Member Info for Looed

I hit post too soon - 1 more to add

"Ukraine’s Foreign Ministry responds to Georgia’s actions due to Saakashvili’s statements"
https://112.international/politics/ukraines-foreign-ministry-responds-to-georgias-actions-due-to-saakashvilis-statements-52131.html

Seems something is afoot -

"Ukrainian Ambassador: Saakashvili is not an official in Ukraine or part of the executive branch; he is a native Georgian and he will never stop being a Georgian"
https://www.interpressnews.ge/en/article/107868-ukrainian-ambassador-saakashvili-is-not-an-official-in-ukraine-or-part-of-the-executive-branch-he-is-a-native-georgian-and-he-will-never-stop-being-a-georgian

Zelensky ‘unafraid’ Saakashvili may oppose him
https://agenda.ge/en/news/2020/1847

Triumph1 - would your contact who can speak Georgian be able to help in a quick search for the above document that Mole wants to find?

Mole - maybe you can give some hints on where to look and what the document might look like or be called, as I presume Triumph1's contact won't have any experience with this type of thing.

Just an idea, thanks.

That last bit should read "lets see how folks respond here"

I just emailed Puddy and hopefully we soon get a system in place so we can use the Fund (now GBP2,422) and give transparency.

I don't think it's practical that we ask the Board for the OK each and every time we want something done. I have also been thinking of a quick way to get a majority view on things for when we do need to discuss / vote on something.

We have no idea what the volume of work will be or when it might start. So I have tried to accommodate as many options as possible. Each case might be unique so these are general proposals, possibly overthought.

Instead of asking "Are we OK with this?" every time and have everyone reply and clog up the board, I will send a brief proposal message i.e. "Do we want to use the fund to help welloiled translate documents", (I know he doesn't thus far). I will then send a "recommend this post if you agree" and another post where you can disagree. If anyone wants to make a comment they can reply in the original proposal post.

Majority vote wins though 'losers' can always make an appeal if they feel passionately about something. If we have multiple dissenting views on an issue then maybe we will need an arbitration panel of our own who can have final say on the issue.

As we may have 1 or more members lurking in the background with ulterior motives, if any vote looks dodgy - maybe we vote No to something that should be an easy Yes - we might do a roll call and count votes that way (unlikely but we never know)

Voting will be open for a full 24 hour cycle based on UK time. Anyone can make a proposal to get things rolling.

I think we should "pre-approve" the translation of the following -

1- Any media that's spoken, not text based, so everything from TV through to Youtube. We can get the translator to leave out the parts non-FRR related and equally include comments from GOGC etc that are present but we couldn't identify them.

2- What seems to be new / major newspaper interview or reporting. Though we might end up with something close to a Google Translate version, it will hopefully take out the ambiguity.

3- Typically, after a major news site release, the article will be shared, rebranded and reformatted across multiple platforms. We can collect these, Google Translate them to see if they are just repeats or if they are taking the story in a different direction. I propose we translate the "different direction" articles as they may contain new information.

Unless someone can provide cheaper quotes we will use upwork.com (US$110 vs US$456) and we will see how pricing on our future projects go. Transparency is easy on that site. I should be able to invite an overseer to join any project so they can see all discussions and payment details.

If we have multiple projects on the go I will keep a work sheet updated and post it here as needed.

Please share any thoughts, ideas and suggestions. I won't send a proposal post as too many things to cover, lets see how fol

Its still early but I cant see anything PDF related

Lots of warm soundbites in the following article, i.e. "... Ambassador Degnan said the two countries undoubtedly remain strong strategic partners. "I know that the US is looking for ways to work with Georgia and we will continue to take many initiatives with the country, because we believe in future and success of Georgia", Ambassador Degnan said.""
https://agenda.ge/en/news/2020/1841

Fallout from the letter from the 13 Congreemen. This "low level document" has generated some high level reactions

Irakli Kobakhidze terms report of American congressmen as "low-ranking document” and 13 congressmen as "lobbyists of the National Movement"
https://www.interpressnews.ge/en/article/107860-irakli-kobakhidze-terms-report-of-american-congressmen-as-low-ranking-document-and-13-congressmen-as-lobbyists-of-the-national-movement

"Gia Volski on U.S congressmen’s report: I think that one of the sentences in the document is a result of a well-organized, aggressive lobbyism" (Volski is First Deputy Speaker)
https://www.interpressnews.ge/en/article/107863-gia-volski-on-us-congressmens-report-i-think-that-one-of-the-sentences-in-the-document-is-a-result-of-a-well-organized-aggressive-lobbyism

"Foreign Minister says document signed by "very respectable Republicans" has no any political force"
https://www.interpressnews.ge/en/article/107862-foreign-minister-says-document-signed-by-very-respectable-republicans-has-no-any-political-force

Russia also has a CV-spin on its relations with Georgia.

"Russia urges Georgia to make use of cooperation experience during pandemic"
https://tass.com/politics/1166969

And, just to annoy the GD even more -

"Saakashvili calls on Georgian opposition to unite before elections"
https://www.kyivpost.com/ukraine-politics/saakashvili-calls-on-georgian-opposition-to-unite-before-elections.html

Puddy - I just emailed you

I put this 'code' in the message - Everything Is Everything

Thanks ODR - appreciated. I added that you had agreed to the reporting and the reason why.

Its my night time now so if anyone else makes a similar offer today can you somebody help to make the report. Please add that the poster has agreed to the reporting - cheers

StarRage - all done and I mentioned in each one that you agreed to be reported and the reason why.

Thanks again

StarRage - thanks for agreeing, appreciated.

It was me who go the reply from the Board that in general terms there would be no consequence to publication, but they did add a "subject to the actual terms of the case involved" so we don't have the full picture.

Thats why until we do have handle on whatever is going on here, we should be cautious in printing "proof" of what we might be talking about.

I will look at your post history and get the times and let you know when done

Wazza10 - until we know what we are dealing with I feel we should restrict the ability for others to take and twist what might be real or fake. Talk about it yes, but not give others access that might potentially be damaging.

Mills240 - I think it was around 4, maybe 5 posters who shared and luckily it was snippets rather than pages and pages. Thats why I think we can easily manage if the posters chose to agree (and they are under no obligation to)

The following is not in any way intended to prevent anyones right to say or post whatever they choose.

As we know, the publishing of the PDF was a leak. We can only wonder why we have been targeted. Some of us have read it, some have chosen to stay well away, a few have cut and pasted a few bits to illustrate various points.

As said by many, it is possible the report and our cutting and pasting - limited though that has been - could be a way to get the details out into the open and we take the blame for that.

I have two proposals

1- We no longer cut and paste from the PDF. We can continue to discuss any and all aspects of the PDF but we don't back it up with parts of the document - that way its just us summarising and theorising. Think of it as "doing a Zaza"

2- The link to the document was probably live for about 12 hours and overnight in UK (i think) so it might not have been picked up by the other boards, they can only take what we are posting - maybe they cannot access the file if its only been shared here.

3- Which leads to my dramatic proposal. To the few posters who cut and pasted the PDF - how would you feel about having those specific posts reported and we try to have them taken down. We can still talk about them, just remove the direct link that might be used outside of our chats. Not meant to insult anyone or question anyones motives - just think its safer if anything directly from the PDF is removed. Not trying to stop any discussion about the PDF itself.

4- If we report a post what happens - its just removed without any consequence to the poster?

5- I would only report a poster who agrees with the motivation and is happy for us to try and have the specific post removed, and is also comfortable that there would be no further action taken outside of a post removal. No chance of a ban etc.

6- If anyone agrees (and I will understand if no one does) can you make your self known and advise the time of your post. I will report it and let you know once its done)

I am really not trying to pressure anyone - just trying to prevent us potentially shooting ourselves in the foot.

Thirteen American congressmen made a statement on the “involvement of the richest man in Georgia,” the leader of the ruling “Georgian Dream” Bidzina Ivanishvili, in “destabilization in Georgia in favor of Russia” and called him “close ally” of President Vladimir Putin, the newspaper VZGLYAD reports in Tbilisi.
The Georgian opposition enthusiastically comments on this position expressed several months before the parliamentary elections to be held in October.
One of the leaders of “European Georgia” Sergi Kapanadze called this statement of the congressmen “a sentence”, noting that the leader of the ruling party was called “the conductor of Russian interests in Georgia”.
“The position of our strategic partners, the Americans, shows that Bidzina Ivanishvili is leading the country to collapse,” said the opposition leader, who expressed hope that the opposition would win the election.
The ruling party has not yet commented on this statement, but supporters of the “Georgian Dream” on social networks sharply criticize these congressmen, calling them lobbyists of the American companies Frontera Resources and Conti Group, who lost their jobs in Georgia.
In the social networks of American congressmen called on "to deal with the problems of their own country" and considered their position in relation to Georgia "shameful."

https://news.rambler.ru/usa/44328232-amerikanskie-kongressmeny-nazvali-ivanishvili-soyuznikom-putina/

Thanks Mole - I will keep trying to find the termination notice. The GOGC statements did seem to go from 99% to 100% and back to 99% but that's a big assumption on our part.

Funnily enough I just posted some USA-For-Georgia articles. We haven't seen any explicit reaction to the letter sent to Pompeo etc but I don't know if the sending of the letter is action enough, and of course no recent FRR specific mentions from the USA as you point out.

forgot the link - https://commersant.ge/ge/post/sergi-kapanadze-amerikeli-kongresmenebis-moxseneba-ganachenia

According to Sergi Kapanadze, one of the leaders of European Georgia, the document of the American Congressmen is a verdict for Ivanishvili. According to him, it is inconceivable that a person with whom Georgia's strategic partners have such an attitude will continue to run the country.

"This is not the first time that congressmen and our partners have made such harsh assessments, but this report is a verdict. In practice, they have said that Bidzina Ivanishvili is pursuing Russia's interests in Georgia and undermining the country. This verdict must be carried out by the Georgian people in the October elections, because it is completely unthinkable for a person to continue to be ruled by a country towards which our strategic partners have such an attitude. It is clear who the West supports and who it does not support, and it is clear that Ivanishvili's policy has led to a complete collapse, one of the manifestations of which is this very disturbing and very sharp report, ”Kapanadze said.

For example, the newly published US National Security Strategy, signed by 13 US congressmen, states that "Georgia's richest man, Bidzina Ivanishvili, who is a close ally of Putin, is involved in destabilizing Georgia in Russia's favor."

"US Congressmen: Bidzina Ivanishvili, a close ally of Putin, is involved in destabilizing Georgia" https://www.interpressnews.ge/en/article/107853-us-congressmen-bidzina-ivanishvili-a-close-ally-of-putin-is-involved-in-destabilizing-georgia

U.S. Congressmen: Congress should continue to work to strengthen Georgia’s readiness and defense capabilitieshttps://www.interpressnews.ge/en/article/107856-us-congressmen-congress-should-continue-to-work-to-strengthen-georgias-readiness-and-defense-capabilities/

sorry for double post - i thought the first one didn't post as couldn't see it so re-wrote it again.

Pophead - yes I wondered about the same thing. I am only active on this BB - do you or others know if the registration for other boards is more rigorous, and do they allow links to be posted?

I did post as have others that it could be a plant. We cut, paste and share away. The Press, GOGC etc cannot reveal the results directly but can say "Shareholders reveal ZM lied all along" type thing. It sounds bizarre I know but we are perfect targets because we are the only ones researching and discussing FRR.

Pophead - i was wondering the same thing. I am only active on this board. Are the registration details on other sites more rigorous than LSE?

I do think - as others have posted - that its been sent to us in the hope we will cut, paste and share away so the press, other agencies can remain hands-off as its confidential but report "FRR shareholders have revealed ZM lied all along" type of thing. It sounds crazy but we are pretty much the only people discussing FRR so we are ideal targets.