... WTG has already been delisted from AIM and is now trading on Aquis .... just check the RNSs . you can trade on this platform via HL though - once of course that you've got the shares on there.
Miss G
:-)
I'd appreciate it if anyone here could help. I have these shares in an hsbc account but apparently we're delisting or something. I haven't been paying enough attention clearly. Can I somehow transfer them over to Hargreaves? Thanks
Started: Magpies1862, 6 Jul 2021 19:06
Last post: Magpies1862, 6 Jul 2021 19:06
So who's got the other 4.8% of UBS's shareholding then ????
Started: GetItRight, 2 Jul 2021 16:26
Last post: GrumpyScouser, 2 Jul 2021 17:12
At the moment there is nothing to vote 9n.
Until the BoD take independent advice (see rns) nothing to do.
ONLY if the offer is considered to be reasonable, will shareholders be invited to vote.
If you've been here a while, then you know what the real potential is here.
ATB
Folks, I have had it confirmed by HL that we will be able to vote through the platform on the (in my opinion, derisory) 34p offer from Polygon, those of you on other platforms may want to check you are able to vote too.
Started: stockman00, 1 Jul 2021 23:30
Last post: GrumpyScouser, 2 Jul 2021 09:57
Large off market trades: maybe their "concert party" investors transferring shares to PG at the offer price?
How on earth a trade that size wont start the SP moving next week i dont know. I expect the see other players start showing their hands now and Maybe of Polygon do try a hostile takeover they may think they can reach an out of court setllement and bag some cash quicker without any court costs ???