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Sorry moaningman but your time has run out. You will have pay for another argument, (as is in the famous monty python sketch).
https://www.lse.co.uk/ShareChart.asp?sharechart=VOD&share=Vodafone
CFO Ms Margherita holding almost 7M shares also.
Directors do have a considerable interest and incentive in the SP turning around here.
I'm very calm...
moniman What is your problem. I am simply pointing out that you don't know the difference between enterprise value & market cap. They are totally different. I haven't disagreed with anything else that you have said & am certainly not burying my head in the sand. Calm down mate.
Well Dan that was a great explanation, but the markets aren't buying it, that why the SP chart shows a 5 year terminal decline from circa 230p in 2017 to 95p today..The dividend has been almost halved during that period hence the decline...I really don't see any way back for the SP or the Dividend, unless you have a cunning plan..if so maybe you should enlighten the BOD? Aimho Adyor! €45 billion debt pile is huge whatever way you decide to calculate the value of this company...GLA.
velladean. Thank's for your post. I will try to explain, but as I have done this before, sorry to repeat myself. Enterprise value is the value of a company, in the same way as you might value a house. If own a house that is worth £1 million, but it has a £65.000 mortgage. It's enterprise value is £1 million, 1.5 times it's mortgage deb't, but my overall investment (market cap) or equity,is £35,000. £1m minus £65k debt (mortgage), so my debt is almost twice the market cap. M.C.B.'s are more complex, They are mandatory, so vod have to buy the shares back. This is done though a buy back scheme buying back about 6 million shares a month through Goldman Sachs bank. These are then held in treasury by vodafone. These shares have no voting rites, pay no dividend, so are in effect cancelled. This is to stop the dilution of share value due to the issuing of shares to bond holders, which they have to do on the bond expiry dates. It is very complex, but I have explained it as best I can. Share options & incentive schemes to staff management are very different, but are designed as an incentive to those who work for the company to increase productivity & therefore reward them with a higher share price (hopefully) Of course management look after number one (as we all do ) but they do look after shareholders & the company they manage which is of course there job. Nick Read at the end of the day is just human, just done better than most? Perhaps he should go on I'm a celebrity to show his real self, like Matt Han****?
Dan, I've met many clever people over the years and your comments tell me that you don't fit into that category!!! All I can say is that the $45 billion debt pile has become unmanageable in my opinion. You can play with words or bury your head in the sand but the elephant in the room is the collosal debt mountain! Stagnant earnings, inflation, slowing economic growth in most of Vod's markets and debt concerns isn't good. If you think this is going back to 200p any time soon you are living in cloud cuckoo land. The only reason this isn't much lower is large institutional investors holding for the dividend, but this has been slashed from previous levels as stagnant earnings and the huge debt put never ending strain on the balance sheet it appears, hence the rapidly declining SP... Aimho Adyor, but good luck with your Vod strategy!
Hi Danielh,
You keep repeating the same lines about Nick;
"(Nick Read) has a very difficult job"- wow he's the only CEO of a large company that has a difficult job ;-)
" I don't think sacking him will be the answer"- sacking him will bring back the confidence of big investors who have all criticized his failing strategies.
Nick has a sign on his door saying "it's ok to do mistakes". It's not ok though to keep doing f***** mistakes
Nick Read has received an annual compensation of £36.15 million in fiscal 2020-21 as compared with £35.29 million in the previous financial year while Vod has been in constant decline
Nick needs more people like you Dan
Kiom, the Vantage deal kills any short term concern even though there is no short term liquidity issue. Discretionary FCF is holding up and VOD has confirmed €5.1Bn
Vod operational metrics are good and on plan. Debt markets are worrying about high interest rates. As long as the cash keeps trundling in I bet VOD recovers like IMB and BATS.
No need to thank me, did call this for all of you months ago. This will settle around 80p eventually with a cut dividend of just under 5pc. The debt is unsustainable, the company is too granular, the management too poor. What is weird is that even with brexit basket case sterling being worth SFA these days Vod’s foreign currency earnings are not juicing results. Just dire. Another dying ftse 100 company people buy for dividend then lose half their capital.
"aviva were never 7.23 in 2018 best they were 5.09 google graphs are a joke
in 2008 they were above 7"
Admittedly I don't watch Aviva and you're correct that the price wasn't over £7 in 2017/18, but Google appear to have based their calculation on the shares issued/ Market Cap.
Currently Aviva have 2,803,088,170 issued ordinary shares:
https://www.lse.co.uk/rns/AV./total-voting-rights-8m0t5u1yrcj95ka.html
On the 12th May 2018 Aviva's share price was around £5.12 with over 4 Billion issued shares
"At 6pm on 30 May 2018, Aviva plc had 4,005,745,822 issued ordinary shares "
https://www.lse.co.uk/rns/AV./total-voting-rights-may-q5n25aoyqxq9rbn.html
In May 2018 Aviva purchased 1,271,000 shares at an average price of 512.3188p
https://www.lse.co.uk/rns/AV./transaction-in-own-shares-10ox11b639b8h3j.html
So there was around 43% more shares in issue in May 2018, with the price around £5.12 going of the RNS's. If you add 43% onto the May average price of £5.12, you get £7.32. Google have just averaged the price based on the market cap by the looks of things, either way Aviva's price must be down over 30% since May 2018 taking the reduction of shares in issue into account.
Vodafone at below £1 is highly embarrassing for the whole Board. The Chairman, exHeneiken, needs to revive those parts of the company that income is not reaching.
They have not been able to sell their strategy to the market so the Chairman is exposed if he allows the deliverer of the strategy, Read, and who is responsible for the numbers that follow, to survive.
The whole RNS today was couched in very unenthusiastic terms and did not give any real confidence that things will change in the near future.
If the Board is not worried about the level of debt, as a previous poster stated, the market is sure as hell is.
Hi Danielh Sorry can you explain the difference between Enterprise valve & Market Cap and M C B but back, New to investing and I am learning a lot on here, I have just brought in here @ 96p thinking it looked good now having second thoughts. Its only money and you can't take it with you.
Thank you moniman. My last post to you was about your failure to know the difference between enterprise value & market cap (shame on you). nothing to do with the points you have just raised. Please pay attention next time??!! I think we all know by now that vod are having a torrid time, but where, from now? Selling part of the towers, is at least a start to get deb't down, but vod (Nick Read) has a very difficult job, & I don't think sacking him will be the answer. As I have said before, who will replace him. Someone with a magic wand perhaps, hopefully though somebody who at least knows the difference between enterprise value & market cap, & how the M.C.B. buyback works?
'High inflation is the best way to erode the true value of debt hence why the debt pile is not seen as a problem.'
Good point jetcrowts. @10% inflation it will have reduced by 50% over 8 years. In 8 years time, the remaining debt is services at less than2% coupon.
Think the market wanted the vantage cash in 2022 not 2023. It might still hit Q4 though...
Gary. Wow. I care, & I wish I had the spare cash to buy as well. Good luck to L.T.I. Calm down. I am as cheesed off with the big fall as much as anybody, but no need to throw a wobbly!
LTI - No one, not one single person in the whole wild world is interested or cares that you have just brought VOD @ 96p.
Nick needs to go, completely **** CEO
"I sold my entire holding 7 months ago here at 126p because of the debt - the market hates it and it has further to fall imo"
If Vodafone wanted to reduce the debt, they've got the tools to do it. Vodafone are likened to a hedge fund with Telecom assets, they're quite shrewd in their dealings and picked up the whole of Cable & Wireless Worldwide for around £1 Billion 10 years ago. I believe the Mannesmann takeover/merger was an all-stock deal, so the valuation of Mannesmann stock would have been relative to value of Vodafone stock at that time. My point is, Vodafone have been going for decades and have always come good in the end; I don't see any reason why the share price won't recover from the current low valuation, and I suspect the management will have a debt reduction plan. If they were ever desperate to eliminate debt, they could have wiped out their debt as a result of the Verizon Wireless stake sale, but they didn't so I assume it suits them to have debt on the books.
Dan.....This BOD like the last BOD are all out of ideas and anywhere to go due to massive debt pile. This was a reasonably safe dividend play about 3 years ago when the price was over 200p and the debt ratio to valuation was much lower, but a rising debt pile, flat earnings, increasing costs is putting huge presuure on the divi it appears, hence why it was the divi was slashed 2 years back...it's going to be a very very very long slog here for what, a 7% dividend in a 10% inflation environment, with almost zero long term growth judging by todays results? Well that's the way it looks to most here and the market reaction today sums it up. AIMHO ADTOR !.GLA.
The market has today given a clear message that they do not like this Boards strategy and do not see that they can generate any growth in the foreseeable future.
You just need to observe the declining share price over the last few years against a relatively stable FTSE 100 @ 7360. Can Read do deals in the next 6 months to survive, maybe but if I were an activist investor I would be in the Chairman’s ear ensuring he takes the necessary action to ensure his own reputation remains.
at 96p
NR has gone from having 3.5m shares in Feb 20 to over 13m today with virtually no dipping his hand in his pocket.
I presume picked up c10m shares as part of his package over last 2 years.
Bonkers that the board and jnvestors have sat and watched this while destruction of the SP