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Seaangler, the answer to your earlier question is addressed 28 minutes into today's presentation recording.
https://www.investormeetcompany.com/investor/meeting/interim-results-36
Seaangler, sorry I didn't respond earlier I was in another part of the forest.
In terms of the varition in price per MW of electrolyser in the various "sales" figures. There are some specific reasons
1) The JV confuses the figures
2) I assume as we move towards larger units I guess the price of each MW goes down. We are moving out of the smaller units for research and into the units for Production of H2
3) The element of "planning engineering" required will be much the same for a small unit as a big unit as would be the support and monitoring services
Someone today mentioned the lack of focus on ShareHolder value by the presentation. I'm not surprised. They are technologists not business men and right now with the SP in free fall they would be idiots to offer any comments. After all what can they appart from sell more.
See my usual boring comments about Shell, Linde, SNAM are ITM's sales force and they are failing.
There was one slightly worrying piece of info in today's presentation which I don't think is specifically mentioned in the report (correct me if you find it). The revenue from the 33-50MW full year production is not anticipated until Q4 2022. That means it won't even hit the books by next January's Half Year Results report. So the best we can hope for is tales of moving from negotiation into contract and actual MW production numbers, but the financial bottom line is not even going to show progress this time next year. I can understand why a lot are getting cold feet. It's a slow burn. In more established businesses I'm pretty sure that information would have been treated as a profit warning.
Thanks Toneman. So really it is comparing different things. They should qualify their share of the transactions somehow.. I would have been strung up (in a previous life) if I’d put this ‘quality’ of information out.
Seaangler, they answered the question which will subsequently be available via the recording an the q&a written responses. To paraphrase...the difference in financial return is down to the volume and product mix. The smaller MW typically from older quotes includes more balance of plant revenue, whereas (I guess) the larger quotes are installed through the ILE partnership so ITM are claiming a greatly reduced share. To be fair you'd better listen to the direct answer when the recording is available in a day or two, in case my interpretation is rubbish. I'm certainly going to have to listen to it again.
I thought the ILE partnership was a 50-50 ownership (I need to check that). So if there is profit to be made from the installation phase couldn't a share of that be attributed to ITM? IF not, who is getting it?
It seems roughly comparable with a recent NEL press release https://nelhydrogen.com/press-release/nel-asa-receives-purchase-order-for-20mw-alkaline-electrolyser-from-ovako/
at Euro11M/20MW .. £460000/MW equivalent
Not quite an apples to apples comparison though.
Hi Radius. Absolutely right , I realised that but the drop in price would have to be incredible in which case we definitely need an explanation. It would also question the viability of the business as a whole perhaps?
Seaangler there might be a 3 in your list of reasons.
The cost per Mw may have been reduced to become more competitive & win more order's?
Just thinking out loud.
R
Still posting a gross loss. A worry with the new orders, hope these are at better prices. Would be good to start seeing revenue move forward, it has been highlighting order book, order backlog for too many years now
Another thing I don't understand motive Where's that gone ? Didn't see it mentioned
The investor? Aire should be great
Just seen a someone on the adv board is asking them to buy back everyone's shares at 400 lol There's some seriously deluded posters over there But that is my itm post of the year.
At least I wasn't the only one confused then
It looks like we're getting very little
The revenue is ridiculously low
......AND..... more importantly looking forward , which is nearer the truth?
Thanks ToneM. Sorry to go on about this but please stress the anomaly here. They have gone from an average £826k per MW to just £343k per MW. To my mind this means either 1) They are comparing apples with hand grenades and should explain pronto rather than confuse people or 2) Someone has screwed up. I’m leaning towards the latter.....
I've made a note to ask it this afternoon, but there's no guarantee it will be a selected question.
Thanks Tone. If I was around I would. Will drop them an email though if it doesn’t get addressed this afternoon. It’s a pretty obvious item.
Seaangler, you can ask through the InvestorMeets platform this afternoon. Otherwise it might be worth a direct email. They're pretty good at responding to emails.
Looking at the figures again , I really can’t see any explanation other than a ****erel up. The difference , 16% to 179% is simply massive. We need an explanation. Even if recent negotiations have been at lower prices the % reduction is away with the fairies. Maybe they are understating the £’s. How do we ask them?
I think the analysts call meeting might be softening the reaction a little.
The pricing anomaly was pointed out a while ago. Not sure we came up with an answer though from memory I think Bilbs had a dash at it. Bilbs?
aandi, thanks for your input re JV. I am surprised that a nearly 3x increase in "MW sales" leads to only a 16% increase in revenue. I'm must be missing something as I don't think that is good!
Will there be a reaction after the Analysts call meeting?
It's a pity there has to be secrecy around the new ammonia project. I bet it's a massive opportunity. Linde recently announced a big project in South Africa. Do we think this order is directly related? I suspect it is. If the sp is dropping just because of the expected low financials, then once again they're completely missing the bigger picture.
Hi Markbantam, I can't fully explain the reason for the large difference between MW pipeline and revenue £. Is there a Joint Venture agreement where ITM build the electrolysers for another company and share the profits? Or it could also be partly related to economies of scale, the price for larger units is forecast to come down over time ass per this article- https://www.rechargenews.com/energy-transition/green-hydrogen-itm-power-s-new-gigafactory-will-cut-costs-of-electrolysers-by-almost-40-/2-1-948190
Burn the shorters. Just topped up at 245p.
Thank you shorters et al.