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Started: idakaneis, 7 May 2024 16:46
Last post: JPP8788, 11 May 2024 22:28
Nothing in there we didn't already know. This 64 page document was already noted ok this forum a few weeks ago. Too many debts and not enough money from the proceeds of sale, shareholders will see zilch.
Now available on below link...
Will be available in ten days' time on the gov.uk website here: https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/06744840/filing-history
Started: Sharebel, 29 Apr 2024 12:15
Last post: Bongobondhu, 1 May 2024 20:37
Go back to school or get treatment from mental hospital
Mate, you shouldn't be let anywhere near a computer, never mind the stock market.
Your previous posts say that you invested just under £4k here - how's that going for you?
Your investment is gone, kaput, written off.
Jpp8788
You need to go back to school
Oh my god there's some total idiots on these forums
£4,748k is £4.7m - what part of that is unclear!?
Jp,
these two figures does not make even a million pound.
this is below 1m
Started: JPP8788, 29 Apr 2024 23:17
Last post: NicName, 1 May 2024 12:53
Ahh, rather par for the course, can't see wood for trees - paying attention to the analogy but missing the point. ;-)
People threw money at this as a thematic proposition without considering why. Background research, nah...
As the red flags waved they waved back.
What sort of nasty kitchen spillages might that be? Tony Gott’s receipts? What happens at work, stays at work. That’s the motto right?
Not "nothing happening" but a clean up operation, as one might with a nasty spillage in the kitchen where the evidence has to be removed before the other half gets home.
So we have roughly £2.4m from the sale and £1.1m in the bank. For a kick off, we have £7m worth of non-secured, non-preferential debtor's who will get a look in before we do.
See ya.
Started: Blockchains, 25 Apr 2024 18:19
Last post: Nanogeddon, 29 Apr 2024 11:40
So Padmini VNA entered into a 50:50 joint venture with Saietta with one of Boris’s oven ready deals, and Parmini had no interest in buying the other half??
So a company listed on Tokyo exchange has brought the intellectual and other stuff off SED.
Anyone know if we can buy into that share to try and cut our losses?
But you're right in that it doesn't sound like a fire sale so I'm slightly more optimistic now that this could end well for shareholders. But as I've learnt recently, asset sales on administration are often v.heavily discounted due to the lack of seller warranties so even though imho the assets should be worth way more than the company's net debts I'm still assuming the worst.
JPP, it seems that all the assets have been bought so the only thing Saietta Group Plc has is cash. In which case if it does have a surplus after paying off creditors it won't have any form of business so is v.likely to be wound up with the surplus distributed to shareholders.
Started: Blockchains, 3 Apr 2024 19:34
Last post: Blockchains, 25 Apr 2024 13:01
I’d say the encouraging part is the fact that there was competition. Padmini trying to pick them up for peanuts backfired
But I should add I'm still expecting nothing on the basis that administrations very very rarely end in shareholder returns. I think I didn't grasp that point originally, and although I can still in theory see a way how this does result in a return I'll only believe it when I see it.
Ha this is all getting interesting.
Blockchains, if you're right that the buyer's financial muscle "blew the others out of the water" then that sounds like there's a decent chance shareholders will get a return. On my analysis the total debts of the company upon a winding up wouldn't be more than £7-10m so if there's an 8 figure payment there should be some kind of return.
Shareholders may be entitled to receive payments.
I've received a letter from my broker today that the shares cannot be held in Crest account because company delisted.
so they are going to issue me share certificates.
usually they despair when delisted,
it's happened to my (iog) shares in September last year.
but this time why they're issuing share certificates is that mean it's not over yet.
If anyone has account with Jarvis must have received a letter like myself.
I don’t know. Sorry
Started: idakaneis, 5 Apr 2024 12:41
Last post: NicName, 9 Apr 2024 03:37
Yes
Does this mean the shares are worthless or just untradable in the context of a takeover scenario?
Started: Sandyman, 3 Apr 2024 18:23
Last post: Sandyman, 3 Apr 2024 18:23
Expect to see a share placing at some point.
Started: Maxi19, 1 Apr 2024 21:10
Last post: Bloomy, 3 Apr 2024 17:55
You really are a sad F uck . Absolute tool green box for you
Yes guys I'm very confident this will resume trading very soon. Can see this recovering quickly and agree with maxi19 about debts being paid.
No news yet. Perhaps Blockchains was a phoney.
Anyway, the longer this goes without news the more encouraged I am as if suggests the administrators are confident of being able to repay creditors in full.
Because I reckon Blockchains is close to the administration and couldn't resist getting a buzz from hinting at a development requiring an RNS. Also, it would seem appropriate for an asset sale to be completed in four weeks/by the end of Q1.
I guess we'll have to see. My heart is telling me shareholders won't get anything. My head disagrees.
Blockchains sets up an account yesterday to make one post on this board hinting that an RNS is coming. Strongly suggests he/she has some special knowledge.
Wouldn't surprise me if the administrators had put a timetable on a sale of most of the assets for end of Q1. Guess we'll find out on Tuesday.
Why? Have you heard anything about the administrators completing a sale?
RNS in 5,4,3,2,?
Wow what a life you must lead , you sad f uck .
You have nothing to talk about so you leave. I will check to see if anyone else posting, as nothing to discuss.
Nobody’s keeping you here , goodbye
I'm not entertaining any more discussions about this stock, because it is in administration, therefore dead.
Leave this BB Asap
Started: NicName, 25 Mar 2024 10:45
Last post: Bongobondhu, 27 Mar 2024 16:11
If it's going to be a 200 bagger.
Well I am going to be a millionaire
Lol it would be close to a 200 bagger from it lowest point.
The problem with IP though is that it's so difficult to know it's value. The Axial Flux IP could sell for £50m but it could also sell for £500k.
Interesting article if sed asset get sell similar amounts than sed share holders will not walk away with empty bags surely.
Https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/09475811/filing-history
Interesting to see that in Arrival's administration the internally developed IP has a book value of £15m but is expected to sell for £50m.
Lol, I'm definitely at the denial stage.
More importantly NicName, how much do you think the assets will see for?
Started: Maxi19, 22 Mar 2024 17:00
Last post: Maxi19, 24 Mar 2024 21:48
Probably the suspension of trading.
Haven't seen anything else.
Of course they could know something we don't. It's almost certainly "game over" in terms of the share being listed, only question is whether they can sell the assets for more than the debts. Statistically they're unlikely too but I remain hopeful.
Guys I have received a letter from my broker saying that the company recently announced a corporate action,
Is this any good or is it the end game
Oh thanks for letting me post elsewhere !!! Some proper sad sacks on these boards . Telling people a share is dead and don’t post on this boards whilst posting on this board pmsl 🤣
Are you bricking yourself that if you're slightly wrong with this you've missed a multibagger?
Bloomy company dead, so vacate this BB I don't mind you posting on other boards, but you playing into hands of losers like max19
Seek.help brother.
You talk **** best thing is you refrain from posting on this BB and perhaps, any BB
Started: Oldfortyniner, 14 Mar 2024 11:42
Last post: Bloomy, 20 Mar 2024 12:47
Why will I post you a link ? If you let me know where to send my invoice I get straight on it
Bloomy, I said there is no obligation to sell to the highest bidder, I never said that they wouldn't. Based on your strong statement I will happily read the link that you will post that will correct me now.....
TRQS, there's a grain of truth in that. The administrators have to maximize returns for the creditors. So, say the debts were £5m (including administrator fees) and someone offered £5m for the lot and someone else offered £5.5m for 90%, with the 10% remaining being near worthless, then the administrators could probably accept the lower offer.
But if you're talking about material differences in value, say £5m and £10m, then I don't think your point applies.
Dont talk rubbish , their obligation is to get as much money for whatever assets are left end off .
There is no obligation to accept the highest bid, obviously in your simple case I'm sure they would go highest, but it is always more complicated than that, i.e. x company wants the IPR (may to take to India) but not the assets and liabilities (costs) of Silverstone or Sunderland, vs Y company that will just take everything at a significantly lower price - who would you decide upon? Usually, for a UK company, they'd much prefer company Y as their fees just won't cover managing of disposal of a load of stuff that is no doubts stuck in those buildings.....
Started: Sandyman, 20 Mar 2024 11:33
Last post: Sandyman, 20 Mar 2024 11:33
So all off this BB now!!!
No more posts ok!!!
Started: SANTIAGO666, 18 Mar 2024 12:06
Last post: Maxi19, 18 Mar 2024 12:19
Santiago, they said discussions with interested parties would continue following the administration. The lack of news will be a result of confidential negotiations with those parties. My guess is that there's a 50:50 chance we get some news before the end of the month. Failing that I would be surprised if the majority of the assets weren't sold during April. EY will have a timetable in mind and won't want to delay it unless necessary.
Keep an eye on it
No news since 4 of March since was temporary suspended
Flying high lol with that scenario that’s a corker of a fib. As shareholders any surplus will be distributed amongst the remaining shareholders! End of. And Maxi is correct they could come out of administration it’s not game over. Wait, watch and see. IMHO DYOR
Are you being serious? You think the shareholders aren't entitled to the surplus? Who is entitled to it then? You realise companies can enter and then leave administration?
The administrators have no obligation to shareholders even after debts have been settled. It's not a takeover process.
The shares are assumed worthless.
Even if there is £1bn left over shareholders have zero entitlement to such money.
It's basically handing over ownership of the company from shareholders to the administrators to solve the credit issues.
Basically FlyingHigher, you're assuming there's only one potential buyer. If there is, then as you say they will want to pay as little as possible.
But if there are two or more buyers, they will pay as much as they're willing to pay.
Also, we don't know what the terms of the JV agreements are. It's common in JV agreements for the minority partner to have a put option, in other words forcing the majority partner to buy its shares at fair market value. If the minority partner is insolvent this may be at a discount, typically 15-25%.
If such a mechanism exist in Saietta VNA then Saietta Plc will be entitled to fair market value or thereabouts for its 49% stake. What is the fair market value of that stake? If the forecasts are reliable and Saietta VNA will have £40m EBITDA in a few years then it's not going to be cheap.
We simply don't know.
FlyingHigher, the administrators have to find the highest bidder for the assets. They normally do this through an auction process.
If the highest bid is £10m and the outstanding debts are £5m the shareholders get a return. It's really not that complicated.
Started: Nanogeddon, 8 Mar 2024 16:26
Last post: Bloomy, 8 Mar 2024 20:04
Get over it and move on pmsl , coming from some bell end that thinks he’s the saviour or aim . Sad tw at
I sold a few weeks ago. But that does not change the fact that I lost money because of the liar Tony Gott. I will be voicing that. Why are you here?
Neil, in the event you're wrong, I'd just like to thank you in advance for your great efforts to help collapse the share price and allow the multi-bag buying opportunity. And try not to cry by the way.
Https://www.lse.co.uk/rns/appointment-of-administrator-5jed162cmed0clc.html
Its over and share will disappear in 4 weeks
Get over it and move on
You were all warned many many times last week
Thanks Tony Gott. An expensive lesson indeed, but you have taught me a valuable lesson that nothing, NOTHING a company director tells us about it's position or prospects can be trusted at all.
You are a liar, just as so many others have been.
The only thing that can be trusted is profit, and I would have my doubts about that now.
Started: Maxi19, 5 Mar 2024 10:11
Last post: Maxi19, 8 Mar 2024 09:21
The shares are suspended so there's no incentive for me to ramp. My judgment is often faulty and it's true that 95% of administrations don't provide a shareholder return so the odds are stacked against it here.
But I still struggle to see how the debts of the company are clearly higher than the value of its assets. If anyone can explain how patents projected to earn up to £20m in royalties over the next few years and a 49% stake in a company with EBITDA projections of £40m in a few years are worth next to nothing then I'm all ears.
Maxi, if you can't see what's wrong with your hypothetical scenario you haven't much hope of grasping the SED situation, but to provide you with a very simplistic analogy reflective of your own, just suppose the 'diamond' is paste.
Sorry to disappoint, but the shareholders will not receive a penny now. Better to start coming to terms with that.
RGhost, that example wasn't me saying Saietta has assets worth £100m, it was just an example.
Have you looked at the latest balance sheet for end of September? It doesn't show a mountain of debt. The company has no loans and no secured debt. It will need to pay outstanding creditors, accrued salaries and the costs of the administrator. After using its current cash and receivables and flogging off the plant and machinery and inventory I don't see how the net amount owed to creditors will be over £5-7m. They could well be significantly less.
So the question is, can the AFT IP, the Propel marine IP and the Saietta VNA 49% stake be sold for more than that amount? If they can't shareholders will lost everything. If they can shareholders will be in the money.
I personally don't know enough about the tech to know how much it can be sold for but I wouldn't bet that someone will pick it up for peanuts.
So that me
Max you have lost your 100 quid lol
Give up and stop dreaming
God Neil’s a Di ck isn’t he
Started: 2reincarnated, 5 Mar 2024 15:44
Last post: neil777, 6 Mar 2024 11:44
Max I think what happened is you and the others plumbs didn't listen to Neil and keep buying and you lost everything.. end of
Started: EarlofAim, 4 Mar 2024 13:46
Last post: NicName, 6 Mar 2024 04:08
"It's not a scam, it's an investment strategy. If you can buy low liquidity shares, convince enough other people to buy after you, surge the share price and exit, you'll make money."
General question: If this strategy is carried out in the knowledge that "enough other people" may be unable to exit their positions and could be left 'carrying the bag'..., how might you define it then?
The lesson: Ignore any coverage from VOX Markets. Don't invest in AIM shares.
I did say it would go under and did my best to tell all to get out, Neil777 got a load of abuse when really he was trying to help anyone holding in here, I remember him saying he wouldn’t buy a single share no matter how cheap it was. Take note of the one’s who like talking but not listening, I’ve seen this many time’s over the year’s, don’t think you’ll get anything back as shareholders never do. It’s gone and the last you’ll see or hear of it.
Good luck in your next investments.
I see david woolley sharing posts of saietta employees looking for new employment on linkedin today. i suppose these people are looking for a new job for a good while
"investment strategy"
lol that's a good one :-))
Been in several and been a creditor to several , best I’ve ever been offed was 1 penny in the pound . Just see it as gone . We took a chance and lost .
Started: Maxi19, 4 Mar 2024 12:06
Last post: TRQS, 4 Mar 2024 15:15
RGhost is absolutely right - just Google the rights of shareholders. Naturally you could take this a set further and suggest that it was managed in to administration on purpose, it is not hard to imagine the reasons why......but of course I'm not say it was!!
" It's amazing how everyone has simply assumed that shareholders have lost everything here. "
Perhaps you shouldn't assume it's an assumption Maxi. It might save you some typing, if nothing else.
Is it serious that you guys expect to get any money out of this?
Did you actually read the numbers from the last year and can you really understand them?
Is no one wondering what exactly happened to Propel? Propel was the only branch through which there has been another big funding, first there were big turnovers by Propel and now it is deadly quiet around Propel. When NL and Sunderland are sold there is no nig assets left at all, the assets of NL and Sunderland were the largest. The debts to government, personnel and creditors are too big, also the there are the administration costs on top of that. If there really are actually 95 people still employed as Linkedlin makes believe, then it is quite a lot of salary costs for the next month. You as a shareholder are on the back foot.
If you look at VNA and ConMet, these are just promised turnovers. Look well there so far nothing at all in terms of revenue created. 2 years ago Propel would sell thousands of units in 2023/2024, where is the income of that? Please dont believe the RNS anymore. And if someone would want to buy Saietta, it would only be the good parts of it, not the junk and debt. Then the shareholders will get nothing at all.
Look at the cash-out in recent years, all the money went through very quickly and wonder if the management enjoyed it well.
I agree Maxi although I think this move albeit not ideal has bought them time and space to actually reorganise themselves and within administration there’s still the ability to raise cash and accept offers. I’ve had a similar situation then an offer from out of the blue came in and off they went it went ballistic! It’s a good business and not masses of debt so all to play for. We could even see some sort of RTO here. IMHO DYOR
Theoretically correct, but extremely unlikely
Started: Lordmakealot, 4 Mar 2024 13:10
Last post: Lordmakealot, 4 Mar 2024 13:10
As i had a premonition this could happen,some you win some you lose,i did lose on safestyle thou,