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Indeed I am a shareholder on a small scale and all I know about this company and others I it's sector is what I can glean from the web. I have sided with moneybags in his beliefs opinions on the future of coal in the uk . With regards to Hsp I would like to be positive as indeed I bought in at the wrong time when the price was much higher. Maybe if I heard that the company was planning to develop some of the land it owns into housing or commercial property developments I would feel some comfort that I might get my money back. I am sitting on paper losses in various companies in this sector and wish that raw materials prices would recover to give these companies like Hsp a chance but like moneybags I just can't see it.
I am with you again moneybags in what you say on hargreaves and the future of coal. Look at the main board of the company and who has opencast mining experience let alone deep mine. The only ones are a guy called dougan and From my research it appears dougan hasn't been involved in opencast mining for 20 years .the Scottish companies that failed in Scotland with much higher coal prices and lower transport costs and the welsh ones in wales were old school hardened tough nosed men who worked 70 hour weeks 6 days a week and failed. Hargreaves are new school low risk taking white collar health and safety over conscious English dudes out of their comfort zone. Ten only people who will benefit in wales are the welsh tower miners who did a Great bit of business with a desperate plc that needed positive growth and strategy news to appease institutional investors. Bev 88 is correct though moneybags on the fact that no clear energy strategy in the uk will lead to shortages at peak times in the near future . IMO companies go one of two ways up or down they do not stand still and hargreaves has been standing still for too long now both in terms of news and share price
Moneybags right again . I have solar panels and get a really good rate of return and my bill has halved and they take no looking after. Defo the way forward. On hargreaves you are also correct. These story 5 years ago was expansion into Europe now where are we thee out of Belgium badly burned distanced ourselves from German operation and off we go to Hong Kong. It's a story with no substance. The open casting is a time buyer, monckton has no secure fuel supply long term out of renewables transport that they started from has gone nowhere in recent years. If you listen to what they say in the newsletter etc and read between the lines they are currently standing still which in real terms only goes one way
30 years ago this month since the miners strike started the demise of uk coal industry. It's not rocket science to work out that based on Sefton chase 47 quid ara Rotterdam coal is never gonna work even with a mix of opencast and deep mine. Look at the share price of drax power over last 12 months and you can see who is benefitting from cheap coal . I can't see coal becoming expensive in the short or medium term and long term the industry is finished. Look what's happened in last 30 years.
Right again moneybags our friend bev 88 is not reading between the lines on Hsp. It's an amazing acheivement to start as a bulk transport company to evolve into what it has but who made that happen? The current management Or people who have sold up and retired or moved on. Mr banham has been left holding the baby, yes he is very wealthy in his own right but how does he now get out himself and sell the remainder of his stock? He has to deliver a pipeline of probably 3 years guaranteed growth numbers in both sales a nd profit and give good reason why at such a young age he wants out health is usually a good one. Can Hsp do that and who takes the reins as the old guard all gone a new CEO from a completely different background appointed by the city. The industry they operate in is old school. There are no books or manuals on how to run bulk tippers or sell coal it's in the blood and that's why it's a company from the north east that is trying to be the last man standing. The management team that transformed it from transport to today need to do the same again and transform from coal other logistics/energy whatever or reverse into something big before it's too late and I don't think this management team has demonstrated their ability to do that it's a huge task and messing about in opencast is a last ditch attempt at buying more timekeeping paid big money for tinkering with shareholders investments. Best days unfortunately IMO are behind this company. Right again moneybags hansa trust has bailed out. Last I have to say on this company wonder what the founder and the fd that built this thing are upto? They were the real clever ones
Right again moneybags. IMO the Scottish coal thing had to be done to be seen to be doing something they looked at UkCoal and walked away Belgium was an embarrassment nothing big was really happening and the other thing to factor in is what will happen in Scotland if the independence vote goes through, I would hate to think I was an English plc be holding to Alex salmon and his cronies. I'm with you moneybags there are too many headwinds for coal economically geopolitically and the last candle maker survived when electricity was invented because he made the best candles. I don't think Hsp are the best opencast coal operator in the world not to mention Britain, how many sites have they mined successfully and restored fully answer is none and if they have got their expertise and personnel from the likes of uK coal we'll say no more
Fair point bev 88 let's hope that you are right and history doesn't repeat itself,as for the mbo team if you look historically they were all bit part players with the exception of the fd and the founder who alongside banham held big share holdings, i wonder how much of the acquisition drive that happened between the mbo and the fd and the founder leaving was driven by them and how much was down to banham , one will probably never know but I feel that there hasn't been a lot of positive in this co to shout about in recent years
Mrs moneybags bang on. Drax is the biggest user of coal in the uk and they have just done a deal where they are going to be importing enormous volumes of biomass into immingham thus displacing coal, firstly hargreaves don't appear to do much with drax on the coal front they receive trains from port of Tyne where another small company does all the port work in hargreaves back yard and secondly drax and abp at immingham do everything themselves with no need for hargreaves services, the writing is on the wall unless they grow some balls and make a big deal happen IMO.
This isanother UK COAL. Back in 1994 Richard budge bought what was left of English coal and people said he paid way over the odds. In 1997 rub mining made 275m profit and he was king of the world. Several years later he got sacked because he had not exploited his window of opportunity to take the company to the next level by reversing into something much bigger or making a huge acquisition because the board all had snouts in trough and wanted to take the safe path take little risk and protect the share price. Where are they today ? Board all ousted Richard budge bankrupt and the company share price has collapsed and they sit on a massive land bank in England. So hargreaves have a land bank in Scotland . IMO hap are following the same path as UKC . All the people who built Hsp from nothing all probably gone retired or pushed out and plc people in charge who take little risk and consequently little reward. They claim to have the biggest bulk fleet in the country but that is nonsense now as it's almost all subcontractors I believe who will like rats jump ship if the economy improves and better work elsewhere , the tanker business has stood still if not gone backwards, monckton has no long term future or contract positions, the garbage about Hong Kong is just a good story to appease the city, it's probably half a dozen men running around a power station preaching health and safety *******s.if they can't succeed in Germany or Belgium then why succeed in Asia? Redcar will close soon if steel prices keep falling, the rain will keep falling in wales and Scotland as it always has so the only real positive I see is the redevelopment of maltby colliery site and it will need a bowmer Kirkland type to do that as Hsp certainly don't have the people IMO to be property developers as is the same case in UKC and hence look where they are . Hsp are ten years behind UKC on the curve.
Couldn't help but say the dialogue between moneybags and bev 88 is compelling,both make sense but take a step back and look at it without believing the 6 monthly update bull****. Look at what they did in 3 years from the 2004 mbo. Maltby monckton immingham Germany norec and the list goes on. What have they done since 2008? Milk the demise of UK Coal to support coals sales blending away fines from maltby that had been there for years. Expansion into Europe Belgium a farce and they are distancing themselves from the German op. Renewables too complex so they out of that now ,at redcar in bed with Thailand steel who will cut and run if steel prices keep falling having just got rid of chief exec who they brought on board to pioneer it's relaunch. Hargreaves will not at some point get paid most likely. So what are they pinning hopes on for growth, open casting in Scotland and Wales. So the scots couldn't make it work in Scotland and the welsh in wales but the Geordies can. They will blame the weather logistics whatever but it hasn't worked in the past for a good reason when coal prices were much higher. This company is living off the fat of years gone by and milking it for all they can at the highest level.
This is the beginning of the end for this stock. The company was hugeley aggressive until 2007 and then stopped for whatever reason. UK coal didnt sell them maltby to make them money. They knew but HSP could not do without due to Monckton cokeworks. They have lived off the strategy that was established 5 years ago and now due to an inability to take it to the next level. If the production dirctor was anygood would UK COAL have let him go.It also doesnt help that the stock is not particularly dilutive in terms it is held by a few investment cos and management