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tennents
Good points; well made !
Not sure if you caught it in today's FT - JLR are saying hydrogen is the future for their vehicles once there is a clean source of hydrogen. It's only a matter of time - zero cost renewable electricity (already available) with the Stanford method, among others to produce clean H2. Wondering if these methods have been commercialised yet?
Battery vs. fuel cell HAS to be complementary. Pure Battery power means that you can go as far as the range allows, and then no more.
You need to recharge. Which with current technology takes quite a while....a long while!
Imagine living in a street where there's no off road parking. How DO you charge your vehicle so you can use it the next day?
Local lamposts?
Jockeying for the available charge points from lamposts?. It's really a no-go situation.
Meanwhile Hydrogen fuel cell vehicles are very clean and energy complient, but need a wide network of refueling stations. Easy to refil within minutes, but ( at the moment) difficult to find somwhere to refill.
Cue hybrid technology. NO... Not hybrid petrol/battery....
Hybrid battery, with support from fuel cells.
Range extenders...
Use your EV but ensure you can achieve the range by employing fuel cell technology.
By hydrogen power, or LPG power, or offshore ethane (natural gas) power. This is where Ceres holds all the cards.
Flexible technology. Carbon generating natural fuels or clean hydrogen all get a "can do" from Ceres.
There's so much in the press about EV but there's no real analysis of the implications.
That's why my investments are in EV and Fuel Cells.......
Goldfrat
How many batteries do you think are needed to power a 100,000 tonne container ship…..what weight and what physical capacity? Shipping is one of the worst carbon offenders and one of the most essential services…..not forgetting trains, heavy commercial vehicles a nd high power consumption vehicles eg used in mining.
There are applications where batteries are the standout choice eg cars. However, while that looks great at the moment there are two difficult issues emerging that need to be addressed. The first is secure sourcing of the vast quantities of scarce raw materials. The second is the capacity of the electric grid systems in pretty much every country in the world to cope with the demand increase as oil / gas / coal are displaced. Even small scale industrial charging applications draw huge power.
Glasgow buses have just announced a pilot at one of their depots in the city for 100 or so busses they are taking delivery of. Not made much of in the announcement was the special work that had to be done by Scottish Power to power it. They are a commercial partner in the project so could push this through, but how will that work when there are potentially dozens/ hundreds of similar locations required all pulling significant load from the grid?
Happily people like AFC are offering alternatives such as ammonia powered fuel cells for stand alone or micro grid power solutions ie using hydrogen to power applications such as charging batteries.
This is a ‘yes and….’, rather than an ‘either or…’ game. But the fact that giga scale hydrogen will be produced in low demand locations and then shipped or pipelined thousands of miles takes you towards hydrogen being a massive future global industry regardless of how far/fast batteries develop.
Back both !
My concern is that converting spare electricity to hydrogen and then back again is much less efficient than using batteries. I've been holding Ceres shares for some time and enjoyed the ride, but the constant improvement in battery technology and the reduction in their costs does make me wonder whether hydrogen in the electricity grid is going to be taken up to any significant degree. I understand that green hydrogen has a place in manufacturing processes, so the new electrolyser development strategy is welcome, but will the fuel cell side prove disappointing as this whole renewable energy landscape matures?
It's a speculative buy, but if this technology is proven to cost effective then the sky is the limit. To make the green revolution viable you need a solution on how to storage the energy generated for future use. Ceres maybe that solution. I purchased yesterday. For a wider exposure to this market consider BATG an ETF
Let’s remind ourselves of a basic investment principle: that once you have bought a stock on the basis of a clearly articulated investment case rooted in evidence, you do not sell it unless something changes in that investment case – either in the business itself or in the environment in which it operates – or unless its valuation rises above what you consider rational.
The latter consideration doesn’t arise here. Let’s see what has changed at the company, and in the world in which it operates, since our tip.
“Operationally, Ceres Power remains on track,” said Matt Evans, manager of Ninety One’s UK Sustainable Equity and UK Smaller Companies funds, whose significant holding in the company prompted our tip.
“Its partners, principally Bosch and Doosan, a Korean conglomerate, are building factories to make fuel cells to Ceres Power’s design, which will generate licence payments when various milestones are reached and then a royalty on every unit sold once production starts. Some smaller deals have also been signed. Commercially its position in fuel cells is stronger now than it was in January.”
But since our tip the company has added another string to its bow: it is developing an electrolysis product. Electrolysis is the use of electricity to break water down into hydrogen and oxygen. This is the precise reverse of what fuel cells, Ceres’s original product, do and an electrolysing cell is in essence the same as a fuel cell, although the design is modified in minor ways.
Electrolysis offers the chance to fill a critical gap in the power systems of the future: a convenient means to store energy. If, say, you generate too much power from solar cells on a summer’s day, assuming we ever see them again, you use it to electrolyse water and produce hydrogen, which is then stored until it is used in a fuel cell to generate electricity – at night, for example.
As we transition to a modern, green energy system, many see hydrogen as a very good way to store it,” Evans said. “Ceres is now working with partners to see if its fuel cells can be adapted for this purpose. The use of hydrogen in other industries – in the decarbonisation of steel production, for example – could also reduce the firm’s dependence on energy.” He said the firm had not articulated this aspect of its strategy until March, so it was not part of our original investment case.
So what is the rational thing to do now? Seen simply as a business, Ceres is in a better position now than it was in January. When we look at it as an investment we have to consider the changed appetite for growth stocks.
“I remain comfortable that if it delivers on its targets its valuation in a few years’ time will look reasonable,” Evans said. “I don’t think the shares have priced in the full scale of the opportunity.” He added: “I am more confident about Ceres than I was in January. Evans has backed his words with actions: he took part in a share sale by Ceres in March at £10.60.